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9X25 Loading Data

Discussion in '10mm Reloading Forum' started by MCNETT, Mar 9, 2004.


  1. _The_Shadow

    _The_Shadow
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    Went to the range finally and was a little disappointed. These are the results of the loads fired from the S&W 1006 with the Bar-Sto 5" 9X25 Dillon conversion.

    I too might need to do some die adjusting as it appeared the shoulder moved forward some.

    Shot over a CHRONY 8' to the first screen.

    9X25 Dillon April 1, 2009
    15’ above sea level, 70°
    ZERO 121 gr 0.0356” JHP
    H-110 14.2 grains
    Winchester LP primer

    Shot # velocity
    1 1157 fps
    2 1169 fps…High
    3 1135 fps…Low
    4 1146 fps
    Adv…1152 fps
    ES…33.24
    SD…14.59
    A little disappointed with this loading, needs more development.
    Blue Dot will be my next work up.



    9X25 Dillon April 1, 2009
    15’ above sea level, 70°
    LEE 122 grain Cast TC
    Blue Dot 11.0grains
    Winchester LP primer

    Shot # velocity
    1 1314 fps
    2 1334 fps
    3 1367 fps…High
    4 1308 fps…Low
    5 1323 fps
    6 1352 fps
    7 1347 fps
    8 1350 fps
    9 1355 fps
    Adv…1339 fps
    ES…58.69
    SD…20.17
    This load was starting load for 357 Sig 125gr for 1416 fps, I think there is room for improvement.
     

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  2. GLOCKG21

    GLOCKG21
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    I just got a lee 2-cavity bullet mold (124gr tc tumble lube)and casted some.i put them on my rcbs scale and they ranged from 129gr to 131gr.so i should use 10.5 of aa#9 for a start load?.lee molds seem to be a little on the heavy side
    Ken
     

    #42 GLOCKG21, Apr 30, 2009
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2009
  3. _The_Shadow

    _The_Shadow
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    According to the Lyman data with the 130 gr cast bullet shows start at 10.5 gr starting load and 12.0 as the max of AA9. BTW do you have the Lyman data?

    I need to get to the range to test again, now that I have the cases sized correctly.
    I'll be testing Power Pistol, Blue Dot, H-110 and AA9.

    Please post your report on how yours did. Good luck to you!
     
  4. GLOCKG21

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    yes,i have the lyman data.i am waiting for my barrel to come.will the bullet weights make alot difference in accuracy?
     
  5. _The_Shadow

    _The_Shadow
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    Remember the Lyman Data was based on 8" test barrels, I only have a 5" barrel. I have asked JR of Lone Wolf about getting the longer barrel for my G-29 without the ports cut into the barrel, but he said the ports are cut early on in the machineing process. I rather not hae the ports jetting the flash and unburned powders into my line of site.

    The bullet's diameter will be the thing which will affect accuracy the most. 0.356" will be better than 0.355", some people like 0.357" to fill the bore...Cast bullets shoot better and lead less usually at 0.002" over the bore diameter. Therefore measuring the bore is important, slugging the barrel is the only way to know for sure.

    I found the lighter bullets(90-95 grain) didn't shoot as straight, the 115 grain & up worked better.

    Be aware of the sizing of the die, you can't just run it down to the shellholder, you need to adjust so it only sizes the brass down enough to fit the chamber correctly. I originally over sized the brass(used 10mm) with the Dillon sizing die. The new brass from Double Tap is sized correctly to start. You can use the barrel for the cartridge gage.

    Good luck!
     
  6. GLOCKG21

    GLOCKG21
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    has anybody used longshot yet?
    Ken
     
  7. _The_Shadow

    _The_Shadow
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    Well I went and tested June 27th, it was extremely hot, had to constanly towel off.
    There was no data for Blue Dot or Power Pistol for the 9x25Dillon, but I worked these up from 357Sig loads.
    But here are the results...

    9X25 Dillon June 27, 2009 test
    S&W 1006 with Bar-Sto barrel w/22# Wolff Recoil Spring
    Temps 99 ° HOT!

