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I blew my Glock up, please tell me how!

26K views 358 replies 85 participants last post by  Larry Baumann 
#1 ·
Hey all,

Brand new member! I figured I'd start off with a bang!

I have been a Glock shooter for years, but I've only been reloading for about a year. I average around 1,500 rounds a month (99% of which are through my Glock 34), all handloads, which puts me at roughly 18k reloads. Until today, the worst problem I have ever had was some light primer strikes when I replaced the striker spring and a few stovepipes. Those issues were solved with a lightened striker and lightened recoil spring, respectively.

Today I was running a drill where I load one round at a time, draw from the holster and fire. About 100 rounds into it, something strange happens... the fireball that normally shoots toward the target appears to be coming my direction and for some strange reason my trigger finger hurts.

I take full responsibility for this catastrophic failure, but I turn to more experienced reloaders to tell me why it happened. My guess is a double charge. I was attempting to load 3.75 grains of TG with 124 grain Xtremes. I will have to test this theory as I am not sure the bullet would seat with 7.5 grains. I'm not denying the possibility of a double charge, but it seems like it would be almost deliberate on a progressive press.

My frame is split, the magazine is trashed and the case split in the middle and has the worst case of case-head separation I have ever seen.

Please advise. Thank you for your time. I will post pictures shortly.
 
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#287 ·
It's more likely the object between the shoulders than the press....

I do have a Lee 1000, is it a great press, No. But it does work fairly well if you set it up as a cookie cutter type press and leave it alone. Are there stoppages now and then , Yes, I find esp with the primer feed causing a stop. When this happens, it a must check as what's going on with the cases in the press at the time. Like mentioned, you can't blindly pull the handle and if something screws up, its a must stop.
If you do a good check, the problem doesn't happen ( I try not to load more than an hour or two at a time as I find myself turning robot )
 
#288 ·
Its actually easier to double loading ss if your technique is flawed. Plenty of kb have been done using loading blocks of 50-100. Regardless of press, you need to resist being a handle puller. I've put up maybe 200k rds now on a 550 & 650 with no issues. Just pay attention.:dunno:
I agree. I have never doubled, but I have had a few primer only squibs. Every single one was done on my Rock Chucker with loading blocks and a hand drop. I feel when loading on a single stage press, diligence has to go up. A zero defect process is easier with a smooth progressive.
 
#289 ·
W
What would make you think you needed parts in your gun, with light primer strikes? Light primer strikes, from a guy that hasn't been reloading long, is most likely due to YOUR negligence, NOT Glock's! I love you guys that monkey with stock guns, as the answer to YOUR problems
 
#290 ·
BUT, parts do wear out & need replacing. Even on the infamous Glock. FWIW, I've seen a lot of light primer strikes with factory ammo & "tuned" triggers in Glocks.
 
#292 ·
Yet shoot enough & you will find an issue with mass produced, cheap factory ammo too. A round of ammo properly put together is safe, handload or factory.
 
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#293 ·
My statement [in context] was no gun firing out of battery has ever destroyed a gun. I have to totally disagree with danbocog's statement here. I can show you plenty of instances of Auto loading rifles firing out of battery that did take the rifle apart. Have a M1 Garand fire out of battery and see what happens for instance.

Ok I did not read the whole thread but I read enough to get there must of been a double charge loaded on a Lee progressive. Glocks are pretty strong pistols but I know of a friend of mine who did about the same as you did because his reloading mentor (mistakenly) suggested the manuals were conservative and one could go a gr. over max loads with no problem. I know of one other who got a double charge and it cracked the chamber. The pistol, a G35, still functioned, but it had very funny looking 40 brass.

I'm glad you are OK. Materials things came be replaced it those body parts that get a little hard and expensive to replace.
 
