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40 Cal Open Load suggestions

Discussion in 'Reloading' started by jerseyglockgirl, Aug 1, 2010.

  1. jerseyglockgirl

    jerseyglockgirl

    33
    0
    Aug 18, 2007
    NJ Shore
    Hi there Glockers,
    I am in the process of making the big jump to an open Glock, in 40Cal. what my wonderful reloader husband would like to know is, what is the best load out there for building the best load while keeping a MPF, for IPSC/USPSA shooting?

    We are building it on a 35,,,,if that helps with ANYTHING......

    Thanks for any information that you may have to offer.

    Have a good day,

    JGG
     

  2. mboylan

    mboylan

    1,928
    40
    May 11, 2007
    On Brian Enos they asked for an Open load and got a bunch of people responding with Limited loads.

    Titegroup and Clays are not good powders for working the comp.

    A good powder to start with is 7 grains of IMR 7625, behind a 135 grain bullet.

    Power Pistol is more common and works well too.

    You want a medium to slow burning powder that produces high gas volume.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2010
  3. Hoser

    Hoser Ninja

    2,353
    38
    May 22, 2002
    Use jacketed 135s and the slowest powder you can find.

    I would get a 9x19 conversion barrel and use it. Shooting 40 in an Open gun is very expensive compared to 9x19.
     
  4. mboylan

    mboylan

    1,928
    40
    May 11, 2007
    Some people are skittish about shooting 9 mm Major because the loads are beyond maximum. Slow, slow burning powders are required. It is cheap.
     
  5. DWARREN123

    DWARREN123 Grumpy Old Guy

    7,268
    1,295
    Jan 25, 2008
    Clarksville, Tn.
    I understand a lot of folks like Hodgdon's Longshot for competition.
     
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2010
  6. jerseyglockgirl

    jerseyglockgirl

    33
    0
    Aug 18, 2007
    NJ Shore
    For those of you that have been kind enough to help,, or for those that may be interested in loading for .40 Open,,,,we have finally come up with an absolutely perfect load for my G-35 open gun.
    Montana Gold 180 gr. FP with 6.9gr of HS6 powder - a note on the powder charge - we were getting some wonky Chrono readings before our area match, and did not want to travel out to the match and find out that we were not making Major Power Factor for USPSA - so, we bumped it up from 6.7 to 6.9, and the guys at the match declared it to read at a high but very manageable 178 PF!
     
