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In Need of 10mm JHP Duty Load Advice

4K views 41 replies 30 participants last post by  DAVIDF 
#1 ·
Short version: What would you carry in a Glock 20SF as a duty load. The gun will be my new duty weapon. Opinions from officers and non-officers appreciated. JHP is the only requirement.


Long version: As I've mentioned in a past thread I have bought a Glock 20SF. It is approved by my department for use as a duty weapon. I have already bought a duty holster. I'm ordering sights today. Springs and a recoil guide rod from Wolff are going to be here any day. I've decided to speed things up and start putting in some range time with it soon. My new goal is to have it qualified in the next month. The only thing left is to decide on my duty load. Any JHP I want is fine but I'm sure some here have recommendations based on very specific reasons, research, and/or experiences. Any help will be appreciated. :)
 
#2 ·
I have a lot of experience loading and shooting 10mm in my G20's and G29's. After lots of analysis on recovery time, practical need against two legged targets, here is my recommendation: find an acceptable JHP round that runs at roughly 1150fps. The ideal round would be a 180gr Gold Dot or HST at this velocity. They would be quicker than a 40S&W out of a standard frame Glock and have better terminal ballistics (penetration, wounding channel, etc.).

Rounds like the Underwood 180gr GD just drive the bullet too hard and also are too slow on recovery for street use.

I think I would rather have one of those Hornaday XTP loads that clock in at roughly 1150fps, than an UW GD (which is a better man stopper IMO) at 1300. If Federal ever comes out with an HST in this range or Speer with a GD, that would be my recommendation.

Pretty sure your agency won't let you roll your own, if they will, PM me and I will send you specs on a 180gr GD load that will give you 1150 in either your G20 or G29 (slightly different for each).
 
#5 ·
I like Winchester X 180gr. I shot the bed of an '83 toyota (from the side), it went through the 1st piece of metal, mushroomed, punched through the inside of the bed (also metal), and punched through the inside of the tailgate lodging against the outside of the tailgate...so 3 pieces of auto metal from the early '80s...works for me
 
#9 ·
Not a big 10mm fan personally, but when I had them probably my favorite factory 10mm loads were the Hornady 155gr XTP and 180gr XTP. To me you want a blend of power and shootability and while not max, they offer a good balance. To me you don't want max because .40 bullets (which is what 10mm uses) don't handle max as well as some assume they do.
 
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#10 · (Edited)
I use Hornady's 180gr XTP at 1180 load for self defense with the 10mm. This is a reasonable amount of power without the additional blast of the full loads at 1300.

I agree with SDGlock23 that much hotter than that is harder to shoot and may not have good results. Full power hunting loads do well with a hardcast bullet for maximum penetration, but this isn't needed for duty or self defense.
 
#11 ·
I've done a lot of loading and testing with the G20/G20sf, including 6" barrels.

For duty carry, I would choose one of the Barnes all copper TAC-XP bullets, they expand within large, thick bones. Double Tap sells 125gr and 155gr, with the 125gr TAC-XP clocking near 1600 fps (Gunblast test). Another company offers a 140gr weight.

The 125gr has a relatively soft recoil and this ammunition should meet FBI protocol testing. ....Double Tap believes this may be the best personal defense handgun load.

I carry it in a 1911, but haven't had the opportunity to kill 4 legged vermin yet. :)
 
#12 ·
I agree with WeeW, a 180gr @ 1150-1200fps is a good duty rd. i would think your dept would issue you ammo or at least a guide line but the Hornady 180gr would be my pick, since win sthp are just not available. GA makes good ammo, if their 180gr makes that vel range, also a good choice.
Just me, in the same size gun i would opt G21 & 45acp, just more good ammo choices.
 
#13 ·
I agree with WeeW, a 180gr @ 1150-1200fps is a good duty rd. i would think your dept would issue you ammo or at least a guide line but the Hornady 180gr would be my pick, since win sthp are just not available. GA makes good ammo, if their 180gr makes that vel range, also a good choice.
Just me, in the same size gun i would opt G21 & 45acp, just more good ammo choices.
Hopefully not sounding like a mutual admiration society but I agree with the point Fred is making on the gun. If you are going large frame Glock, a G21 loaded up with a magazine of 230gr HST's has to be one of the most awesome defensive options avaiilable, talk about a big hole, yowsers!
 
