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September Challenge

1K views 34 replies 7 participants last post by  ithaca_deerslayer 
#1 · (Edited)
Natural Point of Aim

Well, i got this idea partially from a post in the August Challenge. I use this drill when I teach new shooters to get them to understand Natural Point of Aim, but I bumped it up a bit because we are so good. It looks like everyone should be able to do this in your reported facilities. We won't do it this way, but here is how one guy does it.



I do this from 10 yards with a LARGE sheet of blank paper/cardboard (36"x36") . First, find you natural point of aim. Take your normal shooting stance and extend the gun toward the target. Note where you are aiming, adjust the target paper so that you are pointing to the middle of the paper. Do this a few times to make sure you are coming back to the same part of the target

Use any gun of 9mm or larger caliber ( we need the recoil ) and any sights ( you won't be using them).

Use any distance that is convenient. I will correct to a standard distance, based on a ratio., i.e., a 12" group @ 20 yards would be equivalent to a 6" group @ 10 yards.

Enter as many times as you wish.

Two strings of fire of 5 rounds easy, both free-style.

First String: From low ready, close your eyes, raise the gun and fire ONE round, then you can look. Do this five times and mark this first group. The idea is to get to your natural POA before breaking the shot

Second String: From low ready, close your eyes raise the gun, get to your POA and fire FIVE rounds in one string, without opening you eyes, at any pace you wish ( you don't have to beat Jerry's time ). The idea here is to get the gun back to POA from recoil before firing again. As Yoda or Ben or Jerry or whoever said it ; " Use the Force "

Report String 1 and String 2 group sizes C to C and the distance shot.
Winner is smallest total.

Since I shoot this half a dozen times or so a month; if I post the smallest total, I automatically disqualify myself and the second smallest group is the winner ( not real full of myself, am I :supergrin: )

SAFETY FIRST: Keep in mind you are shooting with your eyes closed and take appropriate precautions. OTOH, it is not as uncommon as it seems. I cannot count how many times I have seen new shooters close their eyes before pulling the trigger. If you are not hitting the target in string 1, re-assess where the problem is. Don't try String 2 unless you have a reasonable group in String 1. KEEP YOUR BULLETS IN THE BERM OR BACKSTOP.

Let me know if I missed anything or need to add some clarification

name - St1- St2- Total- yds----------Score

njl 5 1/16 -4 1/16- 9 1/8- 5---------18.25
Ithaca 4.6- 4.75- 9.35- 5 --------- 18.70
willie - 4 .125 - 7.25 - 11.375 -10---11.375 DQ
 
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#2 ·
This should be interesting...and hopefully not get anyone in trouble with their range :)

If I understand correctly, when shooting the first string, we can peek after each shot has been fired?

Since we're not looking at the target, I assume we can mark or tape over the holes from the first string before shooting the second string.
 
#3 ·
Yes, you can look after each shot on the First string only.

Yes, tape or mark the first string holes so they can be measured.

Discretion is probably the word of the day when you are doing this challenge; I would not advertise that you are shooting with your eyes closed. Every indoor range that I have been on that has been operating for a while has had holes in the ceiling and walls and lead smears on the floor, but yes, don't anyone try this on your home range if you are uncomfortable with it. Dry fire practice at home until you are comfortable presenting the gun to the same spot every time.

wp
 
#5 ·
Longer sight radius won't help a bit :supergrin: ; longer barrel may be somewhat helpful though.

wp
 
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#6 ·
You said "different", you weren't kidding. Fun too!
 
#7 ·
Well, you are the one that asked for it. :supergrin:

wp
 
#11 ·
I am looking for Gr 1 + Gr 2 total and distance. I'll probably standardize everything to 10 yds so you're in @ 18.70".

Good shooting. How did it feel?
 
#10 ·
Move the target closer (or bigger). When doing [GSSF] dry fire practice, I start from either low or close ready. I pick a small spot to aim at, come up, aim, and click. Half the point of the practice is coming up from the starting position to on target. Do it enough, and you end up with muscle memory, which should work for this challenge.
 
#12 ·
I can't move the target. I have to shoot targets in the frame and I have to shoot from behind the line. 50' is as close as I can get and only if no one else is shooting it. 50 ' is pretty popular with pistol shooters and the smallest of the frames. I used 25 yard frame today since it was open. I need a bigger target, I might of shot a great group but off the paper.
 
#14 ·
This turned out to be a bit harder than I thought. I started out with a big cardboard target at 10yds and found that I was having trouble consistently hitting paper. So, I moved up to 5yds and did a few tries with my 17, before my friend with the 226 Legion SAO showed up and said I should try a real gun. I got my best pair with his gun...including one hit on the "aiming point" I was using when practicing coming up from low ready eyes open and two shots touching each other in the second string.

I kept confusing myself, measuring from the 1" mark on the tape measure, so that's why some of the numbers look "corrected".

5 1/16" for the first string.
4 1/16" for the second string.
9 1/8" string 1 + string 2

 
#15 ·
Your friend may be right. The SIG probably lets you point more "naturally". Hence the point of the drill. Replace all your guns with SIG's. :supergrin:

wp
 
#18 ·
You're having to shoot from just over 16yds. I found I had to do this from 5yds in order to reliably be on the paper. At 16yds, I'd need a really big target.

My highschooler brought home another virus this week, just an upper respiratory one this time, so I don't think I'm going to even do any shooting this weekend.

