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Old 01-08-2015, 23:45   #1
glocksalot
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Online Concealed Carry Classes

Short background: I live in NC and am currently employed as a law enforcement officer. I carry concealed when off-duty (per policy) on the firearm I have qualified on with my department.

My departmental policy prohibits me from carrying particular models of firearms but I would like to have the option to carry these pistols whenever I want and still be lawfully carrying concealed.

I have seen these websites that allow people to be granted their concealed carry permit by just taking a simple class, such as: https://virginiaconcealed.com/

My question is, how legit are these websites? Obviously I do not need to live in VA to take this particular class and obtain a permit but is this a legitimate permit that I can carry with? Thanks for any help anyone can shed on this situation..
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Old 01-09-2015, 01:23   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glocksalot View Post
Short background: I live in NC and am currently employed as a law enforcement officer. I carry concealed when off-duty (per policy) on the firearm I have qualified on with my department.

My departmental policy prohibits me from carrying particular models of firearms but I would like to have the option to carry these pistols whenever I want and still be lawfully carrying concealed.

I have seen these websites that allow people to be granted their concealed carry permit by just taking a simple class, such as: https://virginiaconcealed.com/

My question is, how legit are these websites? Obviously I do not need to live in VA to take this particular class and obtain a permit but is this a legitimate permit that I can carry with? Thanks for any help anyone can shed on this situation..
What am I missing?

You already carry concealed but you want to get a carry permit??
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Old 01-09-2015, 07:39   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glocksalot View Post
Short background: I live in NC and am currently employed as a law enforcement officer. I carry concealed when off-duty (per policy) on the firearm I have qualified on with my department...
Quote:
Originally Posted by ewetstone View Post
What am I missing?

You already carry concealed but you want to get a carry permit??
He is a cop...
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Old 01-09-2015, 08:01   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glocksalot View Post
Short background: I live in NC and am currently employed as a law enforcement officer. I carry concealed when off-duty (per policy) on the firearm I have qualified on with my department.

My departmental policy prohibits me from carrying particular models of firearms but I would like to have the option to carry these pistols whenever I want and still be lawfully carrying concealed.

I have seen these websites that allow people to be granted their concealed carry permit by just taking a simple class, such as: https://virginiaconcealed.com/

My question is, how legit are these websites? Obviously I do not need to live in VA to take this particular class and obtain a permit but is this a legitimate permit that I can carry with? Thanks for any help anyone can shed on this situation..
According to this...
Quote:
NORTH CAROLINA FIREARMS LAWS
Quote:
Page 11-13 - The following categories of persons are generally exempt from the restriction of North Carolina’s concealed weapons laws:
Sworn law enforcement officers, when off duty, provided that an officer does not carry a concealed weapon while consuming alcohol or an unlawful controlled substance or while alcohol or an unlawful controlled substance 13 remains in the officer’s body;
Page 17-18 - The law specifically exempts from the firearms safety and training course certain qualified individuals. These persons include:
2. A current law enforcement officer employed by a local, State, or company police agency in North Carolina who:
a. Is authorized by the agency to carry a handgun in the course of duty;

b. Is not the subject of a disciplinary action by the agency that prevents the carrying of a handgun; and

c. Meets the requirements established by the agency regarding handguns;
...you do not need a training course.

Did someone tell you you needed the course?
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Old 01-09-2015, 08:12   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glocksalot View Post
Short background: I live in NC and am currently employed as a law enforcement officer. I carry concealed when off-duty (per policy) on the firearm I have qualified on with my department.

My departmental policy prohibits me from carrying particular models of firearms but I would like to have the option to carry these pistols whenever I want and still be lawfully carrying concealed.

I have seen these websites that allow people to be granted their concealed carry permit by just taking a simple class, such as: https://virginiaconcealed.com/

My question is, how legit are these websites? Obviously I do not need to live in VA to take this particular class and obtain a permit but is this a legitimate permit that I can carry with? Thanks for any help anyone can shed on this situation..
Like others, I don't really see your point.

1. You can carry in NC under state law.

2. You can carry in every state under federal law.

3. The only thing keeping you from carrying other guns is a department policy that prohibits them.

4. Even if you get the unnecessary permit from Va., you would still be violating your department policy, so if you have to use the gun, you are in the same amount of trouble.

5. if your plan is to carry guns you don't plan to use, what's the point?

I know plenty of police officers who own a safe full of guns but are only allowed to carry an issued gun, on or of duty (and one agency that lets you carry any gun except your issued one, off duty). Not that big a problem for them.
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Old 01-09-2015, 08:28   #6
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Can't understand some of the laws as they can be confusing. Indiana exempts LEOs from a LTCH license.

