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Forum Newbie-What's The Most Accurate Glock Rig?

5K views 92 replies 39 participants last post by  harold63 
#1 · (Edited)
Hey Everybody,
I'm new to the forum and would like to know-

-What's the most accurate Glock configuration?


-Of all your Glocks do you have one that can wear out a steel plate or IDPA silhouette at 100 Yards or greater?


I'm sure many of you compete and hand load and even gunsmith so...

-I'd like to keep it relatively stock (not looking to build a race gun) but want a relatively factory stock gun (a few mods are ok) that I could carry if I wanted to. Everyday practicality and laser accuracy are my objectives.

I've read in a gun magazine that the Glock 17 is capable of killing small deer at 80 yards with good ammo like Hornady.

So...
The gun would Likely have a lighter trigger than factory, most precise but reliable sights, and some hand loads or really decent factory ammo like Hornady, Black Hills, Etc.

-I want this thing to group tight like a Les Baer, tuned Colt 1911, HK Mark23, or even a Sig P210. Laser accurate and flat shooting.

I'd consider a .45 but my best guess is the 9mm and .357 sig will have that flat trajectory to be accurate at 100 yards. I keep an open mind so maybe some .45acp shooters are tuning Glock 21s to be as accurate as Les Baers. I say 9mm and 357 sig because ballistics charts show they are very flat shooting rounds.

-I want this thing when modded up to outshine tuned 1911s in accuracy.

I believe Gastons creation is capable.

Thanks
 
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#3 ·
If any of you hand load what's the most accurate combo of brass, bullet, powder, and primer you've came up with for your Glock?

What's the farthest distance you have seen steel plates or standard man sized silhouettes hit with a Glock?

Ive seen b27 silhouettes hit at 100 yards with Beretta 92s and Sig P226 9mms.

I can make a bowling pin skip around at 100 yards with a Beretta 92f. Never tried it with a Glock but I Will when I mod out this gun.
 
#26 ·
You're doing VERY well if you can skip a bowling pin around at 100 yards. I was very proficient in IHMSA back in the 1980's and was a Triple-A rated competitive shooter. I couldn't do that with a TC Contender off-hand.

I could hit a standard IDPA target at 100 yards quite easily with any of my competition guns: CZ 75 TS, Glock 34, Sig Legion P226. Disclosure: I've never tried it off-hand. This is from a rested position. Off-hand, 50 to 70 yards would be where I could do it reliably.

You asked about ammo- 124 grain FMJ over 4 grains of Universal.
 
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#54 ·
I can make a bowling pin skip around at 100 yards with a Beretta 92f. Never tried it with a Glock but I Will when I mod out this gun.
Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.....

Suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuure you can.

Just skip and dance around, all day.
 
#57 ·
I am not sure why you are so skeptical. Reading around here for a few years now apparently most here can routinely hit a bowling pin at 100 yards with a handgun.
 
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#4 ·
I am going to guess it might take a fair amount of work to get a Glock to group like a P210 or some of the better 1911s.
 
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#20 ·
No guns are any more or less accurate than any shooters. They are 2 completely different things.
Ditto. A few years back I attempted to explain the difference. But ignorance abides.
I am going to guess it might take a fair amount of work to get a Glock to group like a P210 or some of the better 1911s.
No amount of work will turn a Glock into a 50 meter or 50 yards bullseye gun.

.
 
#6 ·
Hey Everybody,
I'm new to the forum and would like to know-

-What's the most accurate Glock configuration?

<snip>

-I want this thing when modded up to outshine tuned 1911s in accuracy.

I believe Gastons creation is capable.

Thanks
Good luck. In other words it would take a lot of money and time to get a Glock to shoot close like a...well setup 1911. Might as well buy a high end or custom 1911. Use your Glock pistols for general practical shooting and SD. Mi dos centavos.
 
