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An incident in Florida brings up a point

Discussion in 'Carry Issues' started by liberty addict, Dec 10, 2011.

  1. liberty addict

    liberty addict

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    This happened about a year ago in Florida:

    http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/01/12/fla-jogger-wont-charged-shooting-teen/

    The article doesn't speak to the issue of any preponderance of force (like if the teen that attacked the jogger was large and muscular); all it talks about is Florida's Stand Your Ground law.

    I bring it up here because I have seen many refer to the idea that if you shoot an unarmed person, YOU will be in trouble. Apparently in Florida, not necessarily.

    I know the anti-gunners have been wailing and screaming about Florida's law on this for years, I was wondering what others think about this incident.
     
  2. pizza_pablo

    pizza_pablo USN Retired

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    Last edited: Dec 10, 2011

  3. liberty addict

    liberty addict

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    I saw no place in that link that discussed this particular incident; although it did address various incidents and Florida law. But mostly that link is talking about road rage, a whole different thing from being attacked while jogging.
     
  4. Gray_Rider

    Gray_Rider

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    Hummmm...I don't have all the particulars here, but a guy is out jogging well after dark. Not a wise choice in my books, but it's his choice. He is attacked and punched in the face by someone who wasn't there taking in the evening breeze.

    Let me think about this....seems someone got not only what they deserved, but they got what they proabably intended to give said innocent jogger. Who, by the way children, was minding his business and harming no one.

    Too bad. So sad. Case closed.

    Glad this didn't happen in any of the People's Republic states or cities. The case of a certain Mr. Fish comes to mind... The jogger would be behind bars. And, about now, would be going to court for murder or at least manslaughter, and for having the unmidigated temerity to carry a firearm and for harming a poor defensless criminal who attacked him.

    There's a reason I live in Fla. the so called "gunshine state".

    Gray_Rider
    Deo Vindice!

    Unreconstructed.
    For a reason.
     
  5. pizza_pablo

    pizza_pablo USN Retired

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    You got me there.
    I was referring to the many comments regarding shooting someone that was unarmed, but posing a threat of or actually committing physical harm.
    I did this in response to the OP's second and third paragraphs.
     
  6. PawDog

    PawDog NRA Member

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    The shooter in this specific incident is/was a GT member, but I don't recall his user name. He addressed this incident thoroughly when it occurred, and after the case was adjudicated.
     
  7. xmanhockey7

    xmanhockey7

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    The way I see it someone came out and attacked him. It wasn't him and another guy in an argument that got into a fist fight, he was attacked. If I were him I'd be in fear for my life or serious bodily harm because I don't know what the person who is attacking me is planning on doing. As far as I know this crazy SOB has a gun or knife of his own. I'd use mine before he got to use his.
     
  8. Cavalry Doc

    Cavalry Doc MAJ (USA Ret.)

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    Some of us are getting old. I'm too old, and have a lot of unapparent miles on the odometer from past injuries to think about taking a beat down. I have neck issues, that if I were to take a heavy blow to the head, could lead to long term serious disability.

    My plan is to avoid conflict, if that fails, keep it verbal only. If that fails, retreat. If that fails, then I'll try to halt the altercation with the least amount of force necessary.

    Odds are, it won't get that far. I'm pretty good at de-escalation.
     
  9. Mr. Blandings

    Mr. Blandings

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    His Glocktalk handle is "Z28ricer".

    Extensive discussion here: http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1304465&page=2 (Z28ricer begins to chime in on page 2).
     
  10. NEOH212

    NEOH212 Diesel Girl

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    If the jogger was attacked and didn't start the fight, more power to him.

    The laws in all states need to be this way. Even if it doesn't make criminals think twice before they do stupid things, they certainly won't have to worry about thinking about anything ever again.

    It sounds like wonderpunk got what he deserved.

    As someone else on this forum always says, "Play stupid games, win stupid prizes."

    If wonderpunk didn't want to get shot, he shouldn't have started a fight. It's that simple.

    My ending comment on the matter... ... ...


    Oh well.
     
  11. liberty addict

    liberty addict

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    Thanks for the link Mr. Blandings, I read all of that and it was quite good.
    Also the article about it that I posted never even mentioned a 2nd attacker (talk about yellow journalism), so in my view Z28ricer did just great!
     
  12. Carrys

    Carrys Inquisitive

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    That sir is a darn good point that isn't made here very often.

    Some of us are getting older, although I'm not all that old...I am however due to my military wounds and other illnesses, MS being the biggest, unable to engage in any sort of "fight" like I used to. I used to be rather spry and able to take care of myself in hand to hand combat. No longer, just the way it is now a days.

    If someone were to simply grab me, they could do a lot of damage, even death if the right hit or knock down is taken by me. So I assume every "hands on" type of situation is life threatening to/for me. And I will react accordingly, take the most appropriate measures to prevent it, and do what I must to stop it from happening at all.

    It's not my concern if the person who attempts such an attack knows that or not. Either he should or he shouldn't be doing it at all. I make darn sure I give no one a reason to want to fight me these days. If a person decides to fight me, rob me, or simply "man handle" me........it can all cause my death it anything goes wrong. Even if it doesn't cause death, it could easily cause grave harm to me. My bones are much more brittle today than they were just 5 years ago.


    Every self defense situation I'm forced into could very well be a life or death situation for me now. I will not hesitate to prevent that by any means I have at hand.........and I always, always make sure I have the means necessary at hand to live through whatever may happen.

    I can live with being on trial if it comes to that......live being the operative word there.
     
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2011
  13. SCmasterblaster

    SCmasterblaster Millennium Member

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    Only four of his eight shots hit his attacker at contact distance. This alone is a minor miracle. How could he miss so many times? At contact distance? He is lucky that none of his stray shots hit anything valuable or living.
     
    Last edited: Dec 21, 2011
  14. Mr. Blandings

    Mr. Blandings

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    As I recall (no, I'm not going to go back and read the threads that I already linked above right now) Z28ricer (the victim who was attacked) had his bell rung pretty good by his attacker's initial "sucker punch" to the face.

    The pistol involved was a Kimber Ultra-carry with nightsights and Laser Grips., but I don't recall if Z28ricer has ever stated if he saw his sights or his laser dot while firing.

    Nonetheless, hit & dazed he drew and engaged at contact distance on a dynamically moving threat in the dark and landed 50% hits. I believe that's twice as good as the often quoted 25% hit ratio for law enforcement shootings, and it was unquestionably good enough to stop the attack. No innocents were wounded and there was no reported property damage cited in the available information.
     
  15. John Rambo

    John Rambo Raven

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    He was also a member of a Tampa site I frequent, a lot of people there knew him. Actually knew him. He wasn't the most likable guy to some, but he absolutely wasn't guilty of anything.
     
  16. John Rambo

    John Rambo Raven

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    Not really. The attackers were a couple of underage kids.
     
  17. Ahmid

    Ahmid CLM

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    I have seen some of these under age kids around the neighborhood. They are big and strong enough to rip my arms out of the sockets and beat me half to death with them...
     
  18. zbusdriver

    zbusdriver

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    Try not to over estimate your people-skills ---- EVERY ONE OF US can get sucker punched or blindsided. :upeyes:
     
  19. JuneyBooney

    JuneyBooney

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    I agree. :cool:
     
  20. zbusdriver

    zbusdriver

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    Who cares about valuable objects? He is lucky to be alive...what part of this do you not understand? :upeyes: