close

Privacy guaranteed - Your email is not shared with anyone.

Welcome to Glock Talk

Why should YOU join our Glock forum?

  • Converse with other Glock Enthusiasts
  • Learn about the latest hunting products
  • Becoming a member is FREE and EASY

If you consider yourself a beginner or an avid shooter, the Glock Talk community is your place to discuss self defense, concealed carry, reloading, target shooting, and all things Glock.

9BPLE vs. Ranger 115 +p+

Discussion in 'Caliber Corner' started by PghJim, May 12, 2011.

  1. PghJim

    PghJim

    1,935
    49
    Apr 21, 2005
    Pittsburgh
    For the first time I was able to purchase a few boxes of 9mm 9BPLE from ATG. I have been using Ranger 115 +p+. Does anyone have an opinion as to which may be more effective. I know that 9BPLE has gotten more press.
     
  2. Deputydave

    Deputydave Millennium Member

    1,826
    86
    Feb 20, 1999
    Florida
    From what I understand, the Ranger has very good expansion and penetration qualities. I do not know specifically about the 9BPLE. That would be a major consideration for me, particularly the penetration aspect of the round.

    Other major considerations would be which functions better in your firearm? Which can you control better/more accurate with?

    If all those considerations are about equal, which is less expensive so that you can practice more with it?
     

    Last edited: May 12, 2011

  3. Merkavaboy

    Merkavaboy Code-7A KUZ769

    Both loads were developed for the ISP and they had great success with both loads as a issued duty round.

    My understanding is that both loads penetrate ballistic gel to approx 10". That's why they fail the FBI's ballistic protocols, and yet both loads wreck havoc on BGs.
     
  4. PghJim

    PghJim

    1,935
    49
    Apr 21, 2005
    Pittsburgh
    From my limited water jug - 4 layers of denim testing this evening, they perform almost identical. They pentrate two jugs into the third causing a dimple on the far side and expand around 0.63. I did have one instance where the Ranger clogged with cloth and did not expand. However, this was very limited testing.
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2011
  5. This 115gr Ranger (RA9115HP+) came apart during a 4 layer denim water bag test and was good for about calculated soft tissue ~8.7" of penetration;

    [​IMG]

    Contrast that with the 115gr +P+ Gold Dot;

    [​IMG]

    Surprising 0.580" expansion (1.73x caliber) that was good for ~12.3" of penetration, not much difference than the 124gr GD +P tested, 0.587" exp ~12.4" penetration.

    [​IMG]

    Bob :cowboy:
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2011
  6. Buffering

    Buffering The Cooler

    770
    8
    Aug 8, 2005
    Rocking the Casbah
    From my reading and studying of this issue I have taken from it the thought that the 9BPLE, as a non-bonded bullet, suffers in barrier penetration and will shed the copper jacket. Bonded bullets in general don't have that concern or at least not to the same degree so through windows and such you have some better options. Not perfect but better.

    At the end of the mythical day, I wouldn't hesitate to carry the 9BPLE as it receives praise for its track record and I especially would carry it for person to person situations where as if I thought I'd be shooting at someone through a car window or door I'd carry a bonded bullet from a reputable manufacturer. I have both Gold Dots and the 9BPLE so I'm not predisposed to one bullet type or the other.
     
  7. PghJim

    PghJim

    1,935
    49
    Apr 21, 2005
    Pittsburgh
    Hey Bob - What was the diameter on that Ranger 115 +p+?
     
  8. glock20c10mm

    glock20c10mm

    3,919
    7
    Dec 4, 2004
    Out West
    I see them both as pretty much dead equal. They both travel at very high velocity, though I'ld be real curious to see some privately done chrono results, and both seem to penetrate 10" - 10.5" in clothed gel. Plus they both seem to expand fairly reliably. Matter of fact, in data I've seen, the Cobon version seems to be on an equal level also in all the same respects.

    On a side note, in data I've come across (FBI test results IIRC), the Remington version supposedly penetrates 11", and the Speer GD version supposedly penetrates 12" (which Bob's (Glolt20-91) data backs up).

    As for expansion numbers, I don't recall for any of them.
     