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#7 · (Edited)
Hey Everybody,
I'm new to the forum and would like to know-

-What's the most accurate Glock configuration?


-Of all your Glocks do you have one that can wear out a steel plate or IDPA silhouette at 100 Yards or greater?


I'm sure many of you compete and hand load and even gunsmith so...

-I'd like to keep it relatively stock (not looking to build a race gun) but want a relatively factory stock gun (a few mods are ok) that I could carry if I wanted to. Everyday practicality and laser accuracy are my objectives.

I've read in a gun magazine that the Glock 17 is capable of killing small deer at 80 yards with good ammo like Hornady.

So...
The gun would Likely have a lighter trigger than factory, most precise but reliable sights, and some hand loads or really decent factory ammo like Hornady, Black Hills, Etc.

-I want this thing to group tight like a Les Baer, tuned Colt 1911, HK Mark23, or even a Sig P210. Laser accurate and flat shooting.

I'd consider a .45 but my best guess is the 9mm and .357 sig will have that flat trajectory to be accurate at 100 yards. I keep an open mind so maybe some .45acp shooters are tuning Glock 21s to be as accurate as Les Baers. I say 9mm and 357 sig because ballistics charts show they are very flat shooting rounds.

-I want this thing when modded up to outshine tuned 1911s in accuracy.

I believe Gastons creation is capable.

Thanks
All Glocks are more accurate than 99% of shooters, straight out of the box but you can fiddle around with your weapon of choice if you really want to. Hickock45 regularly hits a target at 80 yards with bog standard hand gun from the G26 on up and he has a better than 50% average at 240 yards with a little G27 - check out his videos.

By all means, change the trigger, sights, and the like but, apart from the cash outlay, you're basically stacking up excuses for lack of expertise. Practise, practise, practise, and then do some more!
 
#8 · (Edited)
IMHO, your goals are a bit unrealistic unless you have very deep pockets and are willing to spend the time and effort learning the fine points of marksmanship. Keep in mind that your Glock is a service type pistol that is built with rather loose tolerances to insure reliability while producing reasonable accuracy. The high end pistols that you mentioned are finely tuned and only produce excellent results in the hands of the experts. You can buy the finest equipment but you will never be able to buy the skill necessary to make it perform to it's full potential. I wish you good luck in your quest which likely is going to be a long and expensive journey.
 
#12 ·
Suggest You invest in time reading about ballistics, at 47 yards you reach a plateau relative to bullet drop for the 9mm.
Accuracy vs ease of shooting in shorter barrels vs longer sight pictures seems contradictory but holds truism.

You probably should find a Mentor and talk about realities in shooting, 100 yards is not a norm and 10 feet might be your first step.

Talking about reloading with someone just starting vs 50 years of exposure could take many moments to overview this Forum has some experience but is more general in nature.

I find many when it comes down to money, time invested in learning take short cuts. My questions to you:
1) how much time per week do you have to invest
2) are you a shooter, collector or hobbyist
3) what is your goal or objective
4) how much money do you expect to spend initially on the platform
5) what do you expect to spend on accessories.
6) are you considering reloading.

You also give an example to hunting if this is a consideration then familarity with your State regulations will dictate where to start.
 
#15 · (Edited)
I shot this, but it was off a rest that took out almost all human error. Still had to sight each shot. Though this is with the stock, adjustable, plastic sights, this group tool some time to shoot. I have 'floaters' in my eyes, so waiting on a clear field was kind of a hassle. At any rate, and doing my best with Stan Chen match ammo, this is the best I could do and I'm an X shooter from way back. The two small flyers on there are from a Sig Mosquito.

http://www.glocktalk.com/attachments/target-jpg.291169/

If I were going to buy a Glock for what you are wanting, I'd probably go with a G31 and a set of sights that offer a very tight 'sight picture' similar to the 1911 GI sights. MY opinion on sights for distance is the light that comes through has to be as minimal as possible, and when your arm is at its firing position, the light on each side of the picture should look like tiny cracks. Forget using dots on the sight for precision at distance...it's not going to happen. You need something more similar to a rifle sight. Everyone knows Hickok hits stuff at distance, but those shots are all over the target when he hits them. Actually getting a tight group with a Glock at distance takes a little more work.

