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Old 10-31-2013, 09:00   #41
SpringerTGO
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Originally Posted by NMGlocker View Post
Not very well so far.
Multiple dead trigger issues when they get hot.
How hot do I have to get it? The supressor gets way hot, but I haven't been able to make it fail. With factory loads it seems to run great. It's not 100% with the current reload I am making, but it's a pretty light load.
This is the first I have heard of a "dead trigger issue". Can you point me to any information on this?
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Old 10-31-2013, 21:46   #42
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I don't doubt what you are saying.
I did just read my FN's warranty and it doesn't mention anything about which supressor to run, special maintenance, or limitations on the warranty because of the supressor. I have no idea how the FN will hold up, but haven't read about a single supressor issue. Time will tell I guess.
That said, at this point I'm glad I didn't go with an H&K.
Early fn tacticals and ospreys didn't get along. I had a baffle strike with my fnp tactical and silencerco osprey suppressor a year or so ago. Since then, silencerco has made a piston made specifically for the fnp tactical which I now have and run 100%. It's Bc the shoulder on the fnp tactical isn't concentric to the barrel. I also have a usp-t and usp-ct that I use with my osprey and no issues with any of the 3 as of lately. My bro uses a Tirant 45 with a threaded 1911 and hk45ct with no issues
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Old 11-01-2013, 06:39   #43
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Can you imangage if other pistol manufactures told the owners of their products to replace a part every 2000 rounds?
Do you know how many morons think Glock RSAs need to be replaced every 2000 rounds? Hell, some think they need to be replaced after 500 rounds.



I kid you not. Go read in the General Glocking area.
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Old 11-01-2013, 08:56   #44
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Originally Posted by Gdirty5 View Post
Early fn tacticals and ospreys didn't get along. I had a baffle strike with my fnp tactical and silencerco osprey suppressor a year or so ago. Since then, silencerco has made a piston made specifically for the fnp tactical which I now have and run 100%. It's Bc the shoulder on the fnp tactical isn't concentric to the barrel. I also have a usp-t and usp-ct that I use with my osprey and no issues with any of the 3 as of lately. My bro uses a Tirant 45 with a threaded 1911 and hk45ct with no issues
Thanks for the information. I was getting a little nervous about this. So far, the FN appears every bit as great as I thought it would be. At first the trigger took some getting used to, but last time out I shot it better than I did my Nighthawk. I think the Osprey helps, but all this talk about how hard it is on the host had me wondering. I guess worst case is that I break it and send it back to FN.
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Old 11-01-2013, 12:54   #45
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I shoot my fnp almost always suppressed and a few thousand rounds later it still functions 100% with zero signs of premature wear.
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Old 11-01-2013, 13:15   #46
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A significant percentage of my firearms are H&K products. Usually a H&K P2000SK and/or a USP 45C are one of the options in my daily use CCW selection.

I have easily put at least 100000 rounds through my H&K products. I have never had a problem that required any sort of H&K customer service.

Based on my experience, in my opinion, if you do not abuse a H&K firearm, they can be almost as reliable as the Sun coming up in the morning.

RJ

Last edited by RJ's Guns; 11-01-2013 at 13:52.. Reason: I thought my estimate was too high.
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Old 11-01-2013, 14:44   #47
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I'm a member there, but hardly ever post.
Same here bac. I don't have any HKs anymore but that board was crazy.
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Old 11-01-2013, 15:02   #48
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Same here bac. I don't have any HKs anymore but that board was crazy.



I am a member there as well and like both of you rarely post but I must think that they can't be any worse than a couple of the 1911 forums.
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Old 11-01-2013, 15:08   #49
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I've owned three HK pistols and ended up trading/selling them all. I even had a tan frame Mk 23 that I (idiotically) traded off.

So I am not an HK die hard here when I say this.

I think HKs are just that good. They are about the only plastic pistol that you could leave "plastic pistol" out as a qualifier if you get into a debate about the world's highest quality guns.

That said, I just never really could warm up to them and their funky mag release. I'd rather have a G21 than an HK45, even though the HK45 is an outright better gun quality wise.

Last edited by s&wfan; 11-01-2013 at 15:10..
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Old 11-01-2013, 15:35   #50
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Originally Posted by NMGlocker View Post

...Running a suppressor on a handgun is extremely hard on the recoil system due to the huge increase in back pressure...

