GlockTalk.com
Home Forums Classifieds Blogs Today's Posts Search Social Groups



  
SIGN-UP
Notices

Glock Talk
Welcome To The Glock Talk Forums.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 09-05-2013, 08:17   #26
aplcr0331
SortaHeuristic
 
aplcr0331's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Spokane, WA
Posts: 3,117
From: http://www.census.gov/hhes/socdemo/e...12/tables.html

High school graduate - 87.65%
Some college - 57.28%
Associate's and/or Bachelor's degree - 40.58%
Bachelor's degree - 30.94%
Master's degree - 8.05%
Doctorate or professional degree - 3.07%
__________________
But the rest of you, especially the rest of you under 30, wake up. The day is approaching where the media will redefine what is right or meaningful, redefine you as meaningless...And you'll believe it.
aplcr0331 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 08:30   #27
Fear Night
NRA Life Member
 
Fear Night's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Sweet Home Alabama
Posts: 3,853
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis in MA View Post
Yeah, but there are no Engineer license plates. Nor do you hear, "Oh my God. This man has collapsed. Call an Engineer!"



To the original question: Me duznt now.
The engineer would just Google the symptoms and go from there
Fear Night is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 08:37   #28
jason10mm
NRA-GOA-TSRA
 
jason10mm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Clarksville, TN
Posts: 3,734
As a doctor there are certainly those among us who "powered" through their classes and practice at a basic level of memorization and near instinctual pattern recognition, but thre is a lot about medical education designed to weed those folks out. That said, a lot of medical school isn't about brain smarts but about task focusing, leisure time sacrifice, and mental endurance. I'm sure there are many folks out there smart enough to be a doc but they couldn't hack the years of dedicated study, the long hours, or whatever, so instead they are brilliant english lit majors serving me coffee.

The oil change argument is specious at best. For starters, the vehicles many docs drive don't lend themselves as readily to self oil changes like your '92 ford pick-up, plus they could work and make more $$ than it would cost to pay a mechanic to do the work than they would save doing it themselves. Plus docs understand the value of experience and are willing to have someone with the proper tools and training do the job than a talented amatuer. Same concept applies to any high paid profession. I doubt, barring a love of vehicles, many lawyers, businessmen, engineers, pharmacists, rock stars, IT guys, or whatever do their own oil.

I changed my own oil for years, FWIW :P
jason10mm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 08:38   #29
Dennis in MA
Get off my lawn
 
Dennis in MA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Taunton, MA
Posts: 52,507
Yeah. I deal with you guys all the time. "Just give me the manual and I can do it." An engineer with a manual and no experience can't see the real problems they are about to walk into. LOL

The good news with Engineers is: Once you show them the first landmine that isn't even hinted at in the manual, they back right off and just let you do your thing.
__________________
The truth is you're the weak. And I'm the tyranny of evil men. But I'm tryin', Ringo. I'm tryin' real hard to be the shepherd.
Dennis in MA is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 08:45   #30
Fear Night
NRA Life Member
 
Fear Night's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Sweet Home Alabama
Posts: 3,853
Quote:
Originally Posted by GVFlyer View Post
That depends on the discipline. You are completely right in some areas of study. A close friend thought that he wanted to be a doctor - until he began his studies and found most doctors not to be that intelligent - more like savants with exceptional rote memorization skills.
This is exactly my point. It's also a generalization, not the rule.

My father in law is a good example. He is an oral surgeon with 35+ years experience, and knows all there is to know about teeth and the mouth. He probably also knows more about the rest of the body than many MDs. He has an extreme wealth of knowledge in the medical field.

In addition to that, he also has a mechanical/technical side. He farms in his free time and would have no hesitation in tearing apart one of his tractors to fix a problem, or design a tool/jig to get the job done. He also knows just about everything there is to know about hunting and shooting. He is what I would consider a very well rounded, intelligent individual.
Fear Night is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 08:51   #31
GVFlyer
Senior Member
 
GVFlyer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Somewhere in the air.
Posts: 6,599
I've had pretty good luck with engineers. For each system on the jet that I fly, there is a "Cog Engineer", the cognitive engineer that developed the system. Particularly during development test, when airborne with a problem, there's no one that I'd rather have on the other end of the phone.

If you want to discuss engineer socialization, that's another story. It is said that you can tell the extroverted engineer at a party because he's the one who stares at your shoes rather than his own.

__________________
The Truth Only Hurts If It Should.

http://www.specialops.org/

Last edited by GVFlyer; 09-05-2013 at 17:46..
GVFlyer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 09:17   #32
Dragoon44
Lifetime Membership
Unfair Facist
 
Dragoon44's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 24,164
There are plenty of people that can do well on tests but fail miserably in real life situations.