If you pop a suspension from your dept., chance is they hold your badge and issued firearm. Now you need a LTCH, and a legally owned firearm to carry a handgun.

Some guys buy a 12ga Shotgun, long gun per se, so no LTCH required.

Some places offer a Utah CCW, which has many more states on the approved list.
Things are changing, Good luck on your state requirements.

Seems like LEOSA should cover most, but Federal Carry runs a gamut of confusion of states requiring training vs not. Would hate to try out an overnight stay in the Graybar Hotel on a charge. Not cool.
Again Good luck.
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Old 01-09-2015, 11:20   #7
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According to this......you do not need a training course.

Did someone tell you you needed the course?
No, I have not been told that I needed to take any course.

According to the federal law (HR218) that you posted, on letter (c) it is stated that I "Meets the requirements established by the agency regarding handguns," which according to my departmental policy, means that I qualify with any firearm I wish to carry off-duty.

I want to be able to carry firearms that are prohibited by my departmental policy to carry off-duty under the policy, therefore going against the federal law (HR218), which is why I am wanting to obtain a concealed carry permit.
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Old 01-09-2015, 11:25   #8
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Like others, I don't really see your point.

1. You can carry in NC under state law.

2. You can carry in every state under federal law.

3. The only thing keeping you from carrying other guns is a department policy that prohibits them.

4. Even if you get the unnecessary permit from Va., you would still be violating your department policy, so if you have to use the gun, you are in the same amount of trouble.

5. if your plan is to carry guns you don't plan to use, what's the point?

I know plenty of police officers who own a safe full of guns but are only allowed to carry an issued gun, on or of duty (and one agency that lets you carry any gun except your issued one, off duty). Not that big a problem for them.

Incorrect. If I obtain a concealed carry permit, I would be carrying that firearm under the NC conceal carry laws and stipulations and would not be subject to the departmental policy because I am not carrying under the federal law/departmental policy; so if I had to use the firearm, I would be using it in only a self-defense situation and be viewed as any other regular citizen. Essentially, I would be carrying just like every other Joe Schmoe out there even though I am still a sworn law enforcement officer.
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Old 01-09-2015, 11:43   #9
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You do realize that you can obtain a North Carolina concealed handgun permit just by applying for it and paying the fees?

There is an exemption in NC statutes for qualified sworn law enforcement officers that eliminates the need to take the NC course to apply for a CHP.

Edit to add: Don't forget that if you're going to carry under the CHP and not the LEOSA your limited to where you can carry a bit more under the CHP.

If I can help in any way feel free to pm me.
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Old 01-09-2015, 12:42   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glocksalot View Post
Short background: I live in NC and am currently employed as a law enforcement officer. I carry concealed when off-duty (per policy) on the firearm I have qualified on with my department.

My departmental policy prohibits me from carrying particular models of firearms but I would like to have the option to carry these pistols whenever I want and still be lawfully carrying concealed.

I have seen these websites that allow people to be granted their concealed carry permit by just taking a simple class, such as: https://virginiaconcealed.com/

My question is, how legit are these websites? Obviously I do not need to live in VA to take this particular class and obtain a permit but is this a legitimate permit that I can carry with? Thanks for any help anyone can shed on this situation..
That class meets the requirement for a VA CHP. Probably not needed for a NC permit.

The class however is legit and does meet VA requirements.
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Old 01-09-2015, 12:44   #11
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Originally Posted by glocksalot View Post
No, I have not been told that I needed to take any course.

According to the federal law (HR218) that you posted, on letter (c) it is stated that I "Meets the requirements established by the agency regarding handguns," which according to my departmental policy, means that I qualify with any firearm I wish to carry off-duty.

I want to be able to carry firearms that are prohibited by my departmental policy to carry off-duty under the policy, therefore going against the federal law (HR218), which is why I am wanting to obtain a concealed carry permit.
What I posted is North Carolina code...
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Old 01-09-2015, 12:51   #12
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Originally Posted by glocksalot View Post
Incorrect. If I obtain a concealed carry permit, I would be carrying that firearm under the NC conceal carry laws and stipulations and would not be subject to the departmental policy because I am not carrying under the federal law/departmental policy; so if I had to use the firearm, I would be using it in only a self-defense situation and be viewed as any other regular citizen. Essentially, I would be carrying just like every other Joe Schmoe out there even though I am still a sworn law enforcement officer.
What if...

While you are 'off-duty', what if you run across a situation, not initially a self-defense scenario, where you must use your police authority. You begin arresting someone. The situation goes south. You must shoot using your non-department firearm.