    Lyman 130.0 gr Soft Cast Devastator HP 0.356” 1.255”
    Blue Dot 11.2 gr Winchester LP
    Velocity 1342-1367 fps
    Primers flatten some, little smear, leading light

    Lyman 128.0 gr Soft Cast Devastator HP 0.356” 1.255”
    Blue Dot 11.2 gr Winchester LP
    Velocity 1343-1373 fps
    Primers flat some, little smear, leading light

    Zero 121.0 gr JHP 0.356” 1.255”
    H-110 14.4 gr CCI 350
    Velocity 1280-1335 fps
    Primers flat some, little smear

    Zero 121.0 gr JHP 0.356” 1.255”
    Blue Dot 12.2 gr CCI 350
    Velocity 1405-1438 fps
    Primers flat some, lot of smear

    Zero 121.0 gr JHP 0.356” 1.255”
    Power Pistol 10.2 gr CCI 350
    Velocity 1592-1620 fps
    Primers flat, lot of smear

    LEE 122.0 gr Hard Cast TC 0.356” 1.255”
    Blue Dot 11.0 gr Winchester LP
    Velocity 1340-1525 fps
    Primers flat some, little smear, leading very light


    For some reason the area around the firing pin strike was being wiped against the breech face, in one of the incident enough primer metal sheared to obstruct the firing pin. This caused one round not to fire, I dropped the magazine out, cleared the chamber, inserted an empty magazine so I could dry fire the pistol pointing downward, this cleared the obstructed fiing pin hole. All other rounds fired without incident.

    Readings taken with CHRONY Master F1 @ 8' from first screen.

    I have been looking into the Primer Smear situation a little more, it is only the middle area which flatten and is being rubbed hard against the breech face on ejection, the outer area of the primers are still rounded and the cases are not swollen or disfigured. However the firing pin dent is being flattened and smeared with some. These were well used 10mm cases sized to 9x25Dillon and head spaced to be tight to the breech face less than 0.002" free play.

    This maybe a result of head spacing and timing, using the 9x25 Dillon barrel in the S&W 1006 pistol. I am using this setup with the Wolff #22 recoil spring and ejection is only 3' or 4' with these loads I have tested. This is less than that of the 10mm loads and 40s&w load case ejections with the same set up.

    I suppose because of the necked down case the huge volume of gas, ejection timing is off. The recoil is not bad with the loads, the ejection timing is something I considered. Remember I did the barrel fitting to the slide and frame but the fit looks & feels right. Function was good with Double Tap Ammo at even higher velocities with out any primer wipe. I don't know what powder he uses for the factory loadings(probably only avalible to commercial loaders), but it is very silvery looking(almost chrome color) and looks to be a dense flattened ball grannuel about the diameter of Blue Dot flakes. This leads me to think temps being too HOT and the magnum primer use. The S&W 1006 stock spring is 18lb, I run the 22 lb spring for the higher impulse 10mm loadings and it functions well even with the 40S&W loadings.

    I will test the loads with the 20lb and 24lb springs to see if there is a difference in the cycles. Also will test various primer/powder combinations to see if things change for better or worse. This is what makes handloading fun, I don't have to have the fastest bullets, but I want good reliability, function & accuracy. This is why I play this game of handloading.

    I may drop a line on Mike McNett at DT just to see if he can shed any light on my situation.
     
    #47 _The_Shadow, Jun 29, 2009
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2009
  8. mikeone

    mikeone
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    Ive just started playing with the 180 XTP .357 bullet

    And 1200+ is easy with my g-20 length barrel.

    The brass looks fine this load really is cool.

    Mike
     
  9. _The_Shadow

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    Mike I'd like to hear about the load data for this combination, if you don't wish to post it here please PM me with the info.

    Thanks, The Shadow
     
  10. Gun-adian

    Gun-adian
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    Hey Everyone.....

    First post, so here goes.

    Picked up my almost new G-20C and immediately replaced the factory barrel with a Lone Wolf stock length barrel. As an afterthought, I also ordered a 6 inch 9x25 Dillon. WOW!!! Great toy!!!

    I've only put a couple recipes of 9x25 through it using W296 and Blue Dot with a variety of bullet weights.

    This is what I've got so far:

    Speer 115 gr. Gold Dot HP.
    CCI #300 primers
    5 shot strings

    11.5 Gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity:
    1) 1527 fps
    2) 1502 fps
    3) 1555 fps
    4) 1486 fps
    5) error

    12 Gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity:
    1) 1581 fps
    2) 1592 fps
    3) error
    4) error
    5) 1550 fps

    Happy with these results for the most part. Time for a new battery in the Chrony.....
    ___________________________________

    Hornady 147 gr. JHP-XTP.
    CCI #300 primers
    5 shot strings

    8.5 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity:
    1) 1197 fps
    2) 1124 fps
    3) 1178 fps
    4) 1201 fps
    5) 1192 fps

    9 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity:
    1) 1304 fps
    2) 1270 fps
    3) 1267 fps
    4) 1297 fps
    5) 1299 fps

    These are just over the max load for .357 SIG. I used that as a start point.
    ___________________________________

