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Old 11-03-2013, 19:38   #21
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Originally Posted by Glock19Fan View Post
Now you are twisting things around to try to make yourself look right. Please tell me where I said there are no uses for HE? Of course there are industrial uses for them, but there are a wide variety of substances and chemicals that have practical applications but that doesn't mean they should be legal and available to the public.

You are comparing apples to oranges here. All you need to tell me is why HE should be available to anyone.


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Typical response.

Gasoline has many industrial, commercial, and personal uses.

High explosives don't.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:39   #22
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Now you say there are legitimate uses for HE, before you said their weren't.

As for controls, you are excersized about the lack of them, and then refernece the fact that there are controls on them. I'm pretty sure FPS Russia got gigged for violating the controls that you complain don't exist, then rely on as an argument for "banning" them, which they basically are.

What do you suggest we, as a society, do about all of the gasoline and fertilizer that gets sold to people who have the money to buy it?
There are legitimate commercial uses for HE. Blowing up microwaves and making reckless youtube videos is not one of them.

Im not familiar with FPS Russia, but I can assure you they aren't "basically banned". Most gun stores don't even check IDs for these high explosives.

As for the fertilizer argument, there are very few fertilizers which are actually explosive grade, and those are generally well watched. Although its nothing official, I know around here that if you aren't known for your farm work and you don't have a legitimate reason for buying these fertilizers, they wont be sold to you. Not only that, but anyone with a general knowledge of explosives would know that its next to impossible to detonate ANFO without a blasting cap and booster charge. So lets go ahead and drop the fertilizer argument.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:42   #23
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Notice my emphasis on MANY and PERSONAL. If HE cured cancer and powered my vehicle then it would have many commercial, industrial, and personal uses. However, it doesn't and therefore it does fall into that category.

Leave HE to the experts. If people are so demanding that classes be taken for handling firearms, what makes anyone think that HE should be sold like bottled water?
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:44   #24
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There are legitimate commercial uses for HE. Blowing up microwaves and making reckless youtube videos is not one of them.

Im not familiar with FPS Russia, but I can assure you they aren't "basically banned". Most gun stores don't even check IDs for these high explosives.

As for the fertilizer argument, there are very few fertilizers which are actually explosive grade, and those are generally well watched. Although its nothing official, I know around here that if you aren't known for your farm work and you don't have a legitimate reason for buying these fertilizers, they wont be sold to you. Not only that, but anyone with a general knowledge of explosives would know that its next to impossible to detonate ANFO without a blasting cap and booster charge. So lets go ahead and drop the fertilizer argument.
Okay, ban HE.

I'm glad you are so aware of the retail apsects of fertilizer sales in your area, but it is easily bought, and yes, I'm talking about the "bad" stuff.

But let's follow your ban HE aregument, what about the Boston Marthon? Ban pressure cookers? Ban charcoal?
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:47   #25
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Originally Posted by Glock19Fan View Post
Notice my emphasis on MANY and PERSONAL. If HE cured cancer and powered my vehicle then it would have many commercial, industrial, and personal uses. However, it doesn't and therefore it does fall into that category.

Leave HE to the experts. If people are so demanding that classes be taken for handling firearms, what makes anyone think that HE should be sold like bottled water?
I think you need to organize your thoughts and be coherent. It would lend credibility to your posts.

For instance, "experts". The people in this video appear to me to be just that. I commented on that before this whole sarah brady argument of yours got started.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:48   #26
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Okay, ban HE.

I'm glad you are so aware of the retail apsects of fertilizer sales in your area, but it is easily bought, and yes, I'm talking about the "bad" stuff.

But let's follow your ban HE aregument, what about the Boston Marthon? Ban pressure cookers? Ban charcoal?


Enough with the comparisons and metaphors.

Again, the "bad" fertilizer is rarely sold to those who don't have a need for it. Many stores wont sell it to you unless they believe it is for industrial applications, for the same reason a gun store owners wouldn't sell a gun to someone who they suspected of a straw purchase.

And once more, ANFO is basically useless without a blasting cap and booster.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:56   #27
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Ban firearms. There is no real need for them outside of law enforcement and military applications. They are designed to do one thing: destroy and kill.

Ban everything I personally feel as dangerous.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:56   #28
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I think you need to organize your thoughts and be coherent. It would lend credibility to your posts.

For instance, "experts". The people in this video appear to me to be just that. I commented on that before this whole sarah brady argument of yours got started.
I never said anything about the video, I was talking about the general "uses" for tannerite.

However, 99% of all tannerite users are reckless and ignore the warnings and precautions set out by the company. Experts or not, the people in the video clearly demonstrated lack of concern for these warnings.
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Old 11-03-2013, 19:57   #29
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Tannerite kills innocent people. Ban it. I agree.
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Old 11-03-2013, 20:00   #30
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Tannerite kills innocent people. Ban it. I agree.
A homemade version of Tannerite is the most commonly encountered explosive I came across while helping recover IEDs in Afghanistan. Yes, Tannerite is likely responsible for a considerable amount of casualties and fatalities in war zones, and its only a matter of time before they are misused in our own country.
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Old 11-03-2013, 20:03   #31
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I never said anything about the video, I was talking about the general "uses" for tannerite.

However, 99% of all tannerite users are reckless and ignore the warnings and precautions set out by the company. Experts or not, the people in the video clearly demonstrated lack of concern for these warnings.
Actually, in the context of this thread, you were talking about the video.

As for people ignoring warnings, you might want to get a tamberine and picket the local public houses as I think John Barleycorn is misuesd far more than tannerite.
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Old 11-03-2013, 20:03   #32
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Ok. So even though Tannerite is not available in Afghanistan. Those that wish to use it to harm others made it in caves. So no amount of control could stop that. Thank you for bringing some levelheadedness to an otherwise futile argument.

