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All purpose pistol: Glock MOS

8K views 63 replies 16 participants last post by  cowboy1964 
#1 · (Edited)
Hi!

I have a +25 years experience in firearms, more related with the duty and self defense scenario, but yet some unclear regarding RDS system. However I participated in several local IPSC and IDPA matches (production and standard). Currently I have a Glock 17 generation 4, with Tactical Warren competition sights. The pistol is tuned by myself and I can handle very well. I'm thinking now about buying a Glock 34 MOS. In my area nobody have a RDS mounted on theirs pistol and I can't try one before buy it. So I've read and seen many material about the RDS systems mounted pistol and for short I've found some points of view:

Main advantages for: looking at target and not at sights (super), older eyes (nice), moving targets (nice), low light condition, targets 50 meters away (this is not a usually SD scenario).
The drawbacks are for: harder to conceal than without RDS, the sun in front, rain and dirty on the scope, extra weight mounted on the slide (feed problems, not holding 0), slower than iron sights for the first shot at short distances, can spoil quickly and last but not least: not as easy to call the shoot during recoil time.

In the Competition Open category, shooters use RDS vs iron sights, that is mean RDS is better for open's scenarios, For Open, RDS system is mounted on a dedicated rail to not interfering with the slide pistol's cycling. I want to keep the same pistol for all purposes: CCW, home protection and competition fun shooting. Because I can't conceal a pistol with dedicated rail for RDS and a private milled slide is not permitted here, I'll chose Glock MOS.

So, I'd like to ask: 1. What about the real benefit of using the same pistol with mounted RDS for self defense and sport shooting too. 2. Are correct my above finding about mounted RDS or you have experimented anything else? 3. Is it really worth the investment for the new Glock 34 MOS?

Thanks!
 
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#37 ·
I ve just buy a standard G 34 for 500$. Is it second hand one, but it is as new. I ve just customized it for my needs and latter I'll insert some pictures here. Next weeks I'll ask our police about milled slide procedures approval. If this will be allowed to be done, then I'll buy a Docter II RDS.
 
#38 ·
Please listen to people that actually have time under using them. This comment isn't a bash on anyone that posted in this thread, but after reading most of what everyone said, no one has any clear idea of what they're talking about... Also I apologize for the late response. Below is a video of Aaron Cowan explaining the philosophy of use of the RDS and it's advantages.

Here are his credentials http://www.sagedynamics.org/untitled-sitepage_16

Enjoy...

 
#39 ·
Good video. You can watch the last 3-5 minutes and get the idea.

I've used them on my target guns for several years. I even adopted them for shotgun, rifle, and for hunting. The transition was much easier when it came to a defensive platform.

The key is bringing the sights up to eye level. Not bringing your eyes down to sight level. Yes, it takes hand/eye coordination to bring the dot into play, but never take your eyes off of the target.
 
#45 ·
Thanks for this awesome video, but I've found no substantial advantage for me. As the author mentioned is not possible to overtake +10 years of iron shooting in different condition only with some thousands rounds. You have to use RDS constantly in different circumstances. That's mean lot of money to be invested in equipment and rounds. Fortunately is not my case looking for the rear sight firstly as the brain shortcut, then align with the front and after then shooting.

Mine for 1 to 10 yards is (here is prohibited to have round into the chamber with the gun holstered): fighting boxing posture, both eyes are staring at the little point on the target, pull the pullover with lefty almost under my chin, lateral movement to the left or right, starting with the leg corespondent to direction. In the meantime lefty catch the slide, in the pistol's up travel to the eye lines, rack the slide under the eye line and in the time pistol start travel straight, in the line of eye, my eye see front sight, appearing on the point were are staring at. Just a fractions of second before pistol reach his maximum elongation point, I've allready start shooting. I use only strong hand for shooting and my lefty stay under the chin in the neck area, where the inertia of racking the slide pushed it. All this procedures take 1.00 - 1.50 seconds. For point and shoot, target at 3-5 yards, my time is 0.85-1.00 s.

I have K1 and FMA +10 training and for contact distance I use 2 hands strike together with get of the x, prior to shooting. Combative measures before fighting is a must before shooting. Some time you have to earn the right to access your side gun
 
#46 ·
Thanks for this awesome video, but I've found no substantial advantage for me. As the author mentioned is not possible to overtake +10 years of iron shooting in different condition only with some thousands rounds. You have to use RDS constantly in different circumstances. That's mean lot of money to be invested in equipment and rounds. Fortunately is not my case looking for the rear sight firstly as the brain shortcut, then align with the front and after then shooting.
That's where you're incorrect. How do you know how long your learning curve will be if you've never tried an RDS? An RDS can only help you shoot. I would buy one and train with it where you can with live rounds, and do dry fire out of the holster practice when you don't have the luxury of having ammo. Carry with irons only until you are comfortable carrying your sidearm with an RDS attached to it. In the end, completely up to you.
 
