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Anti-Alligator round / gun?

7K views 85 replies 43 participants last post by  DonD 
#1 ·
Anti-Alligator round / gun?


Getting read to move soon (So. Fla), looking at several homes either on canals or near freshwater. Finding an alligator in the backyard is MORE than a reasonable possibility after already living here for almost 30 years, but never under such a living condition prior to this.

Before we get started, of course MY FIRST COURSE OF ACTION WOULD BE TO CALL ANIMAL CONTROL OR THE GAME WARDEN BEFORE ALL ELSE!!!!!


Now, that said so everyone read it :) -

Forget my 9mm (please, let's be serious?:)), for get my .45s, hell even forget my AR in .223. I am NOT getting near one of these things close enough to "pop it" with a .22 rifle (I am NOT auditioning for the next season of "Swamp People" thank you very much :) ). I really don't want to buy a "bang stick" (long metal rod that holds a device that will fire a handgun cartridge at point blank rage like used for sharks and whatnot that I have seen several recommend online for hunting gators - which I have NO interest in), and I do not own a shotgun anymore, much less am sure that even one loaded with slugs is the answer to a gator's thick skull (?????).

Would anyone with any EXPERIENCE with gators recommend -

- a 4 inch .357 Mag?
- a 10mm (G20 - w/ full power, hard cast loads)?
- an AK in 7.62x39?
- a M1A in .308?

or again

- a shotgun loaded w/ slugs or other?
- anything else?


I've been thinking about this for about 2 weeks or so and trying to do some research online with little to no solid answers beyond "get on top of him and pop him in the back of the head with a .22 - that'll do it!!" - uh, no.................NO thanks. :( I'd rather do this from a distance if I can - preferably from closer to the house or a window if I could. :)



Choot' 'em now! Choot' 'em!!! :) <--------------(do NOT want this to be me :))




PS - The reality of this IS slim to none, it IS mainly just a good excuse to get another gun from the old lady. :) Hahahahahaha

Thanks -

Eric
 
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#48 ·
Ah yes, reading skills - hence the need for my disclaimer in BOLD print in my opening post also.............................


Thanks :) -
Ah yes, and wouldn't reading comprehension be useful as well, absent your BOLD disclaimer, you were still asking what firearm or caliber we would recommend. Forget your 9mm, grab a 4" .357 as you mentioned, if that makes you feel better about yourself. Have a nice day.
 
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#49 ·
I have lived in Florida since 1969 and never had a problem with a gator.I currently live across the street from a canal that I know has gators.They rarely want anything to do with humans and rarely attack unless you are near their nest in mating season.That being said,I once saw a gator killed from about 30 yards away with a 22 long rifle.Hell,those critters roam the golf courses here and I have yet to hear of a golfer being attacked by one,does'nt mean it hasn't happened but if it has it was the golfer probably doing something he shouldn't have done.My advice would be not to worry too much about it.
 
#50 ·
Hell,those critters roam the golf courses here and I have yet to hear of a golfer being attacked by one,does'nt mean it hasn't happened but if it has it was the golfer probably doing something he shouldn't have done.
Like waiting a perfectly good rifle range by building a golf course on it? :whistling:
 
#55 ·
9mm or .45? Noooooooooo, I never said that, what I DID say way " Forget my 9mm (please, let's be serious?:)), for get my .45s, hell even forget my AR in .223."

......and no, I would not rather use a .223 AR from distance (NOT right up on him at point blank) as opposed to a .30 cal round (7.62x39) out of an AK, AT DISTANCE.


And even then my initial question was even would a 7.62x39 round do it AT DISTANCE then?


Thanks -
 
#52 ·
The primary issue is accuracy. You want to hit its brain, which is a very small target. A .223 is way more than enough. If you're really worried about needing to kill a gator, I'd focus on learning where to shoot them from different angles.

But if you want a new gun, I saw .416 Rigby. Something in a double or with CRF. It is dangerous game after all.
 