#294 ·
My statement [in context]
Ok I did not read the whole thread but I read enough to get there must of been a double charge loaded on a Lee progressive. Glocks are pretty strong pistols but I know of a friend of mine who did about the same as you did because his reloading mentor (mistakenly) suggested the manuals were conservative and one could go a gr. over max loads with no problem. I know of one other who got a double charge and it cracked the chamber. The pistol, a G35, still functioned, but it had very funny looking 40 brass.
.
Yeah he needs a new mentor for sure. While some manuals are conservative, some, like the Speer are pretty much riding the edge. Not to mention powder burn rates & case volume roll in being able to go over book max. A 1gr over with a slow powder in say 44mag is not 1gr over with TG in a 9mm.:eek:kie:
 
#295 ·
Fred I agree 100% with you. I believe he is using a Speer not sure of the number. I think this guy has blown up 3 pistol's now. 1 Glock and 2 wheel guns. He was a Army Officer and a school teacher. I would think buy now he would have figured it out. I have come to the conclusion there are those who should give up reloading and buy factory only.
 
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#296 ·
KIDCOP, so you have never been present for an actual OoB gun destruction, but have only seen photos/videos with the common excuse that the cause was a weak case, loose chamber or firing out of battery? Unfortunately this nonsense has been around long before all the internet gurus had the ability to expose their ignorance to the masses.
Some time ago a poster in these forums gave a lengthy explanation of what happens when a cartridge fires while not in battery. He uses examples of why your water heater, boiler in a factory, the radiator in your car do not explode when pressure exceeds their design limits. It is because of a pressure relief valve.
What do you think will happen if you fire a cartridge just lying on the ground unrestrained in any way? The bullet will most often move only a few inches, the case will move sometimes a few feet. Most often the case will be undamaged, but may split on occasion if the bullet is over crimped or the primer is not ejected first. It's the example of a pressure relief valve. Nothing exciting happens if the pressure is not contained in a chamber and the bullet is forced out of the barrel.
A fun science experiment [insert standard disclaimer] take a flimsy paint can, pour in an inch of gasoline, put in the cartridge of your choice, light gasoline. Run as fast an as far as you deem safe, then wait. It want be long until the massive explosion occurs LMAO. The greatest danger is the gasoline maybe blown from the can and set fire to the surrounding area. Except for a few magnum, heavily crimped rifle rounds you will find the case, primer and bullet in the can.
For what happens to an M1 Garand in .308 Win. when an over pressure round is fired go to youtube channel [theKGB65] "what caused my M1 Garand to blowup". He speaks slowly and softly but I find him to be one of the few intelligent youtubers. If you have not learned how to detail strip, clean and reassemble your Glock he has the best video on the internet.
Let the TROLLING begin.
 
#300 · (Edited)
If you must know I have not been present at a gun blow up. BUT I have held the fire arm and talked to the victim in person after the fact. First one was still at the range. Happened to a friend of mine right before I got there. It was an over charge of Bullseye.

Your guy with the water heater was not dealing with upwards of 50,000 PSI either in a rifle or even 35,000 psi in a 357. Not the same. Sorry Boilers have relief valves to keep things from blowing up.

UTube doesn't excite me so I don't pay much attention to them. Also be aware I am A Glock Armorer with the book. So I think I know how to detail strip a Glock. I know how to build repair a 1911 so it will function 100%.

Probably what causes a M1 Garand to blow up is an extreme over pressure with a bad round (decomposing powder) or a slam fire with the round firing before the bolt is in battery. If have not been called troll before and even though I've been away for awhile I still have more time here than you. I have a 308 M1, do you? I shot it in competition when I thought only real men shot 308 or until I discovered the value of a good tuned AR. I've also probably owned a M1 Garand longer than you have been alive.

Have a M1 or a M14 fire out of battery (slam fire) and there is a good chance the op rod will poke you in the eye. Read Hatchers notebook them come talk to me. you might be a little smarter than a steam registrar.
 
#299 ·
Have model 21/45 ..... Load 230 grain fmj .. Winchester LP primer
5.5 grains Winchester 231 powder just opened (8lb) ( new container) doubled checked everything. Weights even against other scales. Measurements /case gauge Dead nuts .... blue up lower number 1/ burn hole just above bottom of brass
Dropped to 4.5 231 powder Winchester /230 fmj and had my gunsmith double check ........... Good to go! Blue up lower number2
Burn hole in same place. ( both Fed) brass
Glock look at lower 1 Glock said it was not caused by over pressure
Slide was closed. Was not out of battery. Anyone have an idea?
 
