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Old 10-14-2014, 12:24   #1
Rebel 6
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Spent shell REALLY stuck in chamber

Preface - Note to self: ALWAYS bring a cleaning rod to the range with me. Especially if the range is 2 hours from home.

Specifics:

Upper: RRA chrome moly, chrome lined, 1:9, 5.56/.223
Ammo: Tulammo .223 55gr FMJ

Having fired a couple of dozen quality rounds successfully, it was time to let my daughter start plinking. Loaded a mag of Tulammo. First shot, then she shows the gun to me and asks, "What's wrong"?
It was trying to chamber a round into an already fired round. I remove the mag, point the gun up and tap the stock on the bench, trying to knock out the old round. Nothing. Tried to insert a small screwdriver into the chamber to catch the rim of the shell and pull it out. Nothing. Tried again. Bent the small screwdriver. Gave up for then.

Took it home. Inserted cleaning rod down barrel and tapped pretty hard with a wooden mallet until the shell finally popped out. No visible bulges. No shiny areas. Nothing to indicate why it got stuck so firmly in the chamber.

Anyone else ever have this happen? Perhaps an oversize diameter Tulammo shell? If this had happened with quality ammo, I would be really worried. With Walmart junk ammo - not worried so much, but I am still somewhat concerned.

Any ideas what may have caused this? I had brushed the chamber during the last cleaning.
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Last edited by Rebel 6; 10-14-2014 at 12:50.. Reason: typo
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Old 10-14-2014, 13:29   #2
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Tula ammo seems to have more sticking problems over other type of steel cases...
Just google it.
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Old 10-14-2014, 13:55   #3
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My colt 6920 did this with almost every single round when I first got it. Went almost 500 rounds as a single shot before I got it working right. Didn't matter what brand or type of round. Brass or steel. It still doesn't like steel case ammo.
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Old 10-14-2014, 14:01   #4
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What's weird in my situation is that I have already fired several hundred rounds of Tulammo through it, without one single hiccup. I just thought this was really odd.
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Old 10-14-2014, 14:41   #5
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Chamber brush and some solvent.
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Old 10-14-2014, 18:21   #6
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Chamber brush and some solvent.
Bingo.

Some rifles just do not like steel case. Every Colt SOCOM upper I ever owned hated the stuff. My 10.5" LMT upper eats it like candy, so long as a good BCG is installed.
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Old 10-14-2014, 18:24   #7
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It's either a dirty chamber or an oversized round.

Brass case ammo are not immuned to being oversized either.
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Old 10-14-2014, 20:03   #8
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I still do not understand why guys want to run crappy ammo in their ARs. I had a friend of mine who had this very same issue several months ago. He no longer has this issue. He does not shoot crappy ammo in his AR anymore. I have been shooting good brass ammo in my ARs for many years and never had any problem with stuck cases. I have a had couple blown primers and that is it. You get what you pay for.
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Old 10-14-2014, 21:09   #9
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People run it because it is $240 per 1k shipped. I don't really run run steel cased but I run some through all my ARs to see if they run it. I don't want any ammo picky guns so if it won't eat steel cased and lower end hand loads it is gone or made to work. I like the option to run steel cased if I need to.

My friend runs steel cased through his $35k belt fed MG and it runs better than some brass ammo. We will most likely run at least 6k rounds through it this weekend so ammo cost adds up.

As I said before, chamber brush and solvent.

Last edited by dkf; 10-14-2014 at 21:10..
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Old 10-14-2014, 21:14   #10
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Originally Posted by dkf View Post
People run it because it is $240 per 1k shipped. I don't really run run steel cased but I run some through all my ARs to see if they run it. I don't want any ammo picky guns so if it won't eat steel cased and lower end hand loads it is gone or made to work. I like the option to run steel cased if I need to.

My friend runs steel cased through his $35k belt fed MG and it runs better than some brass ammo. We will most likely run at least 6k rounds through it this weekend so ammo cost adds up.