Another thing with Glocks that I've noticed is 3 of the exact same gun (my 3 G41's, for example) all shoot different sized groups with the exact same ammo. Granted, the difference isn't big, but if I were to try to use one in a 'hit the X' competition, there is one of them I'd use, every time, over the other two.
 
#24 ·
I wonder how many Glocks could do a 2" group at 50 yards in a Ransom Rest. I wonder how many of which kinds of 1911s could. I wonder if all P210s could or maybe just most.
 
#25 ·
Cecil357, welcome to GT. There are a lot of very helpful and knowledgeable people here. As you can tell by now, there are cynics and those with strong opinions too. Most of them are just trying to be helpful too. And most are nice people too. I make my cynical posts every now and then. :)

Anyway, I appreciate your enthusiasm for the Glock platform but if I may, can I ask some questions and maybe we can help.

* Why are you set on a Glock if you already know you're going to have to do a bunch of work for improvements. If it is for the fun of customizing, I get it. If you really wanted a top performer though in the competition/accuracy realm though, there are probably better platforms to start with.
* Why are you looking at 100 meters? I compete in Steels and IDPA (not very well I might add) and 100 meters is not where the game is. As a matter of fact, neither is Les Baer-type accuracy (just my opinion). So, a Glock 34 could serve you well right of of the box.
* If you have a strong desire for a flat shooting, 100 yard pistol round, 10 mm ain't bad.
* How much experience do you have in shooting Glocks or pistols overall?

Welcome again to the forum. This will be a fun thread. ;-)
 
#30 · (Edited)
Cecil357, welcome to GT. There are a lot of very helpful and knowledgeable people here. As you can tell by now, there are cynics and those with strong opinions too. Most of them are just trying to be helpful too. And most are nice people too. I make my cynical posts every now and then. :)

Anyway, I appreciate your enthusiasm for the Glock platform but if I may, can I ask some questions and maybe we can help.

* Why are you set on a Glock if you already know you're going to have to do a bunch of work for improvements. If it is for the fun of customizing, I get it. If you really wanted a top performer though in the competition/accuracy realm though, there are probably better platforms to start with.
* Why are you looking at 100 meters? I compete in Steels and IDPA (not very well I might add) and 100 meters is not where the game is. As a matter of fact, neither is Les Baer-type accuracy (just my opinion). So, a Glock 34 could serve you well right of of the box.
* If you have a strong desire for a flat shooting, 100 yard pistol round, 10 mm ain't bad.
* How much experience do you have in shooting Glocks or pistols overall?

Welcome again to the forum. This will be a fun thread. ;-)
I've shot for years and tried out many guns.

Im the kind of guy who buys factory ammo and doesn't hand load and can go into a rental range and outshoot most people there. I can hit Coke cans at 30 yards standing firing relatively fast with a Sig P229 40sw.

I don't know much about HKs but in my own experience Tuned 1911s, Sigs, and Beretta 92s are the most accurate.

---
A main point I think I was trying to make that reading comments from the other posters clarified for me is this-
I want a stone rugged reliable large sized carry gun (and I'll carry full sized frame no problem) that's as accurately moded out without sacrificing reliability as a service pistol can be. A powerful,reliable,optimally accurate service pistol to test my target shooting skills with at distance is what Im going for here.

I'd like to get into hand loading. I love hearing someone break down their experiences and help me avoid making the same rookie errors so to be more efficient at developing supremely accurate loads with a shorter learning curve.

As far as budget I'd spend up to 2k on the pistol.

Why 100 or 200 yards?