What then...
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Old 01-09-2015, 12:57   #13
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Originally Posted by glocksalot View Post
Incorrect. If I obtain a concealed carry permit, I would be carrying that firearm under the NC conceal carry laws and stipulations and would not be subject to the departmental policy because I am not carrying under the federal law/departmental policy; so if I had to use the firearm, I would be using it in only a self-defense situation and be viewed as any other regular citizen. Essentially, I would be carrying just like every other Joe Schmoe out there even though I am still a sworn law enforcement officer.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NC Bullseye View Post
You do realize that you can obtain a North Carolina concealed handgun permit just by applying for it and paying the fees?

There is an exemption in NC statutes for qualified sworn law enforcement officers that eliminates the need to take the NC course to apply for a CHP.

Edit to add: Don't forget that if you're going to carry under the CHP and not the LEOSA your limited to where you can carry a bit more under the CHP.

If I can help in any way feel free to pm me.
You doubted me...but, hey, what do I know.

NC Bullseye is a NC CHP Instructor. He's helped straighten out several misconceptions about NC law for us.

If you haven't sent him that PM, do it. He's good people...
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Old 01-09-2015, 14:03   #14
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What if...

While you are 'off-duty', what if you run across a situation, not initially a self-defense scenario, where you must use your police authority. You begin arresting someone. The situation goes south. You must shoot using your non-department firearm.

What then...
If off-duty and not armed under my creds, not required to act....but I understand what you're getting at as well.

And you've given me no reason to doubt anything you say, I just need to ensure that I am following all rules/regulations necessary for me because I don't want to end up in a situation where I have to use my firearm and get into any kind of trouble for the type of firearm I am carrying. And I will definitely pm NC bullseye to get some more information, but thank you for the assistance in answering my question.
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Old 01-09-2015, 15:53   #15
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I guess the bigger question here may be to what extent can a department govern an employees off duty conduct. I think it is clear that they cannot regulate in which church you worship while off duty or prevent you from voting for a party that is not the department's favored candidate. I do believe however the department could prohibit one from posting something derogatory on Facebook after one has identified himself as a law enforcement officer even off duty. They probably could not legally deny you a permit presuming the same qualifications for it as anyone else. I am not however convinced that one can divorce oneself from handgun regulations in an off duty shooting.
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Old 01-09-2015, 17:27   #16
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I am not trying to bag on LEOs with this comment, but it should serve as a warning to many who get their legal advice from their local cop.
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Old 01-09-2015, 18:10   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glocksalot View Post
If off-duty and not armed under my creds, not required to act....but I understand what you're getting at as well.
Important information...Thank you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by glocksalot View Post
And you've given me no reason to doubt anything you say, I just need to ensure that I am following all rules/regulations necessary for me because I don't want to end up in a situation where I have to use my firearm and get into any kind of trouble for the type of firearm I am carrying.
I understand, and I should have used a after the 'doubt' comment.
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And I will definitely pm NC bullseye to get some more information, but thank you for the assistance in answering my question.
You're welcome, and do come back and update us.
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Old 01-09-2015, 18:13   #18
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I am not trying to bag on LEOs with this comment, but it should serve as a warning to many who get their legal advice from their local cop.
Yeah, you are ragging on them...

But, then, maybe that's why glocksalot came here for information....
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Old 01-09-2015, 18:48   #19
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Incorrect. If I obtain a concealed carry permit, I would be carrying that firearm under the NC conceal carry laws and stipulations and would not be subject to the departmental policy because I am not carrying under the federal law/departmental policy; so if I had to use the firearm, I would be using it in only a self-defense situation and be viewed as any other regular citizen. Essentially, I would be carrying just like every other Joe Schmoe out there even though I am still a sworn law enforcement officer.
it would appear that you are trying to do an end run around your departments policy. I also don't believe you can under policy or law become a non LEO by what you carry in your wallet. I am not a LEO but much of my family was and are. for all of my 60 years living around them and their friends I have learned a few things. I know that supervisors take dim view to officers going against the intent of their department policies. I can assure you that if you were involved in a SD situation you surely wouldn't be concidered a ''regular citizen''. you are a cop or off duty cop as long as you are employed as an LEO.
I'm just saying to be careful, you could be putting you job at risk.
I can sympathize with you on ''allowed carry guns''. many deptartments don't make good choices IMO on carry guns. I have family LEOs that can't carry what the public can carry and thats just wrong.
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Old 01-09-2015, 21:38   #20
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I'll add one more thing. The OP may want to review NC administrative code 12 NCAC 09E .0106 and specifically item (d) of that code.

I think you may see where it's not just department policy.

This doesn't mean you can't still get your NC CHP but it may be a moot point.
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