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Old 02-25-2009, 11:27   #301
erichodges
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Originally Posted by KHAviator View Post
FWIW According to the Yahoo finacial profile of Glock the number of pistols is over 2.5 Million.


googling for 5 minutes yielded me roughly the same results
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Old 03-15-2009, 10:00   #302
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Tar and feather this sticky!

Walters original definition of a Glock KB is flawed. Simplified, he states that unintended pyrotechnic events occurring inside a pistol are non-significant events if they only damage plastic parts or human beings.

In a Post-Glock world, such bigotry favoring steel above all other is unacceptable and should be challenged on moral grounds.

In the eyes of the Almighty: Steel, plastic and human beings are all dense materials!
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Old 04-11-2009, 14:31   #303
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I'd like to share my opinion on KBs. I have owned a number of Glocks in many calibers and reloaded for all of them. I examined and compared the 9mm chambers of G17, G26 against 9mm Berettas and IMHO the Glock chamber is as tight or most likely tighter considering that I had to modify the shell holder plate in my reloading press to size the cases a little more for the Glock. I believe the reason is that a 9mm Luger round is European designed and was tapered to promote reliable feeding. Tight barrels work fine.
The .40, 10mm and .45 were designed in the US where it is customary to design cartridges with straight walls. Such cartridges will require a looser chamber to maintain feeding reliability. In the case of the .40, they made the chamber walls thinner than the 9mm (to make it fit the 9mm frame?).
All of the above have looser chambers than other makes, the 45 being the worst, hardly any support at 6 o'clock. If it was not for the low chamber pressure, it would be the one to watch.
When I had a G20, I used to look for once fired brass. Brass fired in a G20 (identified by the primer dents) would often have a 6 o'clock bulge while brass fired in other pistols did not. A friend of mine had a Colt 1911 10mm, a chamber comparison showed that the G20 was looser.
Case caused KBs are not new, they used to happen in 1911 .45s once in a while, long before Glocks came around when somebody decided to improve reliability by throating his barrel a bit too much.
IMHO they screwed up when they designed the .40 and 10mm with a straightwall case. A tapered case would feed reliably in a nice tight chamber.

Last edited by nraman; 04-12-2009 at 10:31..
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Old 04-16-2009, 16:33   #304
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I just ordered a Glock 17 (my second G17, had one of the early versions a while back). I also have a SIG226 in .40S&W. I have NO worries that either pistol will function perfectly. But I won't buy a Glock in .40S&W.
That's my own preference based on observed and reported performance of the gun with both reloaded and factory ammo. It's simply not worth the risk, however minimal, to me.
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Old 05-11-2009, 05:27   #305
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Originally Posted by rmgunsmith View Post
I recently experienced my Glock 20 KB after sucessfully firing four full magazines of both factory PMC loads and custom loads from my shop. When it happened the magazine shot straight out, the Wolff recoil spriing and one pice guide rod launched 20 feet, along with some of the polymer frame. The fram was cracked almost in half and the new Storm Lake barrel was split the entire length on the underside. The barrel tried to blow as the front of the slide was bowed.

My hand felt this sharp pain, especially in my trigger finger, which turned black, and hurt like heck. My right hand went numb briefly, but after two weeks there appears to be no physical lasting damage.

I have sent the Glock 20 back to Davidsons who is forwarding on to Glock. My sales rep at Davidsons said he had never seen anything like it and wondered how I kept from being injured.

I talked with a Glock representative at the 2008 Shot Show, who sounded positive that Glock would probably replace it.

I see from your post that they did even with an aftermarket barrel. Thanks for the encouragment.

I recently experienced 3 case failures in the last month while using my G21SF that has really got me looking into my entire reloading process as all three events only occured when I started reloading for myself. Hence, I have no one else to blame save myself.

Having said the same, I can't help but say that GLOCKS are really sturdy and reliable as the damage to my favorite G21SF remained nominal in all three kb experiences. The damages to my glock during the respective events were as follows:

1st Kb - 25 April 2009 - Slide release (standard) which broke in half, trigger (not entire assembly) which cracked and broke in the middle horizontally, and some chip to the frame near the center bracket that has no use whatsoever.