BTW...I just talked to the friend who's Legion I shot (pictured above). It's currently back at Sig HQ due to the extractor having the claw break off.
 
#19 ·
From the original post.

"I do this from 10 yards with a LARGE sheet of blank paper/cardboard (36"x36")"

wp
 
#20 · (Edited)
I used a 8' x 4' sheet of brown wrapping paper from 50'. I think my second string was going over the top of it. It seemed pretty easy to pick a spot with my eyes open then fire with eyes closed and repeat but all shots with eyes closed didn't work out. This is just beyond my capabilities and limitations of my range.
 
#21 ·
I used a 8' x 4' sheet of brown wrapping paper from 50'. I think my second string was going over the top of it. It seemed pretty easy to pick a spot with my eyes open then fire with eyes closed and repeat but all shots with eyes closed didn't work out. This is just beyond my capabilities and limitations of my range.
If having to shoot from far away and set up a lot of paper, it is a hassle.

But for those who can shoot from 5 (sheet of paper) or 10 yards (2 sheets of paper), it is good practise :)
 
#22 ·
Maybe the October Challenge will be easier. Funny it seemed so easy picking a spot closing my eyes bringing the gun up and being more or less on target but couldn't do it for five rounds with eyes closed. Indid finish first in a Steel Challenge match today shooting a 617 S&W.
 
#23 · (Edited)
OK, here is mine shot from 10 yards. Had to DQ myself because I didn't follow directions :whistling: ; shot it from the holster with a G19. Most of the time I shoot the 19 better than the 17 or 34; just seems to handle/feel/fit better. 11.375

Gun Firearm Trigger Gun accessory Gun barrel
Gun Firearm Trigger Handwriting Gun accessory
 
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#25 · (Edited)
Sorry, I was joking. I did shoot it from the holster, but shot it as the challenge required - except the low ready thing , but as I posted in the original post, since I shoot this many times, I did not think it would be fair to compete( plus I didn't want to come up with the next challenge :supergrin: ), so I DQ'd myself for shooting from the holster instead of low ready.

wp
 
#26 ·
Looks like njl is this month's winner by the slightest of margin. Good shooting by both of the entrants.
 
#31 ·
Thanks. I've picked out a target for the October challenge. Now the question is, the distance and gun(s) to use. I'm thinking of restricting it to Glocks, but also about including "service rifle" and maybe adding up the scores for the pistol and rifle targets to come up with a final score.

How many would be in for that, defining "service rifle" as something at least very similar to what some military uses/has used (i.e. M1903, M1 Garand, M1 carbine, AR15, AR10, SKS, AK, etc.), iron or electronic dot sights (no magnification), at 50yds?

The target I've picked is http://www.targets.ws/shooting-targets/bullseye-target-3.pdf
When I print this, I have the option to "fit to page" or not. Printed each way I get:

not fit to page: outer ring is 1/4" from the edge of the paper, bullseye is just over 5/8" wide
fit to page: outer ring is 9/16" from the edge of the paper, bullseye is just under 5/8" wide

If people can generally print it to the first spec, I'd like to use that...but I'll go with whatever the majority are able to do.
 
#27 ·
Spent two weeks traipsing around FL with two toddlers. No range time for me this month. My apologies for not getting in on this one. Next month will be better... I hope

Congrats to NJL for taking it in September!
 
#32 ·
I can go either way.

wp
 
#33 ·
Thanks. I've picked out a target for the October challenge. Now the question is, the distance and gun(s) to use. I'm thinking of restricting it to Glocks, but also about including "service rifle" and maybe adding up the scores for the pistol and rifle targets to come up with a final score.

How many would be in for that, defining "service rifle" as something at least very similar to what some military uses/has used (i.e. M1903, M1 Garand, M1 carbine, AR15, AR10, SKS, AK, etc.), iron or electronic dot sights (no magnification), at 50yds?

The target I've picked is http://www.targets.ws/shooting-targets/bullseye-target-3.pdf
When I print this, I have the option to "fit to page" or not. Printed each way I get:

not fit to page: outer ring is 1/4" from the edge of the paper, bullseye is just over 5/8" wide
fit to page: outer ring is 9/16" from the edge of the paper, bullseye is just under 5/8" wide

If people can generally print it to the first spec, I'd like to use that...but I'll go with whatever the majority are able to do.
This sounds like fun.
If I can get to the range, I will be tickled to run it any way you decide sir.
 
#35 ·
Thanks. I've picked out a target for the October challenge. Now the question is, the distance and gun(s) to use. I'm thinking of restricting it to Glocks, but also about including "service rifle" and maybe adding up the scores for the pistol and rifle targets to come up with a final score.

How many would be in for that, defining "service rifle" as something at least very similar to what some military uses/has used (i.e. M1903, M1 Garand, M1 carbine, AR15, AR10, SKS, AK, etc.), iron or electronic dot sights (no magnification), at 50yds?

The target I've picked is http://www.targets.ws/shooting-targets/bullseye-target-3.pdf
When I print this, I have the option to "fit to page" or not. Printed each way I get:

not fit to page: outer ring is 1/4" from the edge of the paper, bullseye is just over 5/8" wide
fit to page: outer ring is 9/16" from the edge of the paper, bullseye is just under 5/8" wide

If people can generally print it to the first spec, I'd like to use that...but I'll go with whatever the majority are able to do.
I can do anything, but you might want to open up to any centerfire handgun and rifle, iron sights or red dot. Military flavor encouraged :)
 
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