#58 ·
"SRS, post: 23452070, member: 19549"]
Uh, no thanks - hence why I initially inquired b/c I did not want to get up on top of this thing to make a contact / small area shot, and wanted instead something big enough to take it out at distance. :(

I knew I could kill one with a .22 if I got right up on it and shot it point blank in the back of the head. That was NEVER my intention, and to restate the obvious yet again before anyone says it -
Are you planning to bring your .44 Magnum or long gun out on the patio when you barbecue or when you take the dog for a walk? If not, somebody is going to have to get it, which means the crisis isn’t imminent and the dog and people can get away. If gator gets your dog or a kid, there won’t be time for gator gun retrieval. You are going to have to use what you have. More important, and regardless of the gun you carry, you are going to have to get on top of the gator unless you are Wild Bill Hickok or you don’t care about collateral damage to the dog or kid, which kinda defeats the purpose of the specialty gator gun in the first place.
 
#56 · (Edited)
"SRS, post: 23452070, member: 19549"]The primary issue is accuracy. You want to hit its brain, which is a very small target. A .223 is way more than enough. If you're really worried about needing to kill a gator, I'd focus on learning where to shoot them from different angles.




Small area on a head shot on a moving target?

Uh, no thanks - hence why I initially inquired b/c I did not want to get up on top of this thing to make a contact / small area shot, and wanted instead something big enough to take it out at distance. :(

I knew I could kill one with a .22 if I got right up on it and shot it point blank in the back of the head. That was NEVER my intention, and to restate the obvious yet again before anyone says it -

MY FIRST PLAN IS TO CALL ANIMAL CONTROL BEFORE ALL ELSE!!!!


Nothing to do with you SRS, I just had to put that out there again for the people who are sure to make that comment yet AGAIN. :)
 
#59 ·
Eric: Of course, plan A, FWC. But anything goes horribly wrong, plan B, 12Ga Riot pump with slugs or buckshot. Not that Gators are some kind of super strong killing machine(they are when they are on the bite!), but pinpoint accuracy at speed is very hard. A slug or buckshot at medium close distance will eviscerate the entire brain and brain stem. Gators are very prehistoric and have poor nervous systems and will stay up for the fight if being aggressive or hungry. If you can't tear up the machine and drain the hydraulics, turn off the computer, as it were. FWIW.
Good luck, Bro. Stay alert for those bushwhackers, they are good at it.
 
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#61 ·
Thanks, the 12ga is looking to be more and more the answer, and as someone else said it's one of those things you should not be without anyway. :)

Thanks :)
 
#62 ·
My bangstick uses 12ga shells.

Call animal control, unless the thing crawls into your house. Then leave the house and then call animal control.

We used to find them in our pool all of the time.

Unless you get a brain shot, alligators don't go down easily.

Oh, and in short bursts, they can outrun you.
 
#64 ·
Call animal control, unless the thing crawls into your house. Then leave the house and then call animal control.We used to find them in our pool all of the time.
Unless you get a brain shot, alligators don't go down easily.
Oh, and in short bursts, they can outrun you.

Yep, this has been my argument all along and why I do NOT just want to use a ".22", was to NOT have to get up on top of this thing or near it (You know, as you said, that "short burts" thing. I do NOT want to get near it and want to do it from some distance if I HAVE to or can (???). Not to mention that whole swing tail thing back and forth that could easily knock on on their arse.......... :(

Again, I'm not out to join Troy Landry and his crew on "Swap People", I just want to be prepared as F14 said if all goes to hell before Wildlife Control can get there. :( :( :(
 
#63 ·
Yep, I agree w/ rds95991. But regardless, everybody needs a good Riot gun for immediate Home Defense. Get a Mossberg Maverick 88 in 12Ga w/ an 18" cylinder bore barrel and add a side saddle ammo rack. They work really well and they are plenty cheap. Do not buy a Chinese or Filipino scatter gun. While they are cheap and look and feel nice, operational longevity and repair issues are a big problem, trust me. Oh, and when you get a scattergun, sling it, too.
Then if you need it for human or reptile beasties, you have it.
 