As I said before, chamber brush and solvent.
DING!

Cheaper ammo means more practice. More practice is a good thing.

I use steel case for close range training. It's perfectly fine blasting ammo.
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Old 10-14-2014, 21:38   #11
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I still do not understand why guys want to run crappy ammo in their ARs. I had a friend of mine who had this very same issue several months ago. He no longer has this issue. He does not shoot crappy ammo in his AR anymore. I have been shooting good brass ammo in my ARs for many years and never had any problem with stuck cases. I have a had couple blown primers and that is it. You get what you pay for.
My Colt didn't like anything across the board. It had a lot of problems when I first got it. It wouldn't cycle high quality ammo until after 500 rounds. This included duty rounds from work. Back then the AWB was still in effect and I had purchased the Colt with a letterhead. Called Colt about the problem and they essentially told me too bad, don't like it get a mini 14.

That gun is a safe queen now. I don't trust it. I like to bring it out let Colt fanatics look or shoot it sometimes. It's an eye opener.

The good thing is Colt has really stepped up their game since then. One of my partners bought a 6920 last year and it is a night and day difference between the 2 even though they are supposed to be the same gun. More competition made Colt have to step up to stay viable.
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Old 10-14-2014, 22:10   #12
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I bet $ with myself that it was going to be Tulammo when I saw the thread title.

If you haven't already, read through this:

http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/bras...el-cased-ammo/
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Old 10-15-2014, 18:55   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Warp View Post
I bet $ with myself that it was going to be Tulammo when I saw the thread title.

If you haven't already, read through this:

http://www.luckygunner.com/labs/bras...el-cased-ammo/
My biggest ***** with that entire test is the amount of time they shot all the ammo in. Letting the barrel cool between strings would have radically altered the outcome across the board. For your average shooter - hell, even many high volume shooters - steel jacketing isn't going to make a hell of a lot of difference in a chrome lined barrel. In either case, by the time you've worn the barrel out, you've spent several times the cost of the barrel in ammo. If you shot it out with steel case/jackered, you also probably saved several times the cost of the barrel compared to the cost of brass cased.
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Old 10-15-2014, 19:03   #14
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Ive experienced that with an aug, also with tula
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Old 10-15-2014, 19:52   #15
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Chamber brush and some solvent.
My M&P hung up on the first trip to the range. It happened about 200 rds in, and required a rod and some significant force to dislodge the TulAmmo.

After another 300 rounds on the same day, no issue through 2K now.

I did a very good cleaning that day (and everytime) to clean the chamber. I don't believe it to be a "gun issue" rather a cheap ammo happening.
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Old 10-15-2014, 20:37   #16
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My biggest ***** with that entire test is the amount of time they shot all the ammo in. Letting the barrel cool between strings would have radically altered the outcome across the board. For your average shooter - hell, even many high volume shooters - steel jacketing isn't going to make a hell of a lot of difference in a chrome lined barrel. In either case, by the time you've worn the barrel out, you've spent several times the cost of the barrel in ammo. If you shot it out with steel case/jackered, you also probably saved several times the cost of the barrel compared to the cost of brass cased.
I'm not so sure. I mean, they torched a barrel somewhere between 4k and 6k rounds. That isn't a whole lot.

My biggest issue with the article is the math they used for determining whether you save money with steel case. They totally and completely ignored the value of the spent brass cases. You may not always be willing/able to retrieve your cases, but if you realize their value it shouldn't be hard for most people to generally retrieve nearly all of their cases, which can then be reloaded, traded, or sold (and shipping is easy, USPS flat rate box)

Once you factor in that sale price of the spent brass it barely costs any more money than the steel case, is more reliable, and puts less wear and tear on the rifle. Win-Win
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Last edited by Warp; 10-15-2014 at 20:38..
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Old 10-15-2014, 20:49   #17
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I have little doubt the rapid rate of fire contributed to the barrel wearing more rapidly. However the 3 barrels that shot the steel seemed to fairly consistent in wear which leads me to believe the steel cased is ammo (the bullet really) is harder on barrels. What would be nice to see is a test with a more relaxed rate of fire over a longer period of time.
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Old 10-15-2014, 20:56   #18
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I'm not so sure. I mean, they torched a barrel somewhere between 4k and 6k rounds. That isn't a whole lot.

