Glock Talk banner

45acp with Unique, what was that load again?

17K views 30 replies 14 participants last post by  norton 
#1 ·
As always loads for the 45acp using a 230gr cast bullet using Unique are all over the place. Lee book lists one and only one load, 5.0grs. Speer has two, 5.3grs to Start and 5.8grs as Max.
Lyman really takes the cake, 5.5grs to Start and 7.3grs as Max, 7.3grs, wow. Anyway, added em' all up and the average for all the loads is 5.9grs which is close to the Speer Max of 5.8grs. Wonder if I should start with 5.6grs to play it safe then bump up 1grs at a time until I get to 5.8grs just to see how things go OR should I just jump in with both feet and go with the 5.8grs since it's way under the Max Load suggested by the Lyman book?
What are some of ya'll pet loads for a stock 1911a1 Commander size semi-auto? Thanks.
 
#3 ·
I usually use 5.8 for 230 grain LRN and 6.0 for plated but that is out of a G30sf. I'm not worthy of a 1911 yet. Good luck.
LOL, you could afford an ATI or RIA, they're no more expensive then a Glock. You can find them all day long for $500 or less if you shop around and that's for a new one.
I got into mine with 3, 8 round stainless Colt mags, Blackhawk Serpa holster and a box of 20 rounds of Hornedy HP's for $450.
Anyway, I digress, so, 5.8grs should be ok then or do you think I should back off and start at 5.6grs just to play it safe?
 
#4 ·
Did you look at the powder manufacturer's reloading data? Alliant lists 6.5gr Unique as MAX with a 230gr TMJRN at 1.26 COL. That's the data I would use as most reliable.

You should be good starting at 5.6gr and working up as you feel the need, doing so responsibly of course.
 
#17 ·
That sure looks like it will be compressing the load.
This is 5.3
O
Metal Design Pattern Pipe Brass

Or is it so fluffy itlll just be packed in?
 
#5 · (Edited by Moderator)
Did you look at the powder manufacturer's reloading data? Alliant lists 6.5gr Unique as MAX with a 230gr TMJRN at 1.26 COL. That's the data I would use as most reliable.

You should be good starting at 5.6gr and working up as you feel the need, doing so responsibly of course.
I looked at my Speer #11, Lyman #46, Lee and the Alliant book. In my Alliant book they list 5.0grs for a 230gr Lead(target load) then they go to 6.4grs for 230gr HP and 6.0grs for 230gr FMJ. Of course this little free Alliant book IS from 1996 so loads may have changed.
By the way, "TMJRN" is a Total Metal Jacket Round Nose, I'm shooting cast lead so the loads will be a lot different.
 
#6 ·
Are we talking about lead round nose, semi wadcutter, tc... what?

I don't have my data in front of me, but depending on the bullet profile, the OAL is going to make a pretty big difference... likely why you're seeing data all over the place.

Most sources will have round nose loaded to 1.270ish, semi wadcutters around 1.200ish...
 
#7 ·
Truncated Cone, 230gr Lee Tumble Lube. I think I'm just going to start with 5.6grs of Unique and see if it functions ok then if there's no pressure signs I'll bump up to 5.8grs and give it a try. I'm looking for 825-850fps.
 
#9 ·
I'm happy with 230gr LRN 5.2gr @ 1.135" in Glocks and 1911s. I ran up to 6.2gr and that had some kick indeed.
 
#10 ·
I still don't understand how Lyman can go up to 7.3grs.:wow: That seems like quite a bit above the other manuals. Heck, I've had my Speer manual longer then any of the others and I've grown to trust it and even they're saying 5.8grs as MAX., what's up with that.
 
#28 ·
I still don't understand how Lyman can go up to 7.3grs.:wow: That seems like quite a bit above the other manuals.



That's way, way too much. Quite a while ago a good friend of mine, who had been reloading for years, gave me 40 or 50 rounds with 230 FMJ. They felt very hot so I pulled a couple and they were 6.5 or 6.6. I didn't shoot them, ended up pulling them and reloading. Years ago I started out with 6.0 using FMJ, over the years I've cut it down to 5.7 or 5.8.
 
#11 ·
I looked at my Speer #11, Lyman #46, Lee and the Alliant book. In my Alliant book they list 5.0grs for a 230gr Lead(target load) then they go to 6.4grs for 230gr HP and 6.0grs for 230gr FMJ. Of course this little free Alliant book IS from 1996 so loads may have changed.
By the way, "TMJRN" is a Total Metal Jacket Round Nose, I'm shooting cast lead so the loads will be a lot different.
Truncated Cone, 230gr Lee Tumble Lube. I think I'm just going to start with 5.6grs of Unique and see if it functions ok then if there's no pressure signs I'll bump up to 5.8grs and give it a try. I'm looking for 825-850fps.

From Alliant's reloading manual (which can be downloaded from their website, strongly recommended!):

230 gr Speer LRN, Unique, CCI 300, 1.270", 5.8 gr, 849fps

Based on that data, 5.6 is going to be closing in on their recommended max load rather quickly.
 
#12 ·
I use the same 230 grain tc lee boolit, although I size them / .452"... 5.8 grains Unique at 1.210" OAL they clock 853 average from a 5" 1911. Very accurate and an extreme spread of 41 with mixed brass (not great, not horrible). Fairly clean, too.

Also shot that load moved out to 1.230" and they clocked 784 fps, although I didn't put the test gun in my notes. Unlikely, but I may have used a P220. These were slightly more dirty.

That was in December. Might be doing a little faster in hot weather.
 