For the fun and challenge of it- it's boring and easy to hit silhouettes at 25 yards and under with an accurate weapon.

I know in reality a centerfire autoloader service type pistol isn't effective for combat or hunting at 200 yards like some big bore revolvers could be but it would be fun to try and reach out as far as possible and challenge yourself as a shooter with distance targets. I've hit b27s at 100 yards with Glock 27s although it's 50/50 odds at that range unlike a Beretta 92 or P226 9mm which are virtual lasers at that distance. The G21 drops so bad it's a challenge to hit paper at 40 yards without compensating for drop. The 9 and 40 are so much more flat shooting. I love all calibers though so it's not a bash the 45 mindset here. The 45 is probably king for cqb.

It would be nice to use this gun for hunting and developing super accurate hand loads too.

My own personal view on firearms is I'd rather master one weapon system than be able to half ass use 14 different guns.

I'd rather be a very talented with one style weapon than mediocre on many.

Based on what I've said I'm thinking a 357 sig or 10mm in a full size or target frame is what I need.

Some guys say the long slide 9s and 40s are long range tack drivers.

For a gun you could carry, test yourself as a marksman at extended ranges (even 200yards), and even hunt with the G20 with some full power and optimally developed accurate hand loads is probably the answer.

What do you guys think?
 
#27 ·
Glocks are as accurate as the shooter behind the trigger, I don't shoot competition but will not keep a firearm of any kind that is not more accurate than I can shoot on my best day!

I finally picked up a 9mm handgun (G26) just last week, reason I refused to own one up until now is I have never personally shot a 9mm that was accurate IMO.
I do have a couple LWD conversion 9 barrels that I found a bullet/load combo that will shoot 3 shots under 1.5" @ 35 yds from a kneeling position which is how I accuracy test handguns as I am mainly a hunter and this position can almost always be used in the field.

With the 125 XTP (.357) /PP load mentioned above , the first 3 shots from G26 was .802 ctc from 25 yds. POA was bottom edge of paper.


I used a Gen 2 G22 last year for deer hunting ,LWD barrel/ Vortex dot

155 XTP/Longshot @ 50 yds/kneeling


Same load as above 100 yds/ kneeling



2 years ago I shot a Coyote @ 139 lasered yds off hand with G21/45 SUPER /compensated LWD barrel shooting a 185 XTP @ 1530 fps.
When I do my part it will shoot under 3" @ 100 yds for 3 shots.
 
#29 ·
Glocks are as accurate as the shooter behind the trigger, I don't shoot competition but will not keep a firearm of any kind that is not more accurate than I can shoot on my best day!

I finally picked up a 9mm handgun (G26) just last week, reason I refused to own one up until now is I have never personally shot a 9mm that was accurate IMO.
I do have a couple LWD conversion 9 barrels that I found a bullet/load combo that will shoot 3 shots under 1.5" @ 35 yds from a kneeling position which is how I accuracy test handguns as I am mainly a hunter and this position can almost always be used in the field.

With the 125 XTP (.357) /PP load mentioned above , the first 3 shots from G26 was .802 ctc from 25 yds. POA was bottom edge of paper.


I used a Gen 2 G22 last year for deer hunting ,LWD barrel/ Vortex dot

155 XTP/Longshot @ 50 yds/kneeling


Same load as above 100 yds/ kneeling



2 years ago I shot a Coyote @ 139 lasered yds off hand with G21/45 SUPER /compensated LWD barrel shooting a 185 XTP @ 1530 fps.
When I do my part it will shoot under 3" @ 100 yds for 3 shots.
Specifics like this are what Im looking to hear.
 
#31 ·
I've shot for years and tried out many guns.

Im the kind of guy who buys factory ammo and doesn't hand load and can go into a rental range and outshoot most people there. I can hit Coke cans at 30 yards standing firing relatively fast with a Sig P229 40sw.

I don't know much about HKs but in my own experience Tuned 1911s, Sigs, and Beretta 92s are the most accurate.