#301 ·
Have model 21/45 ..... Load 230 grain fmj .. Winchester LP primer
5.5 grains Winchester 231 powder just opened (8lb) ( new container) doubled checked everything. Weights even against other scales. Measurements /case gauge Dead nuts .... blue up lower number 1/ burn hole just above bottom of brass
Dropped to 4.5 231 powder Winchester /230 fmj and had my gunsmith double check ........... Good to go! Blue up lower number2
Burn hole in same place. ( both Fed) brass
Glock look at lower 1 Glock said it was not caused by over pressure
Slide was closed. Was not out of battery. Anyone have an idea?
There's really little information in your post to base guesses on. Pics of the frame damage and brass would help.
 
#302 ·
KIDCOP, I did not call you a troll. That last comment was meant for those that repeatedly blame their own destroyed firearms on weak brass, unsupported chambers and Glocks firing out of battery. I fully expected them to attack me with their personal and internet wisdom to blame anything other than their own mistake in reloading.

The example of water heaters is still valid as a cartridge that does fire out of battery will never reach 50,000 PSI. as the gas that creates that pressure is almost instantly vented. Please direct me to one of the examples of a gun of any kind that has been destroyed by an out of battery firing. Pictures of the aftermath and some buffoon saying that the round could not have been overcharged because they loaded it themselves does not count.

I directed you and others to a youtuber to show an honest appraisal of an M1 Garand destruction, not some unreasonable speculation of firing out of battery.

So you must have fought in WWII. I will be 68 in May.
 
#303 · (Edited)
Danbocog, I surrender to your superior age but only by a little. The Speer 13 for example shows the '06 operates at 50,000 cup. I'm not sure how a copper unit compares to psi but my guess it is a lot. 308 operates at 52,000 cup.

that said show me a M1 that has been returned to service after experiencing a slam fire which is an out of battery condition. With the worse case the bolt should have went out the back of the receiver and the op rod poking you in the eye. (we are talking about a 30-06 going off with an unlocked bolt after all. And that my friend will cause a rather rapid disassembly.

Once the cartridge is in the chamber, it is semi enclosed and it will build some pressure out of both ends. The gas will take the path of least resistance which is the bolt face. I am not saying a cartridge thrown in an fire for example will build any more pressure than what it takes to rupture the case. Then the bullet stays put and the brass goes flying away. (try to convince a liberal of that one)

The M1 Garand is a strong rifle. A friend of mine who has now passed away last month fired some old WWII vintage '06 in one of his Garands. Blew and splintered the stock right off of it. Took a round apart to find the powder had gone bad with brown dust in it. We pulled down the remaining several hundred rounds, punched the primer, swaged and reloaded the brass and bullets with fresh powder. That was 30 years ago and I still have some of that brass. If I recall the M1 got a new stock and trigger guard.

My Win 61 which was built in 1938 fired out of battery once. It ruptured the cartridge and spit brass at me with no damage to the rifle. I took it to the gun smith to have worn parts replaced in order to keep it from coming out of battery once the slide was closed. Works great now. But the .22LR has no where near the operating pressures of a center fire.

There were several other posters who also suggested the OP had over charged the case on his Glock and you didn't question them. Might have even been bullet set back. And like already posted a friend of mine fired an over charged round in his Glock and it cracked the frame. Glock sold him a new frame. My old boss shot some over charged 40 in his G35. It cracked the chamber but the pistol still functioned. Ejected brass looked funny but it still functioned.

Unsupported chambers are a concern at times. Glock smiley faces actually happen. With normal reloading procedures these are not a problem but, but remember there are those who just have to push the limits. I don't reload to be the biggest, badest or loudest one on the block. I reload because I can build ammo cheaper that will put as many bullets in the same hole as I can. And that normally doesn't burn the grass down in front of my muzzle.

We are both probably old farts and arguing while fun is probably fruitless.
 