2nd Kb - 2 May 2009 - Magazine release catch (where the part that sticks out from the opposite side of the mag release button broke off), trigger (again), and polymer opening of magazine.

3rd Kb - 10 May 2009 - Trigger, trigger bar (that tip of the trigger bar that rubs with the safety plunger broke off), and shattered Magazine Follower.
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Old 05-11-2009, 05:34   #306
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rmgunsmith View Post
I recently experienced my Glock 20 KB after sucessfully firing four full magazines of both factory PMC loads and custom loads from my shop. When it happened the magazine shot straight out, the Wolff recoil spriing and one pice guide rod launched 20 feet, along with some of the polymer frame. The fram was cracked almost in half and the new Storm Lake barrel was split the entire length on the underside. The barrel tried to blow as the front of the slide was bowed.

My hand felt this sharp pain, especially in my trigger finger, which turned black, and hurt like heck. My right hand went numb briefly, but after two weeks there appears to be no physical lasting damage.

I have sent the Glock 20 back to Davidsons who is forwarding on to Glock. My sales rep at Davidsons said he had never seen anything like it and wondered how I kept from being injured.

I talked with a Glock representative at the 2008 Shot Show, who sounded positive that Glock would probably replace it.

I see from your post that they did even with an aftermarket barrel. Thanks for the encouragment.

I recently experienced 3 case failures in the last month while using my G21SF that has really got me looking into my entire reloading process as all three events only occured when I started reloading for myself. Hence, I have no one else to blame save myself.

Having said the same, I can't help but say that GLOCKS are really sturdy and reliable as the damage to my favorite G21SF remained nominal in all three kb experiences. The damages to my glock during the respective events were as follows:

1st Kb - 25 April 2009 - Slide release (standard) which broke in half, trigger (not entire assembly) which cracked and broke in the middle horizontally, and some chip to the frame near the center bracket that has no use whatsoever.

2nd Kb - 2 May 2009 - Magazine release catch (where the part that sticks out from the opposite side of the mag release button broke off), trigger (again), and polymer opening of magazine.

3rd Kb - 10 May 2009 - Trigger, trigger bar (that tip of the trigger bar that rubs with the safety plunger broke off), and shattered Magazine Follower.

apart from the foregoing, no other visible or operational parts seemed to be damaged. Sadly though, due to the unavailability of spare parts in our country, and having bought the last trigger bar assembly available after my 1st kb, the trigger I'm using (as I did during the last kb) is but a superglued trigger from remains of both triggers I wrecked. (Hoping that my GF would be able to get me one before her departure from Europe this month as no news of any replacement parts to arrive here in the Philippines any time soon).

Anyway, and more importantly, to those who may experience the same, do make sure to have your hands go through an x-ray just to make sure that no shrapnel remains in the same, particularly if you should experience any wound of any kind (and no matter how small). Coz during the said events, I did suffer a bleeding hand during the 1st kb, and albeit having no pain whatsoever, the x-ray revealed shrapnels in my hand which the Doctor had to remove through minor surgery. (will post pics of the shrapnel later).

Just a bit of advice that may save your hand/life.
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Old 05-20-2009, 21:18   #307
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Quote:
But I won't buy a Glock in .40S&W.
That's my own preference based on observed and reported performance of the gun with both reloaded and factory ammo. It's simply not worth the risk, however minimal, to me.
Our local police department uses the G22C, I have not heard of a single KB.
I own a 22C and use mostly factory, never lead.
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Old 05-21-2009, 07:59   #308
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Originally Posted by nraman View Post
Our local police department uses the G22C, I have not heard of a single KB.
I own a 22C and use mostly factory, never lead.
Doesn't matter whether you use relaods or factory loads, lead or FMJ, KABOOMS have been reported in all of them.
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Old 05-21-2009, 13:37   #309
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I too own a 22C, and its been nothing but a champion.
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Old 05-21-2009, 16:00   #310
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http://www.thegunzone.com/glock/glock-kb-faq.html
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Old 05-21-2009, 18:32   #311
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Pity Walter isn't around....
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Old 05-25-2009, 16:33   #312
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Deputy276
I have read that info more than once. It really does contain some good advice and I believe their info is documented. IOW no lies were posted. I reckon some can't stand the truth. Glock tries to fix every problem, in secret and never admit that there was any kind of problem, to begin with. I still like my Glock 9s, 40s & 357s and they are plural.