#65 ·
Yeah I'll probably go with that (Mossy) or another Rem 870. I had a REALLY nice 870 till I sold it like a dope. :( It would have been totally overkill for this kind of thing, but she was setup sweet when I sold her -





I've come to learn that shotguns are a LOT easier to shoot with traditional should stocks on them, and in that configuration the Mossy safety is much easier to manipulate. That's what I'll probably run with this time.

I'll give the 870 this, it IS a sold gun and pretty much the stick most pump guns are measured by, but for a pistol grip / tactical stock setup (like the one in my pick) I like the location of it's safety better than I do the Mossy's.


Thanks -
 
#66 ·
I have lived in Florida for 50 years, have been around alligators plenty while fishing, kayaking, and such, and have had a few for patients as a veterinarian. They are amazingly strong, amazingly quick, and, as a few have said, have a very small central nervous system. Personally, I would think trying to hit that little tiny brain with a large caliber firearm when it has a loved one, or even a pet, in its enormous mouth an inch or two away from the aforementioned tiny brain, is foolhardy. Your best chance is a bat or a board, beat them on the nose and hope they let go. Killing an alligator that already has a grip on prey with a firearm is not going to work.
 
#68 ·
Eric, The Maverick 88 has a cross bolt safety on the trigger group, like the 870. If you want the back of receiver thumb safety, you will have to buy a full Mossberg 500 or 590(MilSpec gun). Price is about the same as an 870 then.
Best of luck, Bro. Everybody has given good advice.
 
#69 ·
Oh, and like you said, forget the "Tactical" stock, they are pretty useless. Conventional stocks are better for high speed handling and use, trust me.
Have fun.
 
#71 ·
Yeah I found that out the hard way, first with the Speedfeed tactical on in the picture, and later with a Knoxx Recoil Reducing Tactical one :( -




Yeah, my next scatter gun will have a traditional style stock on it for sure, hard lesson learned. :(
 
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#72 ·
Also Eric, I have found that the traditional bead sight works just fine for slugs at any reasonable distance you can shoot a slug to, so do not worry about rifle or slug sights. Of course, you can, if you want, it's your gun. But rifle sights on a shotgun tend to hang on stuff and can tear up your hand. Just thought I would say. Best of luck.
 
#74 ·
I was at my Grandmothers place some years back and started to head out to the back yard and was told, "Honey you can't go out there. They haven't picked up Ralf yet." She said with a grin. I asked who is Ralf and who has to pick him up. I was thinking of some drunk guy from around the block.

"It's a Gator that has decided to move into the back yard. I named him Ralf. I called yesterday to have them come and get him and was told today that they will be out by noon. It's big enough to bust the sliding door.

I looked out the back door and saw the thing sunning its self out on the lawn next to the pool. It was about 8' long.

Two guys showed up about a hour later and took it off after about 15 minutes of fighting with it.
 
#75 ·
A .22 LR in the brain is the ticket. It has always worked for me.

Hit them anywhere else with anything else and all you get is excitement. Lizard neurology and vascular systems aren't as fragile as those on warm blooded animals.

BTW, leave the darn things alone unless you have a permit. Unless you are really foolish, one on land won't hurt you. Call F&W and let them handle it.
 
#77 ·
A .22 LR in the brain is the ticket. It has always worked for me.
Hit them anywhere else with anything else and all you get is excitement. Lizard neurology and vascular systems aren't as fragile as those on warm blooded animals.
So basically I've been pretty much right from the get go, if I don't want to get right up on top of one of these things, you can pretty much forget ANY handgun caliber - much less a 10mm, .357, or even a .44 from any kind of DISTANCE.