Ban making explosives in Afghanistan. According to your argument. That would stop the danger.
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Old 11-03-2013, 20:06   #33
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Actually, in the context of this thread, you were talking about the video.

As for people ignoring warnings, you might want to get a tamberine and picket the local public houses as I think John Barleycorn is misuesd far more than tannerite.
Well if you insist, ok. Ill say it again, the tannerite in the posted video demonstrated recklessness, lack of concern for safety, and all warnings and precautions set out by the manufacturer were ignored. Experts or not, they are lucky no one was injured or killed regardless of what the desired intentions were.

If this video is your idea of a safe use of high explosives then your argument isn't very strong.
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Old 11-03-2013, 20:09   #34
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Ok. So even though Tannerite is not available in Afghanistan. Those that wish to use it to harm others made it in caves. So no amount of control could stop that. Thank you for bringing some levelheadedness to an otherwise futile argument.

Ban making explosives in Afghanistan. According to your argument. That would stop the danger.
No, it wasn't made in caves, it was illegally imported from surrounds countries through terrorist and insurgent groups.

Explosives are illegal in Afghanistan, but if you suggest that we give into the work of the insurgent and Taliban networks then you don't seem like much of a fighter. Just because something can be acquired through illicit means doesn't mean we should give up and allow it to be sold.
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Old 11-03-2013, 20:15   #35
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You mean like drugs are illegal here and are imported over our borders. So let's ban Tannerite to keep it out if bad guys hands but actually only keep it out if free citizens hands because bad guys will still get it regardless of laws or military threats? Again. Thanks for making my point.

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Old 11-03-2013, 20:22   #36
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Well if you insist, ok. Ill say it again, the tannerite in the posted video demonstrated recklessness, lack of concern for safety, and all warnings and precautions set out by the manufacturer were ignored. Experts or not, they are lucky no one was injured or killed regardless of what the desired intentions were.

If this video is your idea of a safe use of high explosives then your argument isn't very strong.
And riding a bicycle on a two lane, 55mph, highway by a dedicated cyclist is safe? That would be the expert, lawful, use of something that is highly regulated and borders on being suicidal. I see expert cyclist riding two-wide getting run off the road and causing people to go head-on with oncoming traffic every day. The traffic coade that regulates this is inches thick and the money spent on enforcement of those regulations is mind boggling. But, in the end, it's just a fit human being on a 20 pound piece of metal vs speeding cars driven by people not heeding any of it.

Ban bicycles while we're at it.
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Old 11-03-2013, 20:22   #37
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You mean like drugs are illegal here and are imported over our borders. So let's ban Tannerite to keep it out if bad guys hands but actually only keep it out if free citizens hands because bad guys will still get it regardless of laws or military threats? Again. Thanks for making my point.
Are you suggesting we legalize meth, heroin and coke?

I am suggesting HE be better controlled. The whole "bad guys will always get it" argument doesn't hold very well because banning drugs as well as Class III weapons has made an obvious impact on the availability on the black market.

Before the loophole of Tannerite was made, explosives just like it were illegal and were considered a felony, and they were certainly harder to get (though not impossible). They definitely had an effect on the ability for bad guys to get their hands on it.

I understand that banning something wont be the end all solution, but before 10 years ago or so, we were doing pretty well controlling explosives and keeping them out of the wrong hands. I don't understand why just a short time later, things have changed so drastically and everyone wants them to be legal.

Again, there are no real uses for tannerite besides blowing up microwaves and making reckless videos on youtube putting people in danger of getting hurt and killed.
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Old 11-03-2013, 20:24   #38
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And riding a bicycle on a two lane, 55mph, highway by a dedicated cyclist is safe? That would be the expert, lawful, use of something that is highly regulated and borders on being suicidal. I see expert cyclist riding two-wide getting run off the road and causing people to go head-on with oncoming traffic every day. The traffic coade that regulates this is inches thick and the money spent on enforcement of those regulations is mind boggling. But, in the end, it's just a fit human being on a 20 pound piece of metal vs speeding cars driven by people not heeding any of it.

Ban bicycles while we're at it.
That's great, but it has nothing to do with this argument. People do reckless things everyday. If you are suggesting we ban bicycles, then you must be suggesting that they are potential weapons of mass destruction?

Again, please keep this argument on topic and stop suggesting we ban everyday objects.
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Old 11-03-2013, 20:25   #39
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Are you suggesting we legalize meth, heroin and coke?

I am suggesting HE be better controlled. The whole "bad guys will always get it" argument doesn't hold very well because banning drugs as well as Class III weapons has made an obvious impact on the availability on the black market.

Before the loophole of Tannerite was made, explosives just like it were illegal and were considered a felony, and they were certainly harder to get (though not impossible). They definitely had an effect on the ability for bad guys to get their hands on it.

I understand that banning something wont be the end all solution, but before 10 years ago or so, we were doing pretty well controlling explosives and keeping them out of the wrong hands. I don't understand why just a short time later, things have changed so drastically and everyone wants them to be legal.

Again, there are no real uses for tannerite besides blowing up microwaves and making reckless videos on youtube putting people in danger of getting hurt and killed.
Oklahoma City?
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Old 11-03-2013, 20:26   #40
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If we went around banning everything chicken littles perceived as dangerous, we would look more like a country under Taliban control than the American Republic.

If we legalized drugs the same morons doing it would continue to do it. Not much change. Except maybe we can save billions in the tax fleece dubbed The War On Drugs.
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