#304 · (Edited)
Grant wrote: I've been reloading.357mag and .45acp for 30yrs(yeah I'm old). I ditched the Lee 1000 after I blew up my Conan Custom. My standard loads had been 14.5grs of Blue Dot under a 125gr jhp. As I said, been doing this along time before a kaboom.

Grant you know Speer warned about this load years back. While fun with lots of fire out of a wheel gun, Speer figured out there was some over pressure issues with Blue Dot and 125's. Blue Dot is my favorite 357 pistol powder but I won't load 125's with it.

Back in another life time I was in a reserve academy in California and we were doing a night shoot. I had loaded up some 38's for a friend and me for the class. Being me I loaded a 357 round with Blue Dot. The firearms instructors stood on both side of me to watch my performance. With my 6 inch 686 it went bang, bang, bang, bang BOOM and it was like a camera flash. Both instructors peeled away yelling what the #%*! was that. I still have to giggle about that one once in awhile. Thank goodness no one did that to me when I was teaching firearms to a reserve class.
 
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#305 ·
Hello KIDCOP, we have both reached the the age of sensibility that youth is lacking.
I don't know if we now agree that it takes extreme pressure to destroy a firearm of any kind especially a military rifle of the M1 Garand. Pressure that cannot be created in an out of battery firing.
I must take exception with your appraisal of an out of battery firing that the least avenue of resistance is the bolt. The bolt is easily 100 times heavier than the bullet, the old Newton's Law of Physics. There has not been a military rifle since the 18th century that allowed a design that would allow a bolt to exit the receiver. The receiver of the M1 Garand is the same diameter and thickness behind the bolt as the dimensions that encompass the cartridge so one would think they would be of equal strength.
I personally have never heard this myth of a OP rod poking out the eye of the shooter in an out of battery or slam fire occurrence. If you have not please watch KGB65 and note that the rear of the receiver shows virtually no damage. This was with factory ammunition, the manufacture admitted culpability. Herco [sp] sold as house brand by Gander Mountain.
Pictures/links of the evidence would be appreciated.
 
#306 ·
Dan, I'll work on that but unlike a blow back recoil system the M1 is powered by the gas system which uses gas vented just prior to the bullet exiting the barrel. In the case of the tanker (I really dislike Tankers only 4 I think were built by SA and discontinued) It was a case of over pressure ammo. The shooter states so. He was lucky but the same happened to my friend when he shot a old USGI round. Plus there isn't a heck of a lot of metal holding the op rod onto the bolt of a M1. I've seen worn ones come right off when racking the bolt back.
 
#308 ·
FMJ /230 grain ....Winchester 231 and Lyman loading info....lyman starting is almost max on 45 cal/230. Was not doible load. No marks from slide or pin. Just bad load data. It de-gased like it should.
Load took out two Glock lower.
Lower charge on second gun( Lyman data again) I think 1911 can take it due to construction. What do you think? I learn by my mistakes....boy I have had my share. LOL. Ps was traveling abroad, sorry for delay.
 
#309 ·
FMJ /230 grain ....Winchester 231 and Lyman loading info....lyman starting is almost max on 45 cal/230. Was not doible load. No marks from slide or pin. Just bad load data. It de-gased like it should.
Load took out two Glock lower.
Lower charge on second gun( Lyman data again) I think 1911 can take it due to construction. What do you think? I learn by my mistakes....boy I have had my share. LOL. Ps was traveling abroad, sorry for delay.
Not sure I am reading your account correctly, but if I am, your conclusions are erroneous.
 
#313 ·
FMJ /230 grain ....Winchester 231 and Lyman loading info....lyman starting is almost max on 45 cal/230. Was not doible load. No marks from slide or pin. Just bad load data. It de-gased like it should.
Load took out two Glock lower.
Lower charge on second gun( Lyman data again) I think 1911 can take it due to construction. What do you think? I learn by my mistakes....boy I have had my share. LOL. Ps was traveling abroad, sorry for delay.
Wow! You are sure it was not a double charge? If it was lymans fault have you contacted them and let them know about that load?
 