#15 ·
I'm trying to digest all the advice and reading other places at the same time. Thank you all for the advice so far. As of right now I am making a list of rounds I need to order so I can test.
 
#16 ·
Your options are very limited.

Whatever you do, seek a round that is "sealed". Without the additional resistance to moisture, you are taking a gamble that moisture may get into your ammunition when exposed to the elements, rendering it inert.
 
#18 ·
This is not really an over riding issue. A loaded round is pretty water tight. Sealants are more a selling issue than practical. Functioning & Performance of the round is 1st & foremost.
 
#17 ·
If you aren't going to go with the boutique stuff which can be harder to get back on target afterwards, I also vote for the hornady 180 XTP. It's not the fastest, or the largest expanding, but it holds together well and has good penetration even after a barrier or denim (or so I've seen in videos or read here in the forums)
 
#20 ·
I shoot my G20SF in occasional USPSA matches. What others have said regarding full power rounds from UW is partially correct, with respect to follow up shots - but wow do they ring the gong!!!

It may not be an option for you but I put a long slide and 6" barrel on mine and found that REALLY tames the recoil with full power loads - its essentially a G40 MOS now.

The same set-up makes standard 10mm JHP feel like you are firing 9mm rounds. I can double tap with it all day long - well I would if i could afford the ammo.

I also second the comment about copper bullets.
 
#21 ·
https://www.corbon.com/DPX-Handgun.html

In addition to Double Tap's testing of the Barnes all copper TAC-XP bullets, the above Corbon link gives a more detailed description of the TAC-XP performance, including FBI protocol.

I load 180s to about 1250fps, that's about maximum velocity performance for 40S&W designed bullets. All the brands tested performed; including Nosler, Golden Saber, XTP and Gold Dots. Some years ago I was able to test the 175gr Silvertip and it's one nasty bullet upon impact. I have a box full of 180gr HST bullets, but haven't loaded and tested them yet. I expect they will perform well, but at what velocities they can be pushed, I don't know. Unfortunately, this doesn't help the OP's quest for duty ammo.

What separates the above traditional designs vs an all copper design is intermediate barrier performance. Since the 180gr XTP has been mentioned, check its FBI protocol test results.

If it was me, I would give both Double Tap and Corbon a call and ask them why they recommend the TAC-XP bullet for duty carry. :)
 
#22 ·
The Critical Duty is an often overlooked 10mm street round. And for duty use, it is one of the better options. You don't want the recoil of the full house 10mm boutique rounds (Underwood, Buffalo Bore, Corbon, Georgia etc.). It clocks in at 1050fps which will make most people here yawn, but again, you aren't looking for nuclear mushroom clouds out the end of your barrel. Rounds on target is what matters.

 
#40 ·
The Critical Duty is an often overlooked 10mm street round. And for duty use, it is one of the better options. You don't want the recoil of the full house 10mm boutique rounds (Underwood, Buffalo Bore, Corbon, Georgia etc.). It clocks in at 1050fps which will make most people here yawn, but again, you aren't looking for nuclear mushroom clouds out the end of your barrel. Rounds on target is what matters.
Just carry a 40 then. With 180gr @ 900fps, the bad guy won't know the diff & you can get the exc HST round.
 
#23 ·
If I were at all interested in resurrecting the 10mm for a dedicated LE duty caliber, I'd refrain from using any of the hot-rodded loads made by any of the smaller companies, and any loads specifically advertised as being for hunting purpose (increased risk of threat perforation?).

The big names have been reported to sometimes keep exemplars of production runs, which might become important in the event of a shooting incident, and they can afford to invest some respectable money toward their QC practices, especially in their "premium" lines.

