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Old 11-03-2013, 18:48   #26
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Okay, ban HE.

I'm glad you are so aware of the retail apsects of fertilizer sales in your area, but it is easily bought, and yes, I'm talking about the "bad" stuff.

But let's follow your ban HE aregument, what about the Boston Marthon? Ban pressure cookers? Ban charcoal?


Enough with the comparisons and metaphors.

Again, the "bad" fertilizer is rarely sold to those who don't have a need for it. Many stores wont sell it to you unless they believe it is for industrial applications, for the same reason a gun store owners wouldn't sell a gun to someone who they suspected of a straw purchase.

And once more, ANFO is basically useless without a blasting cap and booster.
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Old 11-03-2013, 18:56   #27
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Ban firearms. There is no real need for them outside of law enforcement and military applications. They are designed to do one thing: destroy and kill.

Ban everything I personally feel as dangerous.
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Old 11-03-2013, 18:56   #28
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I think you need to organize your thoughts and be coherent. It would lend credibility to your posts.

For instance, "experts". The people in this video appear to me to be just that. I commented on that before this whole sarah brady argument of yours got started.
I never said anything about the video, I was talking about the general "uses" for tannerite.

However, 99% of all tannerite users are reckless and ignore the warnings and precautions set out by the company. Experts or not, the people in the video clearly demonstrated lack of concern for these warnings.
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Old 11-03-2013, 18:57   #29
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Tannerite kills innocent people. Ban it. I agree.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:00   #30
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Tannerite kills innocent people. Ban it. I agree.
A homemade version of Tannerite is the most commonly encountered explosive I came across while helping recover IEDs in Afghanistan. Yes, Tannerite is likely responsible for a considerable amount of casualties and fatalities in war zones, and its only a matter of time before they are misused in our own country.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:03   #31
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I never said anything about the video, I was talking about the general "uses" for tannerite.

However, 99% of all tannerite users are reckless and ignore the warnings and precautions set out by the company. Experts or not, the people in the video clearly demonstrated lack of concern for these warnings.
Actually, in the context of this thread, you were talking about the video.

As for people ignoring warnings, you might want to get a tamberine and picket the local public houses as I think John Barleycorn is misuesd far more than tannerite.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:03   #32
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Ok. So even though Tannerite is not available in Afghanistan. Those that wish to use it to harm others made it in caves. So no amount of control could stop that. Thank you for bringing some levelheadedness to an otherwise futile argument.

Ban making explosives in Afghanistan. According to your argument. That would stop the danger.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:06   #33
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Actually, in the context of this thread, you were talking about the video.

As for people ignoring warnings, you might want to get a tamberine and picket the local public houses as I think John Barleycorn is misuesd far more than tannerite.
Well if you insist, ok. Ill say it again, the tannerite in the posted video demonstrated recklessness, lack of concern for safety, and all warnings and precautions set out by the manufacturer were ignored. Experts or not, they are lucky no one was injured or killed regardless of what the desired intentions were.

If this video is your idea of a safe use of high explosives then your argument isn't very strong.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:09   #34
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Ok. So even though Tannerite is not available in Afghanistan. Those that wish to use it to harm others made it in caves. So no amount of control could stop that. Thank you for bringing some levelheadedness to an otherwise futile argument.

Ban making explosives in Afghanistan. According to your argument. That would stop the danger.
No, it wasn't made in caves, it was illegally imported from surrounds countries through terrorist and insurgent groups.

Explosives are illegal in Afghanistan, but if you suggest that we give into the work of the insurgent and Taliban networks then you don't seem like much of a fighter. Just because something can be acquired through illicit means doesn't mean we should give up and allow it to be sold.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:15   #35
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You mean like drugs are illegal here and are imported over our borders. So let's ban Tannerite to keep it out if bad guys hands but actually only keep it out if free citizens hands because bad guys will still get it regardless of laws or military threats? Again. Thanks for making my point.

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Old 11-03-2013, 19:22   #36
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Well if you insist, ok. Ill say it again, the tannerite in the posted video demonstrated recklessness, lack of concern for safety, and all warnings and precautions set out by the manufacturer were ignored. Experts or not, they are lucky no one was injured or killed regardless of what the desired intentions were.