---
A main point I think I was trying to make that reading comments from the other posters clarified for me is this-
I want a stone rugged reliable large sized carry gun (and I'll carry full sized frame no problem) that's as accurately moded out without sacrificing reliability as a service pistol can be. A powerful,reliable,optimally accurate service pistol to test my target shooting skills with at distance is what Im going for here.

I'd like to get into hand loading. I love hearing someone break down their experiences and help me avoid making the same rookie errors so to be more efficient at developing supremely accurate loads with a shorter learning curve.

As far as budget I'd spend up to 2k on the pistol.

Why 100 or 200 yards?

For the fun and challenge of it- it's boring and easy to hit silhouettes at 25 yards and under with an accurate weapon.

I know in reality a centerfire autoloader service type pistol isn't effective for combat or hunting at 200 yards like some big bore revolvers could be but it would be fun to try and reach out as far as possible and challenge yourself as a shooter with distance targets. I've hit b27s at 100 yards with Glock 27s although it's 50/50 odds at that range unlike a Beretta 92 or P226 9mm which are virtual lasers at that distance. The G21 drops so bad it's a challenge to hit paper at 40 yards without compensating for drop. The 9 and 40 are so much more flat shooting. I love all calibers though so it's not a bash the 45 mindset here. The 45 is probably king for cqb.

It would be nice to use this gun for hunting and developing super accurate hand loads too.

My own personal view on firearms is I'd rather master one weapon system than be able to half ass use 14 different guns.

I'd rather be a very talented with one style weapon than mediocre on many.

Based on what I've said I'm thinking a 357 sig or 10mm in a full size or target frame is what I need.

Some guys say the long slide 9s and 40s are long range tack drivers.

For a gun you could carry, test yourself as a marksman at extended ranges (even 200yards), and even hunt with the G20 with some full power and optimally developed accurate hand loads is probably the answer.

What do you guys think?
I find reloading and shooting handguns for over 50 years some things have changed.

I no longer carry the model 29 in Smith in 6-1/2" flavor. My reloading is done on (2) Dillion 650's. Shooting at long ranges and hunting with handguns limits now shots at 100 yards or less. If I want to challenge myself shooting clay targets 4" at 65 yards with a Glock 26 makes for a good afternoon.

Accuracy mechanically from the Glock favors the shorter barrels, the ease of the operator though usually requires longer sight planes, many will argue this point.

Finding one platform to carry, Master , potentially hunt with is advisable and long term the most fiscally sound.

If you are NOT competing, the 10mm is favored to your needs and desires. Suggest you visit the reloading section for loads and suggested mods to do so.
Your issues moving forward, will be finding components to load, receipe comparison and many opinions. Good Luck.
 
#32 ·
I don't know much about HKs but in my own experience Tuned 1911s, Sigs, and Beretta 92s are the most accurate.
The G21 drops so bad it's a challenge to hit paper at 40 yards without compensating for drop.
What do you guys think?
In my experience, the HK USP is the most accurate polymer on the planet, period. I doubt, seriously, you'll find anyone that's shot one that will disagree. I've never shot a Beretta 92 that will shoot a super tight group. It's a tough, combat gun...not a bullseye gun. There is a reason an 'accurizer' was developed for that pistol.

If you do a 25yd zero with your G21, your bullet drop at 50yds will be around 1 to 1.5". At 75yds, it will be in the 3" range and around 7 to 8" at 100yds...all depending on ammo, of course. If you did a 50yd zero with your G21, I seriously doubt you'd ever be more than 2" high at 25 yds. I have an old propane tank that I shoot, on occasion, with a G41. I aim at the top of it 100yds out and it goes 'gong' every time. The bullet drop isn't what some may think it is, and the faster, 185 gr stuff is a little flatter shooting, even...somewhere in the 6" drop range with 25yd zero, at 100yds. The Magtech GG 185 grainers I use drop less than an inch at 50 yds with a 25yd zero.