#47 ·
I've just assume based on what I've seen and read about this subject. You are right, it is possible to be a very fast transfer between the iron and optic for me, due my good pistol presentation, consistency and hard grip and fast trigger press. For sure this is the future and we have to accommodate with it.
 
#48 ·
I've just assume based on what I've seen and read about this subject. You are right, it is possible to be a very fast transfer between the iron and optic for me, due my good pistol presentation, consistency and hard grip and fast trigger press. For sure this is the future and we have to accommodate with it.
Absolutely. You sound like a guy that is methodical and diligent about pistol tactics. I say go for it and report back your progress. Good luck!
 
#49 ·
I'll will let you to know when I ve installed one RDS on my G 34, or maybe finding and shooting one in the range.
 
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#50 · (Edited)
Some dry fire training at home, with my new G34 who was customized by myself. It was a lot of hard work to do but, for sure it is worth the price!

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#54 ·
In a IDPA match Gen 5 G34 didn't made me a better shooter than Gen 4 G34 (with Vogel sights and trriger).

I recentlly made a comparison between Glock 34 gen 5 competition pistol (this time with Vortex Venom RDS) and Glock 19 gen 4 with Ameriglo I dot tritium and fiber front sight (as CCW). I have fired 2x100 rds, drills of up to 12 rds, reloads, moving, etc ... with IDPA targets, scores and penalties. Overall G19 won (6 out of 10) being best ranked at 2 yards strong hand only no sight at all. The G34 ranked best at the 20 yards target (6 cartridges as fast I can).

I have to mention that it is only a second time when I use the red dot system. By instinctively shooting for many years, I immediately found the red dot, but not as fast as the front sight or the top of the barell. So I may coclude that for self defence scenario, up to 10 yards RDS is not a better option for me.
 
#56 ·
I made G34 gen 5 mos vs G19 comparation at the range, becouse I ve sold my former G34 standard gen4 and I can t compare the same platform pistol with and without rds
 
#58 · (Edited)
I can t compare the same platform pistol with and without rds
You could buy just a slide (FYI, if interested).

I've had a G17 gen4, completely stock. Just yesterday for Christmas, I got a MOS slide with internals, barrel, recoil spring, and Vortex Venom to go on it.

So to compare, I can just swap slides. I also got laser grips for my revolver :)

 
#59 ·
The Gen 5 19 is one of the few pistols that I have had that right out of the box I couldn't find at least one thing I didn't like or felt that could be improved on. There must be something but I'm just too stupid to find it Several thousand rounds later and still find it a great gun for my EDC CC.
 
#60 ·
I have to mention that it is only a second time when I use the red dot system. By instinctively shooting for many years, I immediately found the red dot, but not as fast as the front sight or the top of the barell. So I may coclude that for self defence scenario, up to 10 yards RDS is not a better option for me.
That seems to be a common theme among red dot deniers. "I tried it... twice even!"
 
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#61 ·
Have tried the Laser (was even given one by one of the top companies for my snub nose S&W when I was a cop) and also bought a red dot for my FN and just couldn't adjust. If I was doing a drill when I was behind a barricade and had time to aim using the red dot or laser, it was incredible, but when drawing the gun or shooting from low ready under timed fire found that chasing the dot or laser slowed me down and I was much faster using traditional sights shooting from an Isosceles position that I had practiced thousands of times. Muscle memory, getting a flash front sight or simply getting a pretty good sight picture in 1 1/2 to 2 seconds (whatever you want to call it) worked better for me. Obviously, if you can use the dot or laser with a lot of practice, you'll be ahead of the game, based on using my Eotech on the AR-15, but for my pistol shooting, am going with standard sights.
 
#62 ·
I've noticed hasty traces of wear to the Glock's 34th generation 5 MOS, that I've never seen before at any of my Glocks (9x19, .40 or .45).

For example, throgh G35 and 34th gen 4, I shoot thousands of rds and hundreds of hours of dry firing, and the barrel looks near impeccable.

Below are pictures of my present G19 gen 4 (2.000 rds and 2 years of dry firing) vs. G.34 gen 5 MOS (400 rds and max 2 hours of dry firing).

Has Glock dropped the quality of its products or is it an isolated situation caused by.......
 

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