If this video is your idea of a safe use of high explosives then your argument isn't very strong.
And riding a bicycle on a two lane, 55mph, highway by a dedicated cyclist is safe? That would be the expert, lawful, use of something that is highly regulated and borders on being suicidal. I see expert cyclist riding two-wide getting run off the road and causing people to go head-on with oncoming traffic every day. The traffic coade that regulates this is inches thick and the money spent on enforcement of those regulations is mind boggling. But, in the end, it's just a fit human being on a 20 pound piece of metal vs speeding cars driven by people not heeding any of it.

Ban bicycles while we're at it.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:22   #37
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You mean like drugs are illegal here and are imported over our borders. So let's ban Tannerite to keep it out if bad guys hands but actually only keep it out if free citizens hands because bad guys will still get it regardless of laws or military threats? Again. Thanks for making my point.
Are you suggesting we legalize meth, heroin and coke?

I am suggesting HE be better controlled. The whole "bad guys will always get it" argument doesn't hold very well because banning drugs as well as Class III weapons has made an obvious impact on the availability on the black market.

Before the loophole of Tannerite was made, explosives just like it were illegal and were considered a felony, and they were certainly harder to get (though not impossible). They definitely had an effect on the ability for bad guys to get their hands on it.

I understand that banning something wont be the end all solution, but before 10 years ago or so, we were doing pretty well controlling explosives and keeping them out of the wrong hands. I don't understand why just a short time later, things have changed so drastically and everyone wants them to be legal.

Again, there are no real uses for tannerite besides blowing up microwaves and making reckless videos on youtube putting people in danger of getting hurt and killed.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:24   #38
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And riding a bicycle on a two lane, 55mph, highway by a dedicated cyclist is safe? That would be the expert, lawful, use of something that is highly regulated and borders on being suicidal. I see expert cyclist riding two-wide getting run off the road and causing people to go head-on with oncoming traffic every day. The traffic coade that regulates this is inches thick and the money spent on enforcement of those regulations is mind boggling. But, in the end, it's just a fit human being on a 20 pound piece of metal vs speeding cars driven by people not heeding any of it.

Ban bicycles while we're at it.
That's great, but it has nothing to do with this argument. People do reckless things everyday. If you are suggesting we ban bicycles, then you must be suggesting that they are potential weapons of mass destruction?

Again, please keep this argument on topic and stop suggesting we ban everyday objects.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:25   #39
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Are you suggesting we legalize meth, heroin and coke?

I am suggesting HE be better controlled. The whole "bad guys will always get it" argument doesn't hold very well because banning drugs as well as Class III weapons has made an obvious impact on the availability on the black market.

Before the loophole of Tannerite was made, explosives just like it were illegal and were considered a felony, and they were certainly harder to get (though not impossible). They definitely had an effect on the ability for bad guys to get their hands on it.

I understand that banning something wont be the end all solution, but before 10 years ago or so, we were doing pretty well controlling explosives and keeping them out of the wrong hands. I don't understand why just a short time later, things have changed so drastically and everyone wants them to be legal.

Again, there are no real uses for tannerite besides blowing up microwaves and making reckless videos on youtube putting people in danger of getting hurt and killed.
Oklahoma City?
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:26   #40
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If we went around banning everything chicken littles perceived as dangerous, we would look more like a country under Taliban control than the American Republic.

If we legalized drugs the same morons doing it would continue to do it. Not much change. Except maybe we can save billions in the tax fleece dubbed The War On Drugs.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:27   #41
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That's great, but it has nothing to do with this argument. People do reckless things everyday. If you are suggesting we ban bicycles, then you must be suggesting that they are potential weapons of mass destruction?

Again, please keep this argument on topic and stop suggesting we ban everyday objects.
I'll bet you more people are killed and injured on bicycles than with tannerite.

As for WMD, last I checked, they were illegal. What do they have to do with tannerite?
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:31   #42
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If we went around banning everything chicken littles perceived as dangerous, we would look more like a country under Taliban control than the American Republic.

