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20 year military vet farmer needs your help!

Discussion in 'The Okie Corral' started by Kegs, Dec 26, 2012.

  1. Hauptmann6


    May 22, 2002
    Portage, MI

    The bait ban? You think that's a bad idea? I take it you have never hunted in the NE corner of the Lower Pen. The numbers they were published of deer with TB are VERY low compared to what happened.

    While I feel bad that the farmers lost revenue due to not being able to sell truckloads of bait, it was the best thing for the deer herd. And long term for the cattle/pork industry here.
  2. Hauptmann6


    May 22, 2002
    Portage, MI
    Wow. Talk about head in the sand. The bait bad has helped. The animals don't go nose to nose in the mass numbers they used to. Back in the mid 90s when TB was just starting to hit hard. You could see 50+ deer on a bait pile. Tell me that doesn't help spread a disease that is spread by nose to nose contact.

    I started out hating the bait ban. And years later I hope they never allow baiting again.

    And yes, the farmers took a hit. It really sucked. But just think how much you would be screaming if a few cattle ranches or pig farms had to destroy their entire herd due to TB. Then disinfecting everything.

  3. czsmithGT


    Jan 8, 2004
    I think pure Mangalistas are not considered an invasive species. Pure Mangalitsa of Okemos Michigan raises them. But I think his problem is his pigs are not pure Mangalistas but are cross bred with Russian which I think he affirmed. That is why they are considering his pigs to be an invasive species.

    I think the rule is OK but the execution was poor on both sides. There should have been some accommodation reached that would have allowed him to dispose of his stock at a profit and transitioned his stock to something legal. This has been coming for a long time and should not have been a surprise.

    It is a shame that the case wasn't ruled on much earlier, and unfortunate he couldn't manage to reach an accommodation with the DNR that would have avoided going to court and avoided him losing his livestock investment. Usually when you sue a government agency, even if you win you lose. Being a broke martyr isn't much satisfaction.
  4. czsmithGT


    Jan 8, 2004
    Well, TX and HI situations are what the Michigan DNR is trying to prevent. If the offending species are not on the farm, they can't escape.
  5. nmk


    Apr 25, 2007
    I'll support Michigan DNR on this one.
  6. sjfrellc

    sjfrellc CLM

    Dec 26, 2004
    Novi, Michigan
    I would say that logic and fairness depend on what side of the debate you stand on. I haven't seen plenty laws that applied to me are not logical or fair.

    Very similar to the gun control debate. And the baiting ban in Michigan. I don't like any of the laws or regulation, but I would follow the law. I am 100% against an assault weapons ban on my legally 30 round magazines, but I would comply with any existing firearms laws. I willingly complied with the baiting ban.

    I agree, but when all is considered and legal costs are paid you still have to follow the Invasive Species Order.

    That's for sure.

    But see in this youtube video Mark states he was crossing the Russians, knows heritage breeds are outlawed and was not going to comply with the April 1 deadline last February.
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2012
  7. Are you and mark the same person?? because you are both sounding alittle paranoid right now..

    it sucks that his farm might shut down but public safety is more important then his lets run the list why he should stop being a pain in the butt and end this

    they carry a lot of disease's, they destroy farm land,kill cattle/sheep/poultry/deer/, even though a rare event, attack people (mostly hunters)

    im all for the "good fight' and standing up for your rights but this guy doesnt care how this effects other people.

    and you can throw all this goverment conspirecy theory around but i think the DNR have been nice about it..if i was one of the local ranchers i would have grabbed my .44 marlin and taken care of these diseased monsters myself..
  8. ray9898


    May 29, 2001
    That's because many mistakenly equate freedom with anarchy, they think they should never need to answer to anyone for anything.
    Last edited: Dec 27, 2012
  9. Kegs

    Kegs Ol 8 fingers ;)

    Oct 26, 2009
    Cold side of conus
    anarchy is a society without a government, it has little to do with freedom or oppression at all.

    I don't think any of us feel that we should never need to answer to anyone for anything.

    I believe that insinuation is disingenuous at best, if not insulting.

    I'm not Mark, I don't speak for him. I am a person in the broader community where he lives and I am trying to relay this issue (struggling to explain it the best I can)

    I think this is actually a more complex issue than it appears.

    I do not believe we are being paranoid in an age where there is a revolving door between the FDA and Monsanto that results in GMO salmon being approved.

    I do not believe we are being paranoid when billions of dollars are spent on the "department of homeland security" and "transportation security administration" that do not result in anything but negligible return in safety for U.S. citizens.

    I don't think I'm paranoid to believe that Diane Feinstein probably has other interests in mind as she supports "gun control" for my (and other U.S. citizen's) safety.

    You can call it paranoid all you want, but poor decisions are being made by governments every day, and very few of those decisions are made on behalf of the citizens, most are made to grow the governments authority or on behalf of financially powerful interests that have close government ties.

    In my opinion, I believe the DNR's directive and everything it is based on has little to nothing to do with protecting public safety and mostly to everything to do with supporting corporate interests of big agriculture and agri-food production who make high profits by cutting costs that are necessary to produce high quality food or conserving the environment.

    Look guys, I don't even eat much pork. I most often eat lean meats chicken, fish, etc. - and I choose organic foods because I believe I can maintain my health better without ingesting roundup and foreign proteins used in GM food. I'm in my mid-40s and in far better physical shape than most of my friends my age.

    I don't have a fight in this game other than I think the DNR is overreaching their authority and the basis of it is something that the state doesn't want to tell the citizenry.

    Why else would they stall and gag the case?

  10. Detectorist


    Jul 16, 2008
    Once anyone uses the word 'Monsanto', I lose all interest and credibility goes down.

    Besides, I was lured to this thread by the mention of his vet status which has nothing to do with the situation.

    We all have to follow rules. e can fight the rules in court.
  11. faawrenchbndr

    faawrenchbndr DirtyThirty fan CLM

    Nov 24, 2005
    I'll support DNR here as well.........feral hog have ruined Georgia,
    Texas and many other states.

    And I HATE solicitations.........:wavey:
  12. blessed you havent got a problem with these yet...i use to run around georgia with this old girl and the farmers there beg people to come kill these things..the DNR is prob not going to be able to stop this epidemic but they can atleast slow it down.

    the needs of the many is more important then the needs of the few....your friend needs to rethink his stand on this..he is basicly saying that his need to make money is more important then anyone elses need to make money and to heck with public health laws..

    he is not going to gain public sympathy this way
  13. ray9898


    May 29, 2001
    Anarchy means more than simply "a society without a government".

    Many believe 'freedom' means they should be able to do whatever they want, whenever they want, no matter the consequence to others. They believe they should have no responsibility to the society they live in or the elected government who is tasked with keeping that society orderly. They dream of a society which has no one of authority to answer to which is the very definition of anarchy .

    I live in GA and I know damn well the issues feral hogs are posing to our farmers. These restrictions are needed and is exactly the type thing our government should work to prevent.
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2012