How do you feel about the 12 ga. thing with slugs or even buckshot, or any rifle caliber from a DISTANCE (again, NOT right up on it)? I have a hard time believing any thing above .30 caliber won't put one down, but again as you said I am one of those who have NO experience with one of these things, and I am also NOT about to argue with anyone who DOES, much less want to piss one of these animals off either God forbid. :(


BTW, leave the darn things alone unless you have a permit. Unless you are really foolish, one on land won't hurt you. Call F&W and let them handle it.
That has been the first plan from the get go, I just want a plan "B" ready to go if all goes to hell in a hand basket for some stupid reason (like a lot of other things in life too). :(


Thanks for your input :) -

Eric
 
#78 ·
How do you feel about the 12 ga. thing with slugs or even buckshot, or any rifle caliber from a DISTANCE (again, NOT right up on it)? I have a hard time believing any thing above .30 caliber won't put one down, but again as you said I am one of those who have NO experience with one of these things, and I am also NOT about to argue with anyone who DOES, much less want to piss one of these animals off either God forbid. :(






Eric
A .22LR will do no more or no less damage than a .30-06 if you miss the brainpan. The bigger caliber may be a lot messier, and yep, you killed it, but it won't know that for another 20 minutes.

At one of the gator farms watched a big gator bite the leg and tail off a smaller one, could see intestines floating in the water. The smaller gator just started dog paddling to the edge of the water and was stretched out on the bank like nothing happened. Eventually another gator grabbed it and finished it off, but it was still alive.
 
#79 ·
The gun you have set up for zombies will work just fine. Alligators are all,over the place down here, but the vast majority stay the Fred away from humans unless said humans are dumb enough to feed the gators or have a brace of yapping Yorkies romping in the water, sounding like Purina Gator Chow. 15 years ago, the wife of a friend shot a gator that was heading for her pool. She used a 38spcl to dispatch it. She got away with it because she is cute, about 5' and cried a lot. Good luck using her technique to avoid issues. Shooting gators is most definitely frowned upon by the local gendarmes who will not be amused by you toting a 308 to take out a 7' gator that your grandma could wrestle into submission.
If you are in immediate danger, yes, blast away, making a special effort to not miss and thus take out the little kids next door in their backyard. Otherwise, keep an eye on it, call the cops who will call a licensed trapper who will escort it to gator heaven.

Crazy Canadian drivers are a real menace and are what you should be worried about.
 
#80 · (Edited)
Please don't test this! They are faster than you on that "short charge"



Don't ever try this. You do not know what the gator's "emotional state" is. A female defending a hidden nest will attack to hurt you. Any gator that feels cornered will fight.



Very true. You should avoid it at all costs, as you would any large, powerful, stupid, carnivorous, animal with lots of large teeth and sharp claws.



They can knock you off you feet with that tail! Then you don't move as fast.

A lot of that misinformation was labeled as such by people who have never seen an alligator in the wild. Alligators are perfectly adapted to their environment. They are stupid, but well programmed to function instantly in ways that amazingly effective. If you interact with them in their environment, you will lose.

The Swamp People are real, but they dramatize things a bit to keep your interest.

Best idea...avoid any large, powerful, stupid, carnivorous, animal with lots of large teeth and sharp claws.

Yeah, uhm, the way i know all the things I posted? I've handled an alligator or two over the past 25 years or so, from really little to 14 feet or so and every size in between..... All the things I posted are factually correct, knowledge gained over years of interaction with the animals in a variety of situations, from hunting, to trapping, to observing.....We do alligators pretty well down here; we have a lot of them ( the most of any state by far) and they are in a very warm environment 12 months out of the year (at least on this end of the state) so they never get slow or sluggish with cold the way they do some other places.....

Lastly. I wasn't recommending that anyone try to outrun an alligator or chase one with a broom; I was merely correcting some of the false information which had been put out in this thread by people with no first hand knowledge of the animals....
 