    Bulk 147 gr. cast lead flat point
    CCI #300 primers
    5 shot string

    9 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity:
    1) 1252 fps
    2) 1254 fps
    3) 1229 fps
    4) 1186 fps
    5) 1236 fps

    I figured these would be faster than the JHP's of the same weight. Shows you what I know. No leading though!!!
    ___________________________________

    Random bulk 124 gr. FMJ
    CCI #300 primers
    5 shot strings

    14.5 gr. Winchester 296
    Velocity:
    1) 1359 fps
    2) 1226 fps
    3) 1274 fps
    4) 1288 fps
    5) 1247 fps

    15 gr. Winchester 296
    Velocity:
    1) 1365 fps
    2) 1461 fps
    3) 1385 fps
    4) error
    5) 1451 fps

    Not too impressed with these. The first string was all over the velocity map. The second string tightened up a bit. Maybe a slightly heavier charge and/or a magnum primer next time???? (stupid battery!!!!!)
    ___________________________________

    All the loads functioned perfectly. No ftf's or fte's. No mashed primers.

    Judging by what I've seen here and found elsewhere on the 'net, I think I have some wiggle room with some of these loads.

    Any helpful advice or comments would be greatly appreciated.

    I got some 90 gr. JHP's kicking around. I really what to try these out!!!!
    Lighting one of these off would be an experience. Any ideas for a start load???

    Thanks Everyone.

    Mike.

    Lest we forget.
     
  11. Gun-adian

    Gun-adian
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    Hey again, everyone.

    I made a second trip to the range to wring out more of my 6 inch 9x25 Glock 20. I Put together quite a few rounds with various bullet weights ranging from 90 grain 9mm bullets up to 158 grain JHP's for the .357 Mag.

    Unfortunately, my chronograph suffered a fatal malfunction. (Okay...I shot the damn thing!! There, I admitted it. Happy now??)

    Obviously, I wasn't going to do any velocity testing so I had to settle for function tests. I'm happy to report that all rounds in all bullet weights functioned perfectly. No stoppages of any kind.

    Not counting the dead Chrony, I was quite pleased with the results, so far.

    Lighting these things off really drew a lot of attention. Awesome muzzle blast!!! It would rattle the roof of the shooting shed.

    Fast forward three weeks......

    Here's my third outing with the 9x25 Dillon. It was a nice Friday and I didn't feel like staying home and watching the Olympics. The weather was clear and sunny , around 15 C (60 F). (Whose idea was it to have the Winter Olympics here anyway?).

    So with spare Chrony in hand, off I went.

    These velocities are in order of bullet weight.

    (???) means "WTF???"

    Sierra 90 gr. JHP (.355 dia.)
    Winchester WLP primers
    5 shot strings

    12.5 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps):
    1) 1847
    2) 1685 (???)
    3) 1785
    4) 1820
    5) 1822
    Extreme Spread : 162

    13.0 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps):
    1) 1886
    2) 1876
    3) 1826
    4) 1861
    5) 1841
    Extreme Spread : 60

    13.5 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps):
    1) 1832
    2) 1871
    3) 1844
    4) 1836
    5) 1910
    Extreme Spread : 78

    14.0 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps) :
    1) 1939
    2) 1886
    3) 1895
    4) 1973
    5) 1904
    Extreme Spread : 87

    14.5 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1943
    2) 1894
    3) 1929
    4) error
    5) 1927
    Extreme Spread : 49

    Lots of flash and "BOOM" with these. Really moving!!!
    _____________________________________________________________________________________

    Speer 110 gr. Gold Dot HP (.357 dia.)
    Winchester WLP primers
    5 shot strings

    14.5 gr. H-110
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1348
    2) 1342
    3) 1266
    4) 1341
    5) 1308
    Extreme Spread : 82

    15.0 gr. H-110
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1478
    2) 1407
    3) 1395
    4) 1389
    5) 1383
    Extreme Spread : 95

    15.5 gr. H-110
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1418
    2) 1470
    3) 1487
    4) 1386
    5) 1434
    Extreme Spread : 101

    16.0 gr. H-110
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1459
    2) 1463
    3) 1480
    4) 1412
    5) 1433
    Extreme Spread : 68

    16.5 gr. H-110
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1506
    2) 1450
    3) 1484
    4) 1439
    5) 1464
    Extreme Spread : 67

    The last two strings look more consistent. Higher charge weight??
    _____________________________________________________________________________________


    Speer 110 gr. Gold Dot HP (.357 dia.)
    CCI #300 primers
    5 shot strings

    11.5 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1565
    2) 1521
    3) 1555
    4) 1600
    5) 1524
    Extreme Spread : 79