  7. noylj

    noylj

    393
    17
    Jul 20, 2010
    Isn't it rather insane to try to make major with a 9x19?
    .40 sounds a lot more sane, and I can't see anything better than a .45, but that is me.
    Why does open division drop the PF to 160?
    Here are some of the 9x19 Major loads I have heard people recommend. Better be sure you have a fully-supported chamber and a gunsmith who knows what they are doing...
    9x19
    Bullet Weight Powder Weight Velocity Start/Max Power Factor COL
    Hdy FMJ 124 Herco 6.8 1295 Max 161 --
    Hdy FMJ 124 Blue Dot 8.5 1300 -- 161 --
    Zero JHP 125 SR7625 6.4 1291 IPSC 161 1.160
    JSP 125 Blue Dot 8.5 1300 not max in BHP 163 --
    Zero JHP 124 True Blue 7.6 1314 9mm Major 163 1.145
    Zero JHP 124 N350 6.6 1321 9mm Major 164 1.145
    JHP 124 HS6 8.2 1323 IPSC 164 1.150
    Zero JHP 124 Longshot 6.8 1323 9mm Major 164 1.145
    Zero JHP 124 Vectan SP2 8.7 1324 IPSC 164 1.150
    Zero JHP 125 SR7625 6.6 1321 IPSC 165 1.160
    Zero JHP 125 Power Pistol 8.2 1325 IPSC 166 1.160
    Zero JHP 124 HS6 8.1 1338 IPSC 166 1.150
    Zero JHP 124 Longshot 7.0 1338 9mm Major 166 1.145
    Speer FMJ 124 Power Pistol 6.6 1339 IPSC 166 1.160
    MG JHP 124 3N37 7.5 1339 IPSC 166 1.160
    Zero JHP 125 HS6 8.5 1329 IPSC 166 1.150
    Zero JHP 124 3N37 8.1 1342 IPSC 166 1.150
    Hdy FMJ encap. 124 SR7625 7.0 1343 IPSC 166 1.178
    Zero JHP 125 Power Pistol 8.3 1332 IPSC 167 1.160
    Hdy FMJ 124 SR7625 7.0 1343 9mm Major 167 1.145
    Remington FMJ 124 3N37 7.6 1346 IPSC 167 1.160
    JHP 124 HS6 8.2 1347 IPSC 167 1.150
    Zero JHP 125 SR7625 6.8 1339 IPSC 167 1.160
    Zero JHP 125 Power Pistol 8.1 1341 IPSC 168 1.160
    MG JHP 124 True Blue 8.0 1352 IPSC 168 1.185
    Zero JHP 124 Longshot 7.2 1355 9mm Major 168 1.145
    MG JHP 124 HS6 7.7 1355 Major 168 1.145
    Zero JHP 124 HS6 8.4 1355 IPSC 168 1.150
    MG JHP 124 True Blue 7.5 1356 IPSC 168 1.165
    Zero JHP 124 N350 6.8 1357 9mm Major 168 1.145
    Zero JHP 125 True Blue 8.0 1347 IPSC 168 1.160
    Zero JHP 124 N350 7.0 1362 9mm Major 169 1.145
    Zero JHP 125 3N37 8.1 1352 IPSC 169 1.160
    Star FMJ 124 HS6 7.8 1364 IPSC 169 1.175
    Zero JHP 125 Silhouette 8.0 1358 IPSC 170 1.160
    Zero JHP 124 True Blue 7.8 1370 9mm Major 170 1.145
    MG CMJ 124 3N37 8.0 1370 IPSC 170 1.165
    Zero JHP 125 Vectan SP2 9.0 1361 IPSC 170 1.150
    JHP 125 3N37 8.0 1362 IPSC 170 1.170
    Hdy FMJ 124 SR7625 7.2 1373 9mm Major 170 1.145
    MG JHP 124 True Blue 7.7 1375 9mm Major 171 1.165
    JHP 125 3N37 8.2 1364 IPSC 171 1.170
    Zero JHP 125 HS6 8.1 1365 IPSC 171 1.150
    Zero JHP 125 True Blue 8.3 1368 IPSC 171 1.160
    Zero JHP 124 HS6 8.5 1381 IPSC 171 1.150
    JHP 124 HS6 8.2 1382 IPSC 171 1.150
    Zero JHP 124 3N37 8.4 1382 IPSC 171 1.150-1.170
    Berry's Cu P-RN 124 HS6 7.4 1385 IPSC 172 1.150
    Star FMJ 124 Longshot 7.3 1386 IPSC 172 1.170
    Zero JHP 124 N350 7.3 1386 9mm Major 172 1.145
    PD FMJ 124 Auto Comp 7.2 1387 Major 172 1.145
    Zero JHP 124 Longshot 7.4 1388 9mm Major 172 1.145
    Zero JHP 124 True Blue 8.0 1391 9mm Major 172 1.145
    Zero JHP 125 3N37 8.0 1381 IPSC 173 1.160
    Remington FMJ 124 3N37 7.7 1393 IPSC 173 1.160
    Zero JHP 125 Silhouette 8.2 1384 IPSC 173 1.160
    Speer FMJ 124 Power Pistol 6.8 1402 IPSC 174 1.160
    JHP 125 3N37 8.4 1392 IPSC 174 1.170
    Zero JHP 125 3N37 7.7 1400 IPSC 175 1.165
    Zero JHP 125 3N37 8.0 1400 IPSC 175 1.165
    Zero 125 HS6 8.1 1400 Major 175 1.150
    Remington JHP 124 HS6 8.7 1438 IPSC 178 1.150
    Here is what I show for 9x19 and Longshot. Notice that to get to Major, you are almost 1.0gn over MAX. This sort of thing breeds damaged guns and, maybe, damaged shooters.
    FMJ 125 Longshot 4.7 1022 Start 128 1.090
    FMJ 125 Longshot 5.7 1162 Max 145 --
    Zero JHP 124 Longshot 6.6 1273 9mm Major 158 1.145
    Zero JHP 124 Longshot 6.8 1323 9mm Major 164 1.145
    Zero JHP 124 Longshot 7.0 1338 9mm Major 166 1.145
    Zero JHP 124 Longshot 7.2 1355 9mm Major 168 1.145
    Star FMJ 124 Longshot 7.3 1386 IPSC 172 1.170
    Zero JHP 124 Longshot 7.4 1388 9mm Major 172 1.145