I personally believe that most KBs are caused by the popularity of progressive reloading equipment being made cheap enough for them to be in widespread use.
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Old 05-25-2009, 16:38   #313
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Austin: Don't get me wrong...I LIKE the heck out of my Glock 17 and 26. It's just my personal choice to not go with the .40S&W in Glocks.

The reasons for Kabooms seems to be as numerous as the Glock models
I tend to think the lack of adequate chamber support might be the main problem. I'm wondering how many people have switched to supported chamber barrels and had Kaboom problems with them???
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Old 05-25-2009, 17:01   #314
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I fully understand your feeling about the 40s. I use 357 for CCW, but I do own 3 Glock 40s.
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Old 05-25-2009, 21:04   #315
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I think that there is some justified confusion about KBs and their cause.
I believe there are two types.
Type 1. The supported part of the case lets go. Possible reasons, chamber design that does not provide enough support, fired out of battery.
Type 2. Part of the chamber or the whole chamber and part of the barrel fail and the barrel splits in half. This condition has nothing to do with how well the case is supported, it has to do with the ability of the barrel to contain the pressure. Either the pressure is too high due to faulty ammunition or obstruction or other pressure related issue, or the barrel itself is not capable of handling pressures it should due to the barrel steel, thickness or its heat treatment.
I think that other than 9mm Glocks can have both issues. Not enough support and thin wall chambers.
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Old 05-25-2009, 21:17   #316
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I think that other than 9mm Glocks can have both issues. Not enough support and thin wall chambers.
You might want to check the sidebar to that link I provided. There are at least two cases of 9MM Kabooms in Glocks. One in a Glock 19 using gunshow reloads and one in a Model 34 using factory ammo.
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Old 05-26-2009, 12:11   #317
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Catastrophic failures, frequently referred to on the internet as "KB's" are no more common in .40 caliber guns or glocks than those from other manufacturers and other chamberings. Double charged rounds can and have destroyed a number of guns, not just glocks.
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Old 05-26-2009, 13:52   #318
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Catastrophic failures, frequently referred to on the internet as "KB's" are no more common in .40 caliber guns or glocks than those from other manufacturers and other chamberings. Double charged rounds can and have destroyed a number of guns, not just glocks.
Interesting opinion. I'd sure like to know how you formed it and what figures you use to back it up. Here's some feedback based on verifiable facts:

http://www.thegunzone.com/glock/hhnj.html
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Old 05-26-2009, 14:01   #319
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Direct experience.
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Old 05-26-2009, 14:06   #320
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Originally Posted by Deputy276 View Post
Austin: Don't get me wrong...I LIKE the heck out of my Glock 17 and 26. It's just my personal choice to not go with the .40S&W in Glocks.

The reasons for Kabooms seems to be as numerous as the Glock models
I tend to think the lack of adequate chamber support might be the main problem. I'm wondering how many people have switched to supported chamber barrels and had Kaboom problems with them???
Lack of chamber support may increase the chances for a case failure in the presence of other conditions (old or defective case, somewhat excessive pressure), but a case failure is not a catastrophic over-pressure even resulting in a "blowed-up" gun! Speir can't tell the difference between these two events; Walter could. I suggest reading Walter's analysis at the beginning of this thread for an enlightened discussion of these two phenomena.

Revolvers have plenty of case support. They blow up when subjected to severe over-pressure. The range I attend most frequently has three such revolvers in a display case--two N-frame Smiths and a bull-strong Ruger single-action--all showing mangled metal and split cylinders.
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Old 05-26-2009, 14:10   #321
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Originally Posted by Deputy276 View Post
Interesting opinion. I'd sure like to know how you formed it and what figures you use to back it up. Here's some feedback based on verifiable facts:

http://www.thegunzone.com/glock/hhnj.html
Facts...or hearsay?