If we legalized drugs the same morons doing it would continue to do it. Not much change. Except maybe we can save billions in the tax fleece dubbed The War On Drugs.
The war on drugs is a whole 'nother can of worms. In the pure sense, yes, people could do them all they wanted and die form it and that would be that. BUT, it would never be that way. These same people would bring lot's of other people down with them because our society is so inept at enforcing the other aspects of the law, like child abuse and neglect, robbery, murder, theft, etc. Drugs in and of themselves CAUSE violence, and that violence would not be addressed if drugs were legalized.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:35   #43
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I'll bet you more people are killed and injured on bicycles than with tannerite.

As for WMD, last I checked, they were illegal. What do they have to do with tannerite?
More people are probably killed by negligence in the food industry than bicycles, but im not sure where you are going with this. You aren't making any valid points and im not sure what you are trying to prove with these comparisons.

OKC was unfortunate but it doesn't mean that keeping HE banned wouldn't have an effect on things like this, because I can assure legalizing them certainly wouldn't help.

And in certain quantities, almost any explosive can be considered a WMD.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:38   #44
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Drugs in and of themselves CAUSE violence, and that violence would not be addressed if drugs were legalized.
If you believe this then you clearly don't pay attention the crime related to alcohol, and you obviously never seen anyone in a drug withdrawal. Most crime related to drugs in the US is due to an addict trying to get their fix.

But this is off topic and has nothing to do with the topic. I was only challenging the other posters logic.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:42   #45
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If you believe this then you clearly don't pay attention the crime related to alcohol, and you obviously never seen anyone in a drug withdrawal. Most crime related to drugs in the US is due to an addict trying to get their fix.

But this is off topic and has nothing to do with the topic. I was only challenging the other posters logic.
See, this is proof of what I meant about being coherent. Believe me, I have extensive, first hand, experience with the effects of drugs including alcohol, both direct and indirect, on the users and people around them.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:47   #46
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See, this is proof of what I meant about being coherent. Believe me, I have extensive, first hand, experience with the effects of drugs including alcohol, both direct and indirect, on the users and people around them.
Then you would know that many robberies, theft, and murders come back to an addict trying scrape enough cash to buy their next fix. If you are going to suggest I am being incoherent then you should provide an explanation and reasons for your opinion, and evidence supporting your conclusion.


Or maybe you should stay on topic and quit making comparisons to completely irrelevant objects/situations
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:52   #47
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Then you would know that many robberies, theft, and murders come back to an addict trying scrape enough cash to buy their next fix. If you are going to suggest I am being incoherent then you should provide an explanation and reasons for your opinion, and evidence supporting your conclusion.


Or maybe you should stay on topic and quit making comparisons to completely irrelevant objects/situations
Learn all of that watching the Lifetime Network? Funny how you say "most" and then change it to "many" when challenged.
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Old 11-03-2013, 20:05   #48
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Learn all of that watching the Lifetime Network? Funny how you say "most" and then change it to "many" when challenged.


You are obviously done with this argument considering you have no valid reasons and you like to change topic and challenge opinions and experiences.

If anyone else would like to have an adult conversation without unnecessary name calling and nit picking then feel free.
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Old 11-03-2013, 20:10   #49
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You are obviously done with this argument considering you have no valid reasons and you like to change topic and challenge opinions and experiences.

If anyone else would like to have an adult conversation without unnecessary name calling and nit picking then feel free.
I think we are all keen to know how you are such an expert on all these things. You are an expert on explosives, you know the statistics and circumstances regarding drugs and violent crime, you make all kinds of claims. Then, when you are challenged on them, you claim they are irrelevent. Tell us, why did YOU comment on drugs and crime when YOU thinks it's irrelevent to this thread?
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Old 11-03-2013, 20:16   #50
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I think we are all keen to know how you are such an expert on all these things. You are an expert on explosives, you know the statistics and circumstances regarding drugs and violent crime, you make all kinds of claims. Then, when you are challenged on them, you claim they are irrelevent. Tell us, why did YOU comment on drugs and crime when YOU thinks it's irrelevent to this thread?
Then tell me where I was wrong on anything I presented? I made on the spot corrections when needed, but never resorted to name calling. The irrelevance in this thread consists of comparisons of high explosives to drugs, bicycles, as well as other objects that have little or nothing to do with the topic.

Of course I may have veered off a bit at times, but only because I took that bait from you two.
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