    .40 is so much more sane. Here, you can achieve major with max loads of common powders and not +P+++ loads. Longshot starts off well over major (too slow) for .40, however. Just stock up on Nosler 135gn JHPs.

    .40S&W
    Bullet Weight Powder Weight Velocity Start/Max Power Factor COL
    JHP 135 231/HP38 6.7 1185 Max 160
    Federal Personal Defense 135 Factory 1195 Factory 161
    JHP 135 Unique 6.8 1198 Max 162
    JHP 135 Bullseye 6.3 1203 Max 162
    JHP 135 700X 6.2 1210 163 1.125
    Nosler JHP 135 PB 7.5 1230 166
    JHP 135 AA7 11.2 1237 Max 167 1.125
    JHP 135 231/HP38 7.0 1244 Max 168 1.125
    JHP 135 AA2 7.6 1247 Max 168 1.125
    Nosler JHP 135 SR7625 7.8 1250 169
    JHP 135 TiteGroup 6.4 1251 Max 169 1.125
    JHP 135 AA5 9.3 1266 Max 171 1.125
    Berry’s Plated 135 N350 8.0 1274 172 1.100
    Nosler JHP 135 True Blue 9.2 1277 Max 172 1.120
    JHP 135 Red Dot 6.7 1280 Max 173 1.105
    Nosler JHP 135 SR4756 9.0 1285 173
    JHP 135 Unique 8.5 1290 Max 174 1.105
    JHP 135 Longshot 10.5 1367 Start 185 1.125
    Nosler JHP 135 Longshot 11.0 1349 182
    Nosler JHP 135 Longshot 11.5 1397 189
    JHP 135 Longshot 12.0 1480 Max 200 1.125
    Nosler JHP 135 Longshot 12.0 1467 198
    Nosler JHP 135 Longshot 13.2 1542 208
     
  8. fredj338

    fredj338

    21,949
    1,055
    Dec 22, 2004
    so.cal.
    SLower powders give wide vel swings when loaded below midrange. HS6 would fit in that catagory. If you only want 180s @ 950fps+, something like WSF runs great there. PowerPistol would be another good choice for running a comp.
     
  9. Hoser

    Hoser Ninja

    2,353
    38
    May 22, 2002
    Major 9 is easy if you pick the right (slow) powder and go with 124-135 gn bullets. Making major with 115s can be tricky.
     
  10. 72Stick

    72Stick

    17
    0
    Jul 7, 2007
    Sorry to bring up a dead thread, but I'm currious how there can be such a large difference in bullet weights for .40 open Glocks. I ran an open G22 last year and really liked the set up. BUt then of course there's the snappy .40. I could be interested in a different bullet/powder set up. I'm just a weekend warrior, but I'd really like to understand the open Glock a little better.

    Jerseyglockgirl is running 180 gr bullets and loves it, while Noylj posts a huge list of loading data for 135 gr bullets.

    Does the comp work better with one bullet over the other?
     