Do you have a source for this revelation?

How do you explain those of us that have fired literally thousands of suppressed rounds through the HK USP45 Tactical and an Octane 45 suppressor with no damage whatsoever?

In fact, my USP45 Tactical still looks brand new?

There's something in the OP's story that we're not being told?
He seems to be going to a lot of trouble to discredit HK's customer service?

..

Last edited by JBnTX; 11-01-2013 at 15:47..
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Old 11-01-2013, 17:26   #51
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Originally Posted by JBnTX View Post
Do you have a source for this revelation?

How do you explain those of us that have fired literally thousands of suppressed rounds through the HK USP45 Tactical and an Octane 45 suppressor with no damage whatsoever?

In fact, my USP45 Tactical still looks brand new?

There's something in the OP's story that we're not being told?
He seems to be going to a lot of trouble to discredit HK's customer service?

..

I agree, how would a suppressor create a “huge increase in back pressure.” I would think (and I may be wrong as I have a very limited frame of reference with regards to suppressors) that a solid metal barrel would create more back pressure than a perforated/baffled suppressor. The projectile may be under pressure for a longer duration of time but how would that be any different in theory, than an example of a rifle with an 18 inch barrel and a 24 inch barrel. I have not detected any “huge increase in back pressure” shooting rifles with longer barrels.

RJ
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Old 11-02-2013, 16:32   #52
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Originally Posted by JBnTX View Post
Do you have a source for this revelation?

How do you explain those of us that have fired literally thousands of suppressed rounds through the HK USP45 Tactical and an Octane 45 suppressor with no damage whatsoever?

In fact, my USP45 Tactical still looks brand new?

There's something in the OP's story that we're not being told?
He seems to be going to a lot of trouble to discredit HK's customer service?

..
Ha do tell buddy.... I'm fine with their service, as I stated. The call taker was not 100% paying attention but the armorer who called me when my gun arrived was professional and very willing to help and we even shot the **** on the phone for awhile.

My only complaint was the call taker getting my problem description wrong and the fact that the most widely used and recommended pistol built for suppressor use out of the box is only warrantied for two old, loud, and out dated suppressors.

I paid the $160 to get it fixed as that was the warranty deal and I knew that going in. My issue is they should update the warranty.

I don't know what it is with HK fanboys, its always "the OP isn't telling the whole story" .....yeah I have time to come online and fabricate a story to which I will gain nothing. And lets not forget I own multiple HK's and they are still my favorite go-to gun. I just call it like I see it.
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Old 11-02-2013, 21:02   #53
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Originally Posted by Fireman1291 View Post
My only complaint was the call taker getting my problem description wrong and the fact that the most widely used and recommended pistol built for suppressor use out of the box is only warrantied for two old, loud, and out dated suppressors.
1. As I stated, the call taker's mistake is inexcusable.

2. Loud and outdated or not, your gun wasn't designed to work with the suppressor you were using. That's the plain and simple undeniable truth.

You can't blame HK engineering for your using a device on your pistol that it wasn't ever designed for. It's obvious there was too much assist from the suppressor which caused the damage to your gun.

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My issue is they should update the warranty.
Why should they? You screwed your gun up as a result of using it outside of it's design limits by using a unapproved and untested suppressor. They shouldn't have to eat the cost of your mistake.


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Originally Posted by Fireman1291 View Post
I don't know what it is with HK fanboys, its always "the OP isn't telling the whole story" .....yeah I have time to come online and fabricate a story to which I will gain nothing
1. Nobody is saying you made anything up but there are always three sides to every story. Your side, their side, and what actually happened.

2. It has nothing to do with HK fanboys. People just see the mistake you made and you seem unwilling to accept that you caused your own problem and your blaming HK for it instead.


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I just call it like I see it.
Maybe so but I call it how it actually is.

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Last edited by NEOH212; 11-02-2013 at 21:04..
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Old 11-03-2013, 06:17   #54
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You seem to know everything. You must know then that the "tested and warrantied" KAC pistol can just happened to be the same can that SOCOM had already purchased. It's HEAVY as in it doubles as a hammer heavy. The neilson device, material selection, baffles, construction and welding is outdated. It's quite simple really, I know now that no matter what can is on the end of a gun (approved or not) that the recoil spring on the host weapon should be replaced sooner than recommend. Yes we all know that the booster assembly will cause accelerated wear, it's just surprising it happened as fast as it did. One would think the KAC would cause more wear due to the weight of the suppressor.