    12.0 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1607
    2) 1576
    3) 1552
    4) 1550
    5) 1650
    Extreme Spread : 100

    12.5 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1601
    2) error
    3) 1648
    4) 1635
    5) 1638
    Extreme Spread : 47

    13.0 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1593 (???)
    2) 1579 (???)
    3) 1717
    4) 1679
    5) 1705
    Extreme Spread : 126

    The 12.5 gr. charge looks the best in this batch. I don't know what the deal is with the 13.0 gr. charge.
    _____________________________________________________________________________________

    Sierra 115 gr. JHP (.355 dia.)
    Winchester WLP primers
    5 shot strings

    11.5 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1611
    2) 1562
    3) 1607
    4) 1561
    5) 1593
    Extreme Spread : 50

    12.0 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1648
    2) 1651
    3) 1604
    4) 1641
    5) 1609
    Extreme Spread : 47

    13.0 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1735
    2) 1700
    3) 1689
    4) 1696
    5) 1672
    Extreme Spread : 63
    _____________________________________________________________________________________

    I couldn't test any of the 158 grain .357 JHP's because I blew them all off last time. I'll make up some more for the next time around. Stay tuned.

    Again, I had no stoppages during this batch of testing. I can't fault the rounds reliability....at least from my perspective. Both powders used burned very cleanly. The empty brass was bordering on spotless.

    One thing I did notice, though.....My Glock did not seem to fling the empty brass that far away. When I shoot 10mm out of this thing, it really goes for distance. I'm guessing that the longer barrel and smaller bore add more weight on the top end and keep the slide velocity down.

    Feel free to comment (and check my math). I still learning.

    Thanks.

    Mike.

    P.S....The spare Chrony survived!!!!!!
     
  12. whenmonkeysfly

    whenmonkeysfly
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    Gun-adian,

    Thanks for the data and sorry 'bout your chrony - I'm expecting to shoot mine sometime in the near future too... just a matter of when. :)

    I'm waiting on my right elbow to heal from surgery. Got some 95 grain 9x25 from Mike and can't wait to shoot some of them through the chrony (hopefully) and down the range.

    Please keep the data coming! I'll share when I get the press and the arm workin' again!

    -Jay
     
  13. _The_Shadow

    _The_Shadow
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    I sent an e-mail to Ramshot Powders today inquiring about SILHOUETTE powder and this was sent back to me within an hour today. I will be picking up some of this powder to try soon.

    Caliber: 9mmx25 Dillon.
    Barrel length: 6”
    Powder: Ramshot –- SILHOUETTE®.
    Bullet weight: 115 grains.
    Start load: 9.0 grains (1275 – 1350 ft/p/sec)
    Maximum load: 10.0 grains (1425 – 1500 Ft/p/sec).
    Bullet weight: 124 grains.
    Start load: 8.5 grains (1225 – 1275 ft/p/sec)
    Maximum load: 9.5 grains (1300 – 1400 Ft/p/sec).
    Bullet weight: 147 grains.
    Start load: 7.5 grains (1100- 1175 ft/p/sec)
    Maximum load: 8.5 grains (1225 – 1275 Ft/p/sec).
    NOTES:
    It’ important to note that SAFETY is our prime concern therefore we strongly recommend.
    1.TO ALWAYS BEGIN LOADING AT THE RECOMMENDED MINIMUM “START” LOAD and develop loads in 2% increments towards the MAXIMUM load.
    2.CAUTION: Beware of double charging if the loading density is below 50% of the available volume.
    3.If possible, measure the velocity and correlate with our data.

    Regards
    Johan Loubser
    Ballistician
    Ramshot.Accurate Powders
    Tel: 406.234.0422 email: johan@ramshot.com
    WesternPowdersInc.Miles City.Montana.
    COMPANY WEBSITES/PRODUCTS:
    www.ramshot.com
    www.accuratepowder.com
    www.montanaxtreme.com
    www.blackhorn209.com

    Western Powders Inc. disclaims all possible liability for damages including, actual, incidental and consequential, resulting from usage of the information or advice contained in this message.
    Use the data and advice at your own risk, and with extreme caution.
    IMPORTANT NOTE: Allways begin loading from the minimum "START charge and carefully develop loads by increasing in small increments of 2% towards the Maximum load.
    DISCLAIMER:
    This communication is confidential and may be legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient,
    (i) please do not read or disclose to others, (ii) please notify the sender by reply mail, and (iii) please
    delete this communication from your system. Failure to follow this process may be unlawful. Thank you for your cooperation

    I don't know if any of you all have tried this powder for this application but I am going to work with it to check its performance for the 9X25 Dillon.
     