#13 · (Edited)
Did you look at the powder manufacturer's reloading data? Alliant lists 6.5gr Unique as MAX with a 230gr TMJRN at 1.26 COL. That's the data I would use as most reliable.

You should be good starting at 5.6gr and working up as you feel the need, doing so responsibly of course.
But he wants lead bullet data Jim. I find 6gr runs ball equiv, about 850fps w/ a 230grLRN @ 1.250".
 
#14 ·
But he wants lead bullet data Jim. I find 6gr runs ball equiv, about 850fps w/ a 230grLRN @ 1.250".
True, that data was for jacketed data and I missed the "cast" reference in the OP. He reposted that he was using lead after my post. The later post provided the LRN data from the Alliant site. Guess I should have also provided the link so he can get the data himself...

http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/default.aspx
 
#16 ·
For Unique, if memory serves me correct I use 6 grs at somewhere between 1.230-1.240".
 
  • Like
Reactions: tom mac
#18 · (Edited)
Unique takes compression well. I run 230gr lrn at 1.250-1.255".
 
#19 ·
I have a theory (totally unproven) that compression of the powder, any powder, has nothing at all to do with pressures attained. The only possible exception I can think of might be a powder which breaks down significantly (like a flake or extruded powder) that might be physically altered enough by extreme compacting, that it's burn rate could be altered.

My personal belief is compressed or uncompressed has very little (or in most cases no effect) on load outcomes.
 
#20 ·
I have a theory (totally unproven) that compression of the powder, any powder, has nothing at all to do with pressures attained. The only possible exception I can think of might be a powder which breaks down significantly (like a flake or extruded powder) that might be physically altered enough by extreme compacting, that it's burn rate could be altered.

My personal belief is compressed or uncompressed has very little (or in most cases no effect) on load outcomes.
Well it depends a lot on the powder burn rate & the case volume, but in general, slower the powder the greater the allowable compression. Why you can compress powder like unique & not say Trail Boss.
 
#21 ·
Well it depends a lot on the powder burn rate & the case volume, but in general, slower the powder the greater the allowable compression. Why you can compress powder like unique & not say Trail Boss.
I don't know, does Hodgdon have a warning about compressing Trail Boss?

I don't have a ton of experience with it, but I have definitely loaded compressed in my 240gr LSWC loads with my Model 29. I looked it up on my spread sheet, 9.5gr almost filled the case, probably 20% compressed when seated to the crimp groove, notes: 976fps, average accuracy, no signs of pressure, no hard extraction, primers fine, for some reason I didn't record the ES.

I could see how crushing those little cheerios might alter their form and affect burn characteristics perhaps, but 20% compaction didn't seem to hurt anything. I think I got the original load I worked up from in one of my bullet mfg load guides, can't remember which one though.
 
#22 ·
I believe there is a warning about compressing TB. In general, not an issue, it is for light loads in big cases.
In affect, when you are deep seating you are compressing powders. Some, like Clays & TG, don't take compression well at all. Even my fav WST, doesn't like to be compressed much more than the 100% load density often achieved in a 9mm. It doesn't show much pressure sign but accuracy starts to go south, tells me something isn't good.
 
#23 ·
I believe there is a warning about compressing TB. In general, not an issue, it is for light loads in big cases.
In affect, when you are deep seating you are compressing powders. Some, like Clays & TG, don't take compression well at all. Even my fav WST, doesn't like to be compressed much more than the 100% load density often achieved in a 9mm. It doesn't show much pressure sign but accuracy starts to go south, tells me something isn't good.
I started looking around and I couldn't find anything in writing from Hodgdon on compressing TB. I will admit, after getting routed away from their general information web page to their reloading data web pages repeatedly, I did finally give up.

I did find a bunch of internet chat about not compressing it, but I generally ignore this stuff as I firmly believe the internet has only added to old wives tales, not dispelled them. :)

If anybody finds anything in writing from Hodgdon admonishing against compressing TB, I would greatly appreciate the link so I can update my notes (i.e. take the compressed load off my OK list).
 
#25 ·
#24 ·
As always loads for the 45acp using a 230gr cast bullet using Unique are all over the place.
The load with a jacketed 230 RN and 6.o of Unique is crazy accurate and is what I consider a factory duplicate. With a LRN 5.2 is good and with an Extreme plated I split the difference at 5.5 grains.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Glock40man
#27 ·
Yeah, kind of how I read it. I imagine like anything, some variation is going to be fine. I compress a lot of powders in diff calibers w/ no ill affects. WST in the 9mm comes to mind. It is very fluffy, so 147-160gr bullets are going to give 100% or a bit more compression.
 
  • Like
Reactions: WeeWilly
#31 ·
As always loads for the 45acp using a 230gr cast bullet using Unique are all over the place. Lee book lists one and only one load, 5.0grs. Speer has two, 5.3grs to Start and 5.8grs as Max.
Lyman really takes the cake, 5.5grs to Start and 7.3grs as Max, 7.3grs, wow. Anyway, added em' all up and the average for all the loads is 5.9grs which is close to the Speer Max of 5.8grs. Wonder if I should start with 5.6grs to play it safe then bump up 1grs at a time until I get to 5.8grs just to see how things go OR should I just jump in with both feet and go with the 5.8grs since it's way under the Max Load suggested by the Lyman book?
What are some of ya'll pet loads for a stock 1911a1 Commander size semi-auto? Thanks.
I checked two Lyman manuals-both the 4th Edition cast bullet handbook and the 3rd edition pistol and revolver manual
For cast bullets dropped from their design mold-452374-225 grain the low end load is 5.5 to 7.3 max of Unique. Both show OAL @ 1.272.
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top