They still should step up their game. Companies like Silencerco get this. They don't have in writing anywhere that if you accidentally smash your can in your safe door that they will replair it free if charge(not me lol) or that they should upgrade the Ospreys to the new front cap and baffle design but they did....for free, including shipping. What I'm getting at is there are companies out there who have OUTSTANDING customer service and it works, its the best business model around. They go outside their "approved warranty" and go above and beyond and the word of mouth advertising they get in return costs way less to them and is more affective than a magazine ad. I've had similar experiences with SA and S&W.

Ill stick with my opinion and you yours. I gave you the entire TRUTH in how it happened and have nothing to hide. I still like all my HK's but if someone asks me what host they should run HK won't be the first I recommend.
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Old 11-03-2013, 06:53   #55
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I agree that HK needs to update their "position" on suppressor use on their pistols.

I have tried to get information from HK, but I can't seem to get past the legal/warranty type response.

HK's so called "approved suppressor list" is old and outdated. A ton of new suppressors have come on the market since then, and ALL are superior to the old, heavy KAC suppressors.

I don't see how any of them could do anymore damage or cause more pressure than the old KAC suppressors.

Right now HK sells more suppressor ready pistols than any other manufacturer, but has an outdated warranty position on suppressor use. What do they think we're doing with those pistols?

If HK wants to maintain their current position on suppressor use, then they need to produce an updated list of approved suppressors, update their warranty or quit making suppressor ready pistols.

Personally, I don't think Fireman1291's pistol was damaged by suppressor use. I have the same pistol with a lot more rounds through it and it still looks brand new. All of those rounds have been reloads, a few hotter than normal.

My best wild ass guess would be that the damage was caused by an overloaded and overly powerful round that forced the slide back too far. But, that's just my opinion.
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Old 11-03-2013, 09:55   #56
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Originally Posted by JBnTX View Post
Do you have a source for this revelation?
Seriously?
You don't know that a suppressor works by trapping, slowing and cooling the expanding gases exiting the barrel with baffles? That a side effect of this trapping is more of the gases are directed back into the barrel and action?
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Old 11-03-2013, 10:02   #57
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I don't see how any of them could do anymore damage or cause more pressure than the old KAC suppressors.
Older suppressor designs tend to use canister volume to trap and cool the gases. New suppressor designs tend to use more complex baffles in a smaller volume can. New baffle designs tend to be quieter because they have more efficiency i.e.: they're trapping more energy that has to be released somehow (remember Newton and his pesky laws?).
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Old 11-03-2013, 10:16   #58
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Originally Posted by NMGlocker View Post
Running a suppressor on a handgun is extremely hard on the recoil system due to the huge increase in back pressure. ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by NMGlocker View Post
Seriously?
You don't know that a suppressor works by trapping, slowing and cooling the expanding gases exiting the barrel with baffles? That a side effect of this trapping is more of the gases are directed back into the barrel and action?
Once again, do you have a source for your assertion that suppressors are "extremely" hard on the recoil system due to the "huge" increase in back pressure.

Can you define "extremely" and "huge"?
Your words, not mine.

Suppressors do in fact increase the pressure forces on a firearm, but I don't think any modern properly built and properly used suppressor does so to the extent that it will damage a pistol in just a few thousand rounds.

If it does then where are all the damaged HK's, Glocks, Beretta and SIG pistols? How would suppressor manufacturers even stay in business if their products were destroying pistols in just a couple of thousand rounds?

Suppressors are the biggest selling NFA item in this country.
Where are the horror stories of firearms being damaged or destroyed by these suppressors?
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Old 11-03-2013, 12:18   #59
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Older suppressor designs tend to use canister volume to trap and cool the gases. New suppressor designs tend to use more complex baffles in a smaller volume can. New baffle designs tend to be quieter because they have more efficiency i.e.: they're trapping more energy that has to be released somehow (remember Newton and his pesky laws?).
Jody, I love you, but Newton didn't have squat to do with energy. Thermodynamics came way after him.


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Old 11-03-2013, 17:01   #60
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To quote from a poster on another site:

"HK has always supported their customers better than Glock supports their chambers."
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