I do agree that shooting a pistol at 100yds can be entertaining. It tests your trigger control and ability to use the sights, well, as well as the nerve (or keeping control of the nerve) of adding the extra distance, but that can all be translated shooting at closer distances. If you can shoot a 2" group at 25yds, that could translate to an 8" group at 100yds, given your ammo charge and bullet weights are exactly the same with each shot. Boolits that go 1350, 1375, and 1360 fps, at the muzzle, are going to have different drops at 100yds, no matter how stationary the pistol is while it's being fired.
 
#33 ·
No guns are any more or less accurate than any shooters. They are 2 completely different things.
It's a question of intrinsic accuracy. Off a rest, a gun will give a performance that few shooters could match off-hand. So, a handgun shouldn't necessarily be blamed just because a shooter can't use it to its maximum potential.
That is what I meant by the expression. Are there any other meanings?
 
#38 ·
It's a question of intrinsic accuracy. Off a rest, a gun will give a performance that few shooters could match off-hand. So, a handgun shouldn't necessarily be blamed just because a shooter can't use it to its maximum potential.
That is what I meant by the expression. Are there any other meanings?
You're making the same mistake again. Shooter accuracy and gun accuracy are 2 different things. They work together to make a result on paper, but they are independent variables. Ammo is a third independent variable. Shooting from a bench puts more mud in the water.

If we had 5 different guns, we could group all of them from a vise using the same ammo. Assuming the ammo worked pretty well in all 5 guns, that would give an idea of their relative accuracy.

If we had 5 different shooters, they could all use the same gun and ammo to shoot offhand groups at the same distance, and that would give an idea of their relative accuracy.

If we had 5 different ammo samples, we could use 1 gun in a vise to group them all at the same distance, and that would give an idea of their relative accuracy.

Saying that a gun is more accurate than a shooter or that a shooter can't match a gun's potential doesn't really mean anything. If my mechanical wobble at 20 yards is 3 inches and yours is 2 inches, you are about a third more accurate than me. If we both shoot a gun/ammo combination that groups 1 inch at 20 yards, my groups will likely be about 4 inches and yours will likely be about 3. It's tolerance stacking.

If I'm shooting in a USPSA or Steel Challenge format, I have a certain set of mechanical abilities to direct a sight picture to target, transition between targets, track sights on splits, etc. The performance of my gun/ammo combination is overlaid on that. If I direct the sight picture close to the edge of the A zone on paper, that's an Alpha in dry fire. With a more accurate gun, it's more likely to be a live Alpha. With a less accurate gun, there's a greater chance of it being a Charlie.

The tolerances are circles, so sometimes a relatively inaccurate gun will actually compensate for shooter error. For example, I direct the sight picture 1 inch into the C zone, but because the gun/ammo combination prints a 3 inch group at that distance, the hit happens to fall 2 inches inside the A zone, and I receive an Alpha. Of course things could have gone the other way, and I could have ended up with a marginal Delta for the same mechanical performance.

So statistically, over a series of groups or stages, the gun ammo combination tends to print circles around the shooter's mechanical wobble.
 
#34 · (Edited)
I wonder how many Glocks could do a 2" group at 50 yards in a Ransom Rest. I wonder how many of which kinds of 1911s could. I wonder if all P210s could or maybe just most.
Every milspec SIG P210 ever made has been factory tested to put ten bullets of Swiss PP41 9mm Para ordnance ammo into a 50mm circle at 50 meters out of a machine rest. (Later production gun tests were downgraded to six rounds.) According to current gun media tests, Magtech 115gr ammo does just as well as P41.
 
#35 ·
I believe he's simply saying the masses will never extract the full mechanical accuracy of a Glock pistol. The link for the 50 ud group I shot with a G34 doesn't represent full mechanical accuracy when you consider I still had to sight each shot. Putting that same gun with that ammo in a Ransom or equivalent type rest would no doubt shoot an even tighter group.