Personally, I'd call around and try to find a case of the venerable W-W 175gr STHP and call it a day. That would give me enough rounds to run at least 25-50 rounds through each of the magazines I planned to carry on-duty (which would also serve for confirmation of function of the gun/mags), and maybe 1 or 2 other mags for off-duty (if you left the duty mags on the belt). If you can use 180gr training rounds for quals, that would spare the remainder of the case of STHP's.

A quick look at the big names seems to show that Federal produces a somewhat lower end velocity Hydra-Shok (Personal Defense line), Hornady has their CD load, and CorBon offers something. Cost for a 500-rd case of any of those will probably be a bit expensive, unless you happen to be near a designated LE distributor for any of those brands.

Oh yeah, I'd leave the RSA stock for a duty gun. It's not like you're planning to run hot-rodded or heavy hunting loads for duty, right? Glock no doubt test-fires their G20/29's with major factory loads and feels the guns run as intended, so why start modifying spring rates?

I agree that the discontinuance of the 10mm for general LE service has seemingly resulted in a paucity of defensive JHP's and loads from which to select. The popularity of the caliber among handgun hunters is well and good, but the needs of the hunter, and the bullets designed for game animals, probably doesn't really overlap with the needs of the private citizen/cop who is only concerned about human threats, and the occasional dog attacks.

It would be handy if the 10mm had remained a strongly popular service/defensive pistol choice, and we could select from among modern Golden Sabre, Gold Dot and HST loads offered by the manufacturers of those bullets.

Just my thoughts.

Best of luck in your pursuit for finding an optimal duty load. :)
 
#27 · (Edited)
I think using a 10mm for duty makes no sense. You are severely limited by ammo selection and I highly doubt your dept will let you use the boutique stuff like Underwood or Double Tap. The 10mm was designed to hit hard and fast. Using loads that clock ~1100fps won't do much better than a .40S&W.

You're going to invest A LOT of money into using a Glock 20 for duty use. I just don't think it's worth it, especially if you aren't going to use ammo that maximizes its capabilities. If I was you, I'd buy either a Glock 17 or 22, and use that. The Glock 22 will provide similar performance to the ammunition you'll use in the Glock 20, slight edge to the 20, but not worth the cost increase and difficulty finding ammo. If you want big, then a Glock 21 or M&P45 right be just right. Finding an acceptable .45 ACP load will be so much easier than finding an acceptable 10mm load.

All that being said, If I was you, and was dead set on using the 10mm for duty, I'd pick the Hornady Critical Duty or any of THEIR XTP loads (nothing boutique)- Major manufacturer, modern design, court defensible product and decision.
 
#28 ·
... The 10mm was designed to hit hard and fast. Using loads that clock ~1100fps won't do much better than a .40S&W. ...
I suspect that by the standards many 10mm aficionados seem to prefer to use today, the original 10mm Norma might've been considered "anemic". After all, it pushed a 200gr bullet at 1200fps and a 170gr bullet at 1300fps.

These were figures that were higher than those originally envisioned by Cooper when he promoted the then-new caliber. As I recall, he was in favor of what was essentially more of a medium velocity caliber & loading that would just slightly exceed the lighter .45 ACP loads (but offer more bullet weight than could be had in the 9mmP).
 
#29 ·
standby as I day dream of an agency that allows me to pick my service weapon....

personally, I'd probably go with a 31, with a 20 being close second. good choice, sir.

I run underwood 10MM @ 180gr, I forget the vel. I think it's 1300. ENTIRELY manageable round, much less stout than my reloads, that's for sure. the underwoods feel like a ***** cat compared to my loads, and it's still insanely powerful and fast.

IF you cant get the souped up rounds approved, franky, I don't see the advantage of going 10 over .40. our issued is .40 WIN ranger, just shy of 1000fps. most regular 10MM is only pushing 1100, which I don't believe is worth the heavier and bulkier gun, and is not at full 10MM potential to boot.
 
#30 ·
Critical Duty would be my choice.

Glock 20 SF
Hornady 155 XTP @ 1,335 fps / 614# KE / PF 207
Hornady 175 gr. Critical Duty @ 1,146 fps / 510# KE / PF 201
 
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