#81 ·
To stop a large lizard you have to hit the walnut sized brain. If you miss, the gator sometimes goes as crazy as a cat on a leash. To hit the brain it helps to be close. Most gator hunters shoot at about a foot or less. If you have a good, sighted in, .22 pistol you will be well armed for a gator encounter. Walk up slowly from the front and make one good shot to the brain. Just don't fool around...walk up and DO IT.

I say a .22 because accuracy is paramount. Flinching is not good here.

If you take your shot from ten yards and just wound him, Monsieur Gator will be a handful when the F&W guys show up. The removal team will hate on you!

If you want a standoff weapon, Use a RPG or pick up a Pak-40 on Ebay
 
#82 ·
Please don't test this! They are faster than you on that "short charge"



Don't ever try this. You do not know what the gator's "emotional state" is. A female defending a hidden nest will attack to hurt you. Any gator that feels cornered will fight.



Very true. You should avoid it at all costs, as you would any large, powerful, stupid, carnivorous, animal with lots of large teeth and sharp claws.



They can knock you off you feet with that tail! Then you don't move as fast.

A lot of that misinformation was labeled as such by people who have never seen an alligator in the wild. Alligators are perfectly adapted to their environment. They are stupid, but well programmed to function instantly in ways that amazingly effective. If you interact with them in their environment, you will lose.

The Swamp People are real, but they dramatize things a bit to keep your interest.

Best idea...avoid any large, powerful, stupid, carnivorous, animal with lots of large teeth and sharp claws.
I agree with you and I don't drink or do drugs.

I would ignore anyone that says they are not a
threat.

They are like sharks, bears and many other animals, there not a problem, normally, and
when they are they can kill you.

I don't know how fast a gator can run but it
is faster than 7 mph, there is lots of bad info and
I am not sure to believe.

https://www.reference.com/pets-animals/fast-can-alligators-run-land-b159e3e00598a8a2


Q.
How fast can alligators run on land?
A:
QUICK ANSWER
According to the Texas Parks and Wildlife Department, alligators can run up to 35 mph on land. Although these animals are frighteningly quick runners, they are only able achieve these speeds in short bursts and maintain it for only very short distances.

https://www.reference.com/pets-animals/fast-can-alligators-run-land-b159e3e00598a8a2#
-------------------------------------------------------

https://www.reference.com/pets-anim...r-dae8be14d15bdedc?qo=contentSimilarQuestions

Q:
What is the top speed of an alligator?
A:
QUICK ANSWER
Alligators are able to reach speeds of up to 11 mph on land and can swim up 20 mph in the water. They are faster in water because their short limbs and large tails are not well adapted for moving on land.

CONTINUE READING
KEEP LEARNING
https://www.google.com/#q=How fast is an alligator?&rct=j

https://www.google.com/#q=ALLIGATOR ATTACKS IN THE USA&rct=j

How many alligator attacks are there a year?
Alligators are the most common crocodilian in the United States. More alligator attacks have been reported in Florida than in any other state. Between 1948 and November 2012, the Florida Fish and Wildlife Commission recorded 348 alligator attacks on people. Of those, 22 led to fatalities, most of them swimmers.

List of fatal alligator attacks in the United States

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_alligator_attacks_in_the_United_States


When we are in Florida or in Idaho we always carry
a SS Ruger 357, we train with them at night and in
the day time, on the ranch we usually carry with
187gr fngc home cast boolits.

If you don't train with a handgun you may need a
long gun.

FWIW, if that 187 fngc will go through a 1200lb bear head or a 600lb elk I think it will go through
a gator head.

This guy knows his short gun rounds,

http://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/8521043/m/3831021902/p/1

posted 12 March 2015 10:27

But whatever you carry you need to be able to shoot well and quickly and have faith in it's penetration





Anyone who claims the 30-06 is ineffective has either not tried one, or is unwittingly commenting on their own marksmanship
Phil Shoemaker www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com

Posts: 2924 | Location: Bristol Bay | Registered: 24 April 2004
 
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