When you Ransom rest a pistol and it shoots a 2", 50 yd group and you take the same gun and do the same without a rest, you've gotten every bit of accuracy the gun has to offer. I'd say one in a million could actually do it, if it's that.
A Browning pattern, tilting barrel locked breech short recoil pistol with slide-mounted sights can shoot tighter groups with each shot aimed anew from a sandbag rest, than it would from a machine rest. The reason for this is that the correlation between the point of aim and the point of impact depends on the consistency of the barrel lockup to the slide, not the precision of the slide fit to the frame that gets attached to the machine rest.
 
#37 ·
Kinda like the argument that an AR with loose take down pins may be less accurate out of a rest than one that has tight pins, at least with a rest that doesn't need each shot resighted. I get what you're saying, but still, a Ransom is really the best way to find out the pistol's true mechanical accuracy. If you have a sloppy slide/frame mate but you know you have positive barrel lock up, then by all means...don't use a Ransom. I suspect that most of the time, though, the slide will begin in the same spot, shot after shot, with most semi's. What it does after the primer is hit, but before the boolit exits the barrel, is anyone's guess, especially if the ammo charges are relatively inconsistent.
 
#36 ·
I've shot for years and tried out many guns.

Im the kind of guy who buys factory ammo and doesn't hand load and can go into a rental range and outshoot most people there. I can hit Coke cans at 30 yards standing firing relatively fast with a Sig P229 40sw.

I don't know much about HKs but in my own experience Tuned 1911s, Sigs, and Beretta 92s are the most accurate.

---
A main point I think I was trying to make that reading comments from the other posters clarified for me is this-
I want a stone rugged reliable large sized carry gun (and I'll carry full sized frame no problem) that's as accurately moded out without sacrificing reliability as a service pistol can be. A powerful,reliable,optimally accurate service pistol to test my target shooting skills with at distance is what Im going for here.

I'd like to get into hand loading. I love hearing someone break down their experiences and help me avoid making the same rookie errors so to be more efficient at developing supremely accurate loads with a shorter learning curve.

As far as budget I'd spend up to 2k on the pistol.

Why 100 or 200 yards?

For the fun and challenge of it- it's boring and easy to hit silhouettes at 25 yards and under with an accurate weapon.

I know in reality a centerfire autoloader service type pistol isn't effective for combat or hunting at 200 yards like some big bore revolvers could be but it would be fun to try and reach out as far as possible and challenge yourself as a shooter with distance targets. I've hit b27s at 100 yards with Glock 27s although it's 50/50 odds at that range unlike a Beretta 92 or P226 9mm which are virtual lasers at that distance. The G21 drops so bad it's a challenge to hit paper at 40 yards without compensating for drop. The 9 and 40 are so much more flat shooting. I love all calibers though so it's not a bash the 45 mindset here. The 45 is probably king for cqb.

It would be nice to use this gun for hunting and developing super accurate hand loads too.

My own personal view on firearms is I'd rather master one weapon system than be able to half ass use 14 different guns.

I'd rather be a very talented with one style weapon than mediocre on many.

Based on what I've said I'm thinking a 357 sig or 10mm in a full size or target frame is what I need.

Some guys say the long slide 9s and 40s are long range tack drivers.

For a gun you could carry, test yourself as a marksman at extended ranges (even 200yards), and even hunt with the G20 with some full power and optimally developed accurate hand loads is probably the answer.

What do you guys think?
You keep on bringing up:
* Long range/flat shooting.
* Hunting.

With that in mind, I'd stick with the 10mm since you're not looking at revolvers.

Side note: You should have no issues "keep a .45 on paper" at 40 yards. The drop at 50 yards is no more than 2", depending on the load. I'd still stick with the 10mm given your parameters though.
 
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