My biggest issue with the article is the math they used for determining whether you save money with steel case. They totally and completely ignored the value of the spent brass cases. You may not always be willing/able to retrieve your cases, but if you realize their value it shouldn't be hard for most people to generally retrieve nearly all of their cases, which can then be reloaded, traded, or sold (and shipping is easy, USPS flat rate box)

Once you factor in that sale price of the spent brass it barely costs any more money than the steel case, is more reliable, and puts less wear and tear on the rifle. Win-Win
Sorta kinda maybe. Spent military spec brass is a real PITA to process for reloading the first time. You have to trim to length and decrimp the primer pockets. That's a lot of extra time.

Depending on the type of bullets you shoot you are looking at .15-.30 cents a pop, add in primers at .03, .10 for powder and you are damn close to the price of brass cased ammo. Plus your time is worth something. Least mine is to me.

I used to load 12 and 20 gauge shotgun when shot was $12 a bag and 500 wads cost $8 and primers were $20/k But now I can buy decent quality Fiocchi, Rio Sporting Clays loads for about $5.50-$6 a box and can't reload them for that price.

Components have gotten ridiculous. Hell, you'll pay $30 for a box of .223 caliber match bullets now IF you can find them or the powder for that matter...

4-6K rounds will wear out a match barrel in terms of match accuracy at extended ranges with certainty. At 100 or 300 yards you'll not notice it much. But at 600 you will. The throat wear is uneven and the bullets increasingly yaw a little as they enter the bore.

In more general use its not a concern and certainly has almost no bearing on reliability. But I promise a barrel is shot out after about 5k rounds for serious match work. I've replaced too many personally and have been around dozens of other competitors with the exact same experience to know better.
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Old 10-16-2014, 15:08   #19
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Sorta kinda maybe. Spent military spec brass is a real PITA to process for reloading the first time. You have to trim to length and decrimp the primer pockets. That's a lot of extra time.

Depending on the type of bullets you shoot you are looking at .15-.30 cents a pop, add in primers at .03, .10 for powder and you are damn close to the price of brass cased ammo. Plus your time is worth something. Least mine is to me.

I used to load 12 and 20 gauge shotgun when shot was $12 a bag and 500 wads cost $8 and primers were $20/k But now I can buy decent quality Fiocchi, Rio Sporting Clays loads for about $5.50-$6 a box and can't reload them for that price.

Components have gotten ridiculous. Hell, you'll pay $30 for a box of .223 caliber match bullets now IF you can find them or the powder for that matter...

4-6K rounds will wear out a match barrel in terms of match accuracy at extended ranges with certainty. At 100 or 300 yards you'll not notice it much. But at 600 you will. The throat wear is uneven and the bullets increasingly yaw a little as they enter the bore.

In more general use its not a concern and certainly has almost no bearing on reliability. But I promise a barrel is shot out after about 5k rounds for serious match work. I've replaced too many personally and have been around dozens of other competitors with the exact same experience to know better.
-If you don't want to reload, sell the brass to those who do. No matter what, those brass cases have value, and ignoring that in their analysis is just as stupid and tossing your brass on the ground and leaving it there.

-At 6,000 rounds they were key-holing at 100 yards with the steel case/bi-metal jackets. So somewhere well short of 6k rounds was when the accuracy would have dropped off significantly

-I don't think we are talking about match barrels or serious match work when talking about shooting cheap Russian steel case .223 in an AR.
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Old 10-16-2014, 15:35   #20
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I had a 9mm Wolf steel case get stuck in my USP Compact when the USP was new. Took a huge amount of force trying to rack the slide but it finally got unstuck. Haven't had a problem since. Weird.
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