    #53 _The_Shadow, May 12, 2010
    Last edited: May 12, 2010
  14. Gun-adian

    Gun-adian
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    Hey Gang...here we go again.

    I had time for a quick trip to the range last week with more 9x25 loads. I used the Speer 110 Gr. GDHP and Hornady 90 Gr. XTP for this run. This is the first outing with the Hornady XTP. The Speer bullet I've used before, but I pushed it a little harder this time.

    The targets were at 25 yards and the Chrony was at about 3 yards.

    Speer 110 gr. Gold Dot HP (.357 dia.)
    CCI #300 Primers
    5 Shot Strings

    12.5 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1627
    2) 1691
    3) 1697
    4) 1689
    5) 1710
    Extreme Spread : 83

    13 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1733
    2) 1729
    3) 1731
    4) 1710
    5) 1737
    Extreme Spread : 27

    13.5 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1764
    2) 1744
    3) 1794
    4) 1752
    5) 1777
    Extreme Spread : 50

    14 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1816
    2) 1843
    3) 1819
    4) 1852
    5) 1798
    Extreme Spread : 54

    14.5 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1871
    2) 1877
    3) 1863
    4) 1866
    5) 1850
    Extreme Spread : 27

    I'm happy with the consistancies of the 13 gr. and 14.5 gr. loads. All loads gave 100% functioning.

    ________________________________________________________________________


    Hornady 90gr. XTP (.355 dia.)
    CCI #300 Primers
    5 Shot Strings

    13.5 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1888
    2) 1801
    3) 1855
    4) 1799
    5) 1897
    Extreme Spread : 98

    14 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1933
    2) 1914
    3) 1755 (???)
    4) 1826 (???)
    5) 1869
    Extreme Spread : 178

    14.5 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1887
    2) 1940
    3) 1922
    4) 1889
    5) 1933
    Extreme Spread : 53

    15 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1979
    2) 1898
    3) 1937
    4) 1999
    5) 1966
    Extreme Spread : 101

    15.5 gr. Blue Dot
    Velocity (fps)
    1) 1964
    2) 2016
    3) 2036
    4) 1974
    5) 1953
    Extreme Spread : 83

    No malfunctions of any kind.

    The last load hit 2000 FPS!!!!! It was also accurate. See pics.

    I found the XTP's to be more accurate than the GDHP's. Again, see pics below.
    ________________________________________________________________________

    I've got some 158 gr. JHP's loaded up and ready to go. I just need time to shoot them. Stay tuned.

    That's all I've got for now. As always, suggestions and comments are most welcome.

    Thanks.

    Mike.
     

    Attached Files:

  15. whenmonkeysfly

    whenmonkeysfly
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    Thanks Mike! Sweet data/information! What kind of guide rod and guide rod (weight) spring are you using?

    -Jay
     
  16. _The_Shadow

    _The_Shadow
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    Even though the barrel on my S&W1006 is 5", that longer barrel does make a big difference with this cartridge. I have some rounds loaded that I am going to test in the near future, I'll post when I can.

    Thanks for posting!
     
  17. Gun-adian

    Gun-adian
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    Jay - It's a factory weight spring (17 lbs. I think) captured on a stainless steel guide rod. I got it from the Glock Store. I wanted to try the factory weight spring before I upgrade to the heavier ones. It's working okay so far.

    Shadow.....Yes please, post any new info you can get. It's your data that got me started down the 9x25 road.

    Thanks guys.

    Mike.
     
    #57 Gun-adian, May 21, 2010
    Last edited: May 21, 2010
  18. Angry Fist

    Angry Fist
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    *******!!®
    Lifetime Member
    1. Glock Talk's Drunk Squad
    2. Show Me Glockers

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    T'zagged.... :supergrin:
     
  19. _The_Shadow

    _The_Shadow
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    Sorry about that...I is a wicked little round.
    How were your primers? Did they start to flatten any? Some? Alot? Mashed Flat?
    How was the casings? Extraction? Expanded? Any Split?

    I wish I knew what the powder is that DT McNett is using...I e-mailed him to ask but he probably will never say or it is "Commercial Only" stock.

    I'm hoping after I recieve my VLTOR Bren Ten, I e-mailed Eric Kinkel and asked about producing some 9x25Dillon conversion barrels and others for it. He said that we think alike and it was a possibility.
    The first step will be if we ever see the guns...

    Wade
     
  20. Gun-adian

    Gun-adian
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    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2009
    28
    2
    Location:
    British Columbia on the 49th
    Wade, here are some pics of the fired brass. I hope this helps.

    Mike.
     

    Attached Files:

    weaven likes this.