  11. Colorado4Wheel

    Colorado4Wheel

    14,949
    173
    Nov 2, 2006
    CO
    .40 cal is not the best caliber for open. 9mm is the only logical choice for a Open Glock. You loose too many rds to the bigger .40 round when you shoot anything but a 9mm/.38 Super Comp type round.
     
  12. 72Stick

    72Stick

    17
    0
    Jul 7, 2007

    Thanks for the reply, but that's not my question. I know everyone shoots those calibers and that's great for them. I'm old and slow and I just shoot for the fun of shooting USPSA with an open Glock 22 and I leave the brass on the range anyway.

    I would like someone to school me on why there's such a disparity in opinions about the best bullet weight to operate the G22 w/comp. I get the part about slower burning powder producing more gas. That's a no brainner, but how does a heavier bullet produce less felt recoil and better gas expansion in an open gun? Newton's third law would seem to suggest a lighter bullet would create less felt recoil, but the common open gun wisdom appears to support the heavier bullet. How does that work? What's the logic between heavier vs lighter bullets in an open gun, as far as working the comp with less felt recoil?

    Please don't regale me with how great 9s & .38 supers are, it's not in question. They're both great calibers.
     
  13. GioaJack

    GioaJack Conifer Jack

    10,016
    1
    Apr 14, 2009
    Conifer, CO
    IF you compared a heavier bullet against a lighter bullet at the same velocity the heavier bullet will produce a heavier recoil.

    In most cases however shooters load heavier bullets at a lower velocity than lighter bullets which accounts for the lighter recoil.

    Mass, Momentum... all that happy scientific stuff. DanaT can explain it, he loves that stuff... it gives me a headache.


    Jack
     
  14. Colorado4Wheel

    Colorado4Wheel

    14,949
    173
    Nov 2, 2006
    CO
    You should go over to Brian Enos forums and ask that question.

    A Heavier Bullet loaded to the same Power Factor will have less perceived recoil. For those not paying attention I said to the same Power Factor (this always gets people confused). The heavier bullet loaded to the same power factor has less energy. So it has less recoil.

    BUT

    I don't think that is your answer. In a open gun it's not about the bullet weight and speed (creating energy and muzzle flip). In a open gun it's about creating the right amount of gas to work the comp. You don't want a heavier bullet because you want more powder for more gas to work the gun. In 9mm/38SC people are using mid-weight bullets. 124gr for the most part. As with most things extremes tend to not work as well. So I would guess something in the 160gr would work better. But you may need to go with a lighter bullet to get enough gas to work your guns comp. Only testing would tell you the answer.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2012
  15. 72Stick

    72Stick

    17
    0
    Jul 7, 2007
    Thanks guys!

    That does make sense.

    I've asked this question on Brian Enos and didn't received a response. Jerseyglockgirl's thread has been the only search result I've found that even comes close to addressing what's going on in an open gun regarding bullet weights and recoil.


    Again, thanks for the schoolin'!
     
  16. Hoser

    Hoser Ninja

    2,353
    38
    May 22, 2002
    Comps are a whole different animal.

    If you use a light bullet you will get less muzzle flip and the dot/sight will be easier to track. If you use a lighter bullet it also means you can use more powder and that means more powder to make the comp work.

    The big thing is dot tracking. If the dot moves too much on recoil, start playing with powders and bullet weights.

    For an open 40 the textbook solution is 135 or 155 gn bullets and lots of slow powder.
     
  17. hkfooey

    hkfooey

    6
    1
    Oct 3, 2005
    Sunny Kalifornia
    Just dig up this old post - whereas I am in the same boat looking for the magic combination of bullet weight vs. slow burning powder.

    Good reading - thanks guys!
     
  18. hkfooey

    hkfooey

    6
    1
    Oct 3, 2005
    Sunny Kalifornia
    Currently using VV N350 7.7 gn with Extereme 155g RN with 1.125 OAL - makes around 170-ish PF. Now more powder are available, going to try some load with Autocomp, HS6 and Silhouette.