  9. PghJim

    PghJim

    1,935
    49
    Apr 21, 2005
    Pittsburgh
    My wife carries a G19 and we have been looking to change her carry round. Currently she carries Ranger T 127gr +p+, but I have been a little dissapointed in the T series expansion. Particularly with ammo we purchased last year. The 9BPLE and Ranger 115 +p+ seem to have a good reputation, which is why I started there. I am not that knowledgable in the best 9mm carry rounds and would welcome suggestions. I practice with the 9mm, but do not carry it.

    Craig - which GD round are you refering to? 115 +p+ or 124 +p?
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2011
  10. Jeff82

    Jeff82 NRA Benefactor CLM

    4,632
    98
    Feb 25, 2002
    USofA!
    I've clocked 9BPLE at 1381 through my G17. (avg. 10 rounds, high 1409, low 1368. On a very cool day.)
     
  11. PghJim

    PghJim

    1,935
    49
    Apr 21, 2005
    Pittsburgh
    Jeff, I would think she should still get above 1,300fps in the G19. I shot some last evening through denim and water jugs and actually was a bit impressed. The 9BPLE expanded every time and almost made it out of the third jug. That is the same penatration I get with HST 124gr +p.
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2011
  12. Jeff82

    Jeff82 NRA Benefactor CLM

    4,632
    98
    Feb 25, 2002
    USofA!
    My G19 typically gets about 30-35 fps less than my 17. So I'd expect about 1345-1350 in a 19. Glad to hear about the penetration.
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2011
  13. glock20c10mm

    glock20c10mm

    3,919
    7
    Dec 4, 2004
    Out West
    115, but I don't recall if it was labeled as simply +P, or +P+. It was actually chronoed at 1259 fps, don't know from what platform though.
     
  14. glock20c10mm

    glock20c10mm

    3,919
    7
    Dec 4, 2004
    Out West
    Like Jeff82 said, that's nothing to sneeze at! To tell you the truth, I'm surprised it went clear through the 3rd jug. Not that I knew one way or the other, just "surprised" is all.
     
  15. cowboy1964

    cowboy1964

    19,681
    2,127
    Sep 4, 2009
    U.S.A.
    Judging penetration with gallon water jugs is just wild ***** guestimation.
     
  16. unit1069

    unit1069

    8,128
    168
    Oct 10, 2007
    So. Central US
    Backyard tests may not be directly comparable to carefully controlled lab tests but they do yield valuable information that may or may not confirm the lab results.

    For example, every backyard test of Federal HST I've seen shows uniformly consistent expansion of that round, whatever the test medium used. Wouldn't that tend to confirm ATK's and other lab tests?

    I don't rely on informal backyard tests when it comes to ammo selection, but I do think it's useful and interesting.
     
  17. PghJim

    PghJim

    1,935
    49
    Apr 21, 2005
    Pittsburgh
    What do you think they used before ballistic gel? With in its limitation it tells me some information considering every round is tested exactly the same. I cannot judge actual flesh peneration, but if a round fails to open in a water test it probably will not open in a gellatin test either. Everything I have seen in my testing as far a Winchester T-Series failures have been seen in gellatin tests. Rounds known for good penetration, will in my testing make it through the third jug. That is why I was surprised the 9PBLE almost made it out of the third jug.

    It gives me something to do. The most interesting testing was the 357 magnum 125gr SJHP Remington round next to Seirra's 125gr DT 357sig round.

    My wife and I are trying to pick a carry round for her. It is just another piece of information to use. Right now everything is pointing toward the 9PBLE and I have just ordered 6 boxes from ATG. However, she does not think the round is as cute as the T-series 127 +p+. I am trying to convince her that cuteness is not part of the selection process.
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2011
  18. DocKWL

    DocKWL

    499
    0
    May 15, 2009
    Water-filled 55 gallon drums or purpose built tanks, not plastic gallon jugs. There is something called a Fackler box and when used properly, there is a mathematic formula which allows conversion. The information you need can be found at FirearmsTactical, but I know you disapprove of that site.

    It is good to see you performing your own tests and formulating your own opinions based on results instead of Internet garbage.
     
  19. PghJim

    PghJim

    1,935
    49
    Apr 21, 2005
    Pittsburgh
    Thanks, there are some things I disagree with on the site, but I will always look for ways of learning new information. If it is easier than carrying around 24 jugs filled with water, it is worth a look.
     
  20. Recovered lead core averaged 0.657" diameter, 93.2 grains.

    Bob :cowboy: