I'm familiar with the possible consequences of rechambering the same round several times. What I've been doing is after unloading I set the round aside, then the next time I load I put that round in the chamber and slowly ride the slide forward until the extractor catches the rim of the case. After doing this about seven times I measured the OAL of that round with a dial caliper and compared it to rounds still in the box and have seen no difference in length. Is there any potential problem doing this?
I recommend putting the round in the mag and loading that way. "Riding the slide" is not the way the firearm works in a natural environment. Secondly, forcing the extractor to move around the rim of a chambered round could eventually cause you to have an expensive single shot due to a broken extractor.
I'm not trying to be critical, but since you asked, I can only assume you wanted a respondent to tell you the truth Well, at least as it appears to me.
W/ the slide locked back and the mag-well empty:
1. Hand-chamber your "Barney" round.
2. Ride the slide closed onto the round.
3. Push the slide forward w/ your thumb, while...
4. Lifting the Extractor to Hop it over the case head.
5. Load your full magazine into the mag-well.
Zero (0.0) stress on the pistol, Zero (0.0) stress on the round.
Just Barney the round relatively gently from a mag. It's either in battery or it's not. That's the way the gun is designed to work. No need to second-guess.
If the gun is in battery and there's no significant OAL change in the round, it's fine. If you want to get an impression out of intellectual curiosity, take a defensive round, mic it, Barney it full-force, mic it again, and repeat 20 times or so. I doubt you're going to see much change with good quality commercial ammo.
W/ the slide locked back and the mag-well empty:
1. Hand-chamber your "Barney" round.
2. Ride the slide closed onto the round.
3. Push the slide forward w/ your thumb, while...
4. Lifting the Extractor to Hop it over the case head.
5. Load your full magazine into the mag-well.
Zero (0.0) stress on the pistol, Zero (0.0) stress on the round.
I think that this is also a bad procedure. I just load a cartridge like normal. When you guys start hand-riding the slide home and lifting extractors over cartridge-cases then things can be left out of battery .
Just load a cartridge from a loaded magazine like normal. I good made cartridge wont allow it's bullet to be set back much after several chamberings. Now after a 100 or so then yeah but not one here and one there and such.
I think that this is also a bad procedure. I just load a cartridge like normal. When you guys start hand-riding the slide home and lifting extractors over cartridge-cases then things can be left out of battery ....
W/ the slide locked back and the mag-well empty:
1. Hand-chamber your "Barney" round.
2. Ride the slide closed onto the round.
3. Push the slide forward w/ your thumb, while...
4. Lifting the Extractor to Hop it over the case head.
5. Load your full magazine into the mag-well.
Zero (0.0) stress on the pistol, Zero (0.0) stress on the round.
Count me among the 100 that agree with you. The "Barney" load business is doing something with the firearm that isn't in its natural method of operation. To me, forcing an extractor in any way around an already chambered round is just asking for trouble.
At one of my re-certs for armors school, that method was described by the instructor as something that a person used, then when it was needed, had a single shot due to an unknown weak/broken extractor. He then tried to to sue Glock and when it was learned the method he used, the case was dismissed based on an unsanctioned way of loading the weapon.
Everyone has to do it their way as it's their gun, but I'll stick with the normal method that most closely resembles how the gun operates naturally.
I have several carry guns. I also check OAL. I use the same "batch" of carry ammo. IE....if Im carrying 9mm, I reach in and grab my 9mm defensive ammo bag and load from it. The same round has been chambered time after time again, the REAL way - ie, mag in, pull hard to the rear and release (slingshot).
Ive NEVER seen OAL differences in my ammo (all factory loaded). Your worrying about something that really isnt a concern.
.....I also dont recommend this "barney" load BS. Just load the gun, carry the gun and worry about something else. Its a gun.....meant to do dangerous things, not fine china.
I have, several times.
I don't bother measuring any more, I keep previously chambered rounds for the range.
I normally don't unload my gun.
One more reason why I slingload from the magazine trying to approximate normal operation is first round accuracy.
The first round has a better chance to group with the rest if it is loaded like the rest.
I'm more for loading, normally, as well, but you can walk the round into the chamber, from the magazine, and let everything work like it's designed to. Just before battery, give a nudge, forward, to secure battery. You will feel it when it locks in. You can walk a round into the chamber, from the magazine, dozens of times and get 0 setback.
while possible, bullet setback should be rarely experienced when loading a pistol properly with factory loaded ammunition. I've seen it twice, both times with improper reloaded ammo...YMMV
My personal practice is my EDC never gets unloaded, except at the range by means of trigger pulling
Use factory loads. Rotate them periodically, but no more than annually (i.e. go shoot them and start with fresh rounds). No worries (at least not about OAL).
Usually 9mms are not so subject to bullet setback compared to 40S&W, and especially .357SIG. I load my carry and competition guns the same way, singshot. But for the carry gun, I shoot out the first round every other week at a USPSA classifier. That way there is always a brand new round in the gun. A reduction of .100" in OAL will double the pressure.
W/ the slide locked back and the mag-well empty:
1. Hand-chamber your "Barney" round.
2. Ride the slide closed onto the round.
3. Push the slide forward w/ your thumb, while...
4. Lifting the Extractor to Hop it over the case head.
5. Load your full magazine into the mag-well.
Zero (0.0) stress on the pistol, Zero (0.0) stress on the round.
The cartridge is designed to be fed into the chamber from the magazine. It's designed to slip under the extractor from the magazine as the cartridge rides up the feed ramp and extracted from the magazine, and the cartridge slides up the breech face.
Attempting to insert the cartridge into the chamber and lift the extractor over the rim is ridiculous.
The cartridge is designed to be fed into the chamber from the magazine. It's designed to slip under the extractor from the magazine as the cartridge rides up the feed ramp and extracted from the magazine, and the cartridge slides up the breech face.
Attempting to insert the cartridge into the chamber and lift the extractor over the rim is ridiculous.
I unload and reload my carry and SD/HD pistols regularly, sometimes daily, to handle/inspect/dry-fire train.
A Barney load takes ~ 3 seconds to do. And seeing as all of my SD/HD pistols are .40/ 180 gr.? I consider it an especially good practice, as the .40/ 180 gr. has an extremely nasty pressure curve w/r/t bullet setback.
Don't overthink the problem.
W/ the slide locked back and the mag-well empty:
1. Hand-chamber your "Barney" round.
2. Ride the slide closed onto the round.
3. Push the slide forward w/ your thumb, while...
4. Lifting the Extractor to Hop it over the case head.
5. Load your full magazine into the mag-well.
Zero (0.0) stress on the pistol, Zero (0.0) stress on the round.
I notice with a lot of Glocks (may be all of them), the boolit goes straight in verses hitting a feed ramp, then going up and into the chamber. I'd be a little leery of those that do not feed straight in like a G41 or 34 does. Even factory ammo can get pressed back if it's slammed into the feed ramp enough times. Just saying......
Winchester Ranger 127 grain +P+ in a Glock 17 and Glock 34. I end up unloading one gun or the other one time per week minimum. Either for range practice or dry fire practice. I simply check the round that was in the chamber against a round that has never been chambered. When it is noticeably shorter I put it aside as a practice round. Frankly I've never had a JHP round from anyone that wouldn't experience set back over time if chambered enough times. It just seems worse with some manafacturers and calibers than others.
I got rid of my 23 and 27 with 357 dig barrel and got a 19 and 43. I didn't end up like shooting .40. I loved 357 sig but I had to bail after a once chambered 357 gold dot set back about 4mm. I lost confidence in 357 sig as a carry round immediately. Now I'm in the "9 is fine" camp and have thoroughly enjoyed the price of 9mm range ammo and glock 18 magazines.
My comments address both. I'm tired of your argumentativeness in this and other threads. Consequently you'll join others of your ilk in the ignore list.
So, you add the extra "+1" round into the mag before you insert it, somehow... and then bullet deformity and set-back defy the laws of Physics and somehow don't occur either because, well... just because.
Depends on the ammo what results you get. I have some Remington 115 HPs that push back pretty easily. I have about 20 of them in a box that have been chambered and pushed back. I just pull another out of the new box and load them up when I go from FMJ range/match ammo back to HPs. One of these days I will just shoot up the short rounds or I may just let them accumulate and try a different brand/style of HP next time.
I blew the magazine out of my 23 with a set back round several years ago. I had been loading and unloading often. I was in the habit of unloading and when reloading sling shot cycling the next round into the pistol and topping off the magazine with the previously unloaded round. So the top two rounds got a lot of action.
I decided to shoot my carry ammo out and refresh it. The first round went off with much sound and fury, like a double charge, blowing the magazine out of the gun in the process. The next round was set back quite a bit so I know that was the cause.
Now, I seldom unload my carry gun. When I do, I reload the original round from a spare empty magazine, riding the slide, but not babying it. I check the round for OAL every so often, too. The rounds do eventually show signs of set back and get shot up. I never let them get anywhere near the set back I experienced as described above.
Hornady XTP in .45 did this to me. They setback so far, I won't shoot them. I unload quite a bit for dry fire practice. I now load the round by hand into the chamber with the pistol pointed down, then slingshot the slide. My HST's have been unaffected. Be safe.
A lot of this discussion originated with the 1911 and its 'as designed' extractor, which is a controlled feed system that does not want the extractor to jump over the rim. I was in the habit of hand-chambering a round in older S&W autos, which had a spring loaded extractor; never saw any harm to that.
Concur that loading your +1 Barney round from an extra mag is likely the best, as long as you watch for bullet setback. If you do choose to handcycle, make sure the extractor does indeed jump over the rim, and that the gun is, in fact, in battery. Periodically examine the extractor for damage.
Moon
If you haven't seen setback from the chambering process, you have not been looking. It happens. More with run of the mill blasting ammo than premium stuff like HST and Gold Dots, but it happens with those as well, just more rarely.
One way to see it first hand is to go to a range that a high number of shooters are LE with 40S&W duty guns. Look for the cases that have a big old bulge and crease above that bulge (kind of like an old man with a big old boiler). That bulge is from way over pressure caused by a serious set back.
The good news is I have never seen a gun broken by such a round, but as others have noted, it will eject the magazine in extreme cases. The really good news is if you put your shot on target, that bullet was really stepping out when it impacted. Just make sure you have that magazine reload down pat.
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