If I want facts about blowing up Glocks, I'll check with Mark Passaneck, a forensics engineer who blew up a Glock unintentionally and then went on to blow some up deliberately under controlled conditions. You may find his results highly informative.

Passaneck summarizes his research in Robin Taylor's book, The Glock in Competition (2nd ed.), a book I'd recommend for many other reasons.
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Old 05-26-2009, 14:24   #322
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The Glocks in my link were malfunctioning with FACTORY AMMO..not reloads or hot loads. You can believe whoever you like and stick your fingers in your ears and go la-la-la, but police departments DON'T have a hidden agenda for not wanting Glocks. Read the sidebar. ISP dumped their Glock 22s in favor of the Glock 17. It's not anti-Glock that's the issue...just defective guns. It's not just 22s blowing up, it's stovepipes and failures to eject.

http://www.tribstar.com/local/local_...102231432.html

Defective state police guns to be replaced
The Tribune-Star Published: April 12, 2006 11:14 pm <!-- icons -->

Indiana State Police will receive new Glock 9 mm handguns as a result of functional problems with their current Glock 40-caliber handguns.

About 50 guns that were identified as dysfunctional through a manufacturer defect will be replaced, said Indiana State Police Sgt. Joe Watts.

The manufacturer is replacing the guns at no cost to State Police, Watts said.

No timeline has been set for when the new handguns will arrive. When they arrive, police will be trained on their use.

State troopers can carry one of the new, replaced handguns or the gun previously carried, a Beretta 40-caliber, he said.

Last year, State Police replaced their old Berettas with the new Glocks.
<!-- icons -->

Last edited by Deputy276; 05-26-2009 at 14:27..
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Old 05-26-2009, 14:24   #323
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Originally Posted by Deputy276 View Post
You might want to check the sidebar to that link I provided. There are at least two cases of 9MM Kabooms in Glocks. One in a Glock 19 using gunshow reloads and one in a Model 34 using factory ammo.
Any gun, any caliber can KB for a variety of reasons. I don't believe there is a problem with the 9mm Glocks.

Last edited by nraman; 05-26-2009 at 14:29..
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Old 05-26-2009, 14:42   #324
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Originally Posted by Deputy276 View Post
The Glocks in my link were malfunctioning with FACTORY AMMO..not reloads or hot loads. You can believe whoever you like and stick your fingers in your ears and go la-la-la, but police departments DON'T have a hidden agenda for not wanting Glocks. Read the sidebar. ISP dumped their Glock 22s in favor of the Glock 17. It's not anti-Glock that's the issue...just defective guns. It's not just 22s blowing up, it's stovepipes and failures to eject.

http://www.tribstar.com/local/local_...102231432.html

Defective state police guns to be replaced
The Tribune-Star Published: April 12, 2006 11:14 pm <!-- icons -->

Indiana State Police will receive new Glock 9 mm handguns as a result of functional problems with their current Glock 40-caliber handguns.

About 50 guns that were identified as dysfunctional through a manufacturer defect will be replaced, said Indiana State Police Sgt. Joe Watts.

The manufacturer is replacing the guns at no cost to State Police, Watts said.

No timeline has been set for when the new handguns will arrive. When they arrive, police will be trained on their use.

State troopers can carry one of the new, replaced handguns or the gun previously carried, a Beretta 40-caliber, he said.

Last year, State Police replaced their old Berettas with the new Glocks.
<!-- icons -->
Umm, overloaded factory ammo happens too. One agency lost a couple of .45 GAP Glocks to over-pressure rounds from Speer. Speer acknowledged the problem.

And this thread is NOT about "stovepipes and failures to eject!"
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Old 05-26-2009, 14:43   #325
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Any gun, any caliber can KB for a variety of reasons. I don't believe there is a problem with the 9mm.
Believe what you want...

http://www.thegunzone.com/glock/g19-kb.html

Both the Model 19 and Model 34 have had Kabooms. The Model 19 with reloads and the Model 34 with factory ammo.

http://www.thegunzone.com/glock/g19_topless.html
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