#315 ·
The Tech at Glock said not a double load ..... he said pin and the slide will make a mark inside the pistols lower? I must be close to a high load. What I don't understand the Lyman loading book has been around forever. More likely me! Maybe just maybe a bad batch of powder, but Winchester 231 been around a long time. I have no ego... just need to know. I will not give up. I just don't want to "finger" it out the hard way. Not a scale issue, ruled that out five times over. Winchester swears (231) 4.2 to 5.3.
Just need a pistol to try. ( shipped)

Thx Lars.
 
#314 ·
I think personally this is a good reason why you have more than one reloading manual. The books I checked your load is over max except for the Lyman manual. You also need check weights.
Glocks are also designed if there is a KB to release pressure.I will take a Glock anyday over a 1911 for any KB. Of the KB I have seen and had one myself, very little damage is occurred to the shooter. But the Gun might be completely destroyed. My KB cost me $10.00 for a magazine.The trigger assembly was free.
 
#326 ·
Sorry Larry if I am having a hard time following your account, I am not getting a lot of sleep these days.

Are you saying 5.5gr of W231 under a 230gr FMJ blew up your G21?
Yes Hard to believe.
FYI I do a lot of driving and use voice Tex .... it's just does not awaly come over.
Will ,I think I was dead nuts on reload. I have all Dillon preses and Lyman and Dillon scales. Top line. Even bought 5 grain weights just to double check ,also use new fouler calapers and case gauge. Wenchester was a little bit defensive..... not sure why.
Now 5.7 x 28 was a hard load.
So I know I can do this.
I also don't sleep much...
I am glad to see and appreciate you sticking with me on this matter.
The bullet weights / versus loads don't make sense to me in manuals.
I may try a lighter load when my guns get back. Watch out for squib load.
Not breaking my number 3 Glock 21.
After this problem solved I will start on my GAP loads.
Your a good man weewilly
 
#321 ·
Most of my books say 5.1 is max. 5.5 with maybe some setback. Every gun is different or could be different in what max is. The guns that I have seen that had a squib and round behind it bulged the barrel. Plus he said it was the first round fired.
 
#322 ·
FMJ /230 grain ....Winchester 231 and Lyman loading info....lyman starting is almost max on 45 cal/230. Was not doible load. No marks from slide or pin. Just bad load data. It de-gased like it should.
Load took out two Glock lower.
Lower charge on second gun( Lyman data again) I think 1911 can take it due to construction. What do you think? I learn by my mistakes....boy I have had my share. LOL. Ps was traveling abroad, sorry for delay.
You realize you are not the only one loading off that manual so no, it is not the data. 95% of all gun kabooms, like plane crashes, are user error, not the equipment. I would wager the wrong powder charge OR wrong powder.
I had a coworker grenade his Ruger SBH. These guns are hell for stout. He claimed he loaded book data for BlueDot. So when I went to his house to offer my educated guess, what did I find on his bench but a jug of RedDot next to the jug of BD. Of course he denied loading the RD instead, but seeing both on the bench & the top strap peeled off his RSBH, I would bet the mortgage he loaded the wrong powder.
 
#327 ·
Funny you say that ,I am a commercial pilot. And yes we are the ones who usually ball up the aircraft.
No cross contamination. New powder keeped in powder vault / temp and humity controlled.
Even opened new second bottle for second kaboom.
I am very careful about that.
Called Wenchester and they said 4.2 to 5.3. They know something we don't?
 
#324 ·
All semi autos have some unsupported area in the camber. Some more than others, hard to get a round to feed out of a mag without some relief in the chamber. The unsupported chamber is over hyped. My stock G20sf, running normal pressure loads treats the brass just fine.
 
#334 ·
Agree Willy. In my youth i used to over load many diff rounds going way off the book. It takes a lot of over charge with most powders to get something to break. 2/10 over any book data with something like w231 in a low pressure round like the 45acp isnt taking anything apart.
In 40yrs of reloading, neber heard of any powder manuf mis labeling a powder. Bad lots now & then yes, but i am pretty sure that isnt what happened in LB 45.
 
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