There are many reasons for this but two of the main ones are.

1. Lack of critical thinking skills. Very much in evidence today because many have been taught what to think instead of how to think.

2. Ideology- it blinds people to the truth. And eliminates reason, objectivity, and simple common sense from the reasoning process.
__________________
“Right is still right, even if nobody is doing it. And wrong is still wrong, even if everybody is doing it.”—Texas Ranger saying.
Dragoon44 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 09:50   #33
G-nineteen
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 196
Let me alter the original question in the subject.

Are less-educated people "smarter"?

Intelligence includes processing information that is acquired through.....education.
G-nineteen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 09:55   #34
fnfalman
Chicks Dig It
 
fnfalman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: California & New Mexico, US
Posts: 54,774


Why doesn't education make most people smart? It's because most people are stupid in the first place.
__________________
Can you dig it?
fnfalman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 09:59   #35
racerford
Senior Member
 
racerford's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: DFW area
Posts: 4,870


Quote:
Originally Posted by Fear Night View Post
..... He is what I would consider a very well rounded, intelligent individual.
Sure he knows a lot but can he cook a quiche or darn a sock?

The is a correlation between education and intelligence, but not an equivalence.

Even if 3% of the population have doctorates, that doesn't mean they are the top 3% most intelligent people. Now maybe only 10% of the population are intelligent enough to do what it takes to get a doctorate. Even when really intelligent people don't get a higher formal education they often self-educate on topics theyare drawn to.
racerford is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 09:59   #36
DeltaSteve
10 Ring Inc.
 
DeltaSteve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: The Land of TEXAS
Posts: 207
Intelligence is innate, learned. The education system is about money. Very simple
DeltaSteve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 10:03   #37
MtBaldy
Obie Wan, RIP
 
MtBaldy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: At the beach
Posts: 15,946


I disagree with the premise. One definition of "smart" is "knowledgeable". Since one of the main purposes of education is imparting knowledge then, almost by definition, an education makes you smart. Smart and intelligent are two different things. Intelligence is the ability to learn and modify behavior based on acquired knowledge. Your question might be better posed as: Why do many educated people not act smart? A high intelligence can make acquiring an education easier but less intelligent people, within reason, can still become well educated with hard work and perseverance. I think specialization can also result in highly educated people appearing not too bright. They may be brilliant in their field but lack real knowledge of other disciplines or even simple day to day tasks. Take your example of the mismatched socks for instance. It's not that the PhD Mathematician can't learn to put on matching socks, it's that he doesn't see the need to. Socks protect the feet no matter what color they are so why bother hunting for matching socks?
__________________
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the majority discovers it can vote itself largess out of the public treasury."
― Elmer T Peterson
MtBaldy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 10:10   #38
Dennis in MA
Get off my lawn
 
Dennis in MA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Taunton, MA
Posts: 52,507
I'm smart!

__________________
The truth is you're the weak. And I'm the tyranny of evil men. But I'm tryin', Ringo. I'm tryin' real hard to be the shepherd.

Last edited by Dennis in MA; 09-05-2013 at 10:10..
Dennis in MA is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 10:11   #39
2bgop
Senior Member
 
2bgop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: In the SEC
Posts: 5,679
Quote:
Originally Posted by Narkcop View Post
In my experience education level does not equate to smart. Look how the mainstream media influences the sheeple who by and large are well educated. One example is how people are buying into this notion of bombing Syria because the media is telling them "It's the right thing to do". That is now the catch phrase of this bunch of KOOKS.
I just spent this morning going over two fresh nation polls on the subject, I don't agree with your premise. Neither survey shows support for military action above 20%.

People are not buying at this point.

Last edited by 2bgop; 09-05-2013 at 10:11..
2bgop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 10:20   #40
SC Tiger
Shaved Ape
 
SC Tiger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 6,997
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fear Night View Post
This is exactly my point. It's also a generalization, not the rule.

My father in law is a good example. He is an oral surgeon with 35+ years experience, and knows all there is to know about teeth and the mouth. He probably also knows more about the rest of the body than many MDs. He has an extreme wealth of knowledge in the medical field.

In addition to that, he also has a mechanical/technical side. He farms in his free time and would have no hesitation in tearing apart one of his tractors to fix a problem, or design a tool/jig to get the job done. He also knows just about everything there is to know about hunting and shooting. He is what I would consider a very well rounded, intelligent individual.
Bear in mind with your FIL that the farming and mechanical work are things he finds interesting. People who find things interesting tend to learn more about them. If he did not find those things interesting he would probably know little about them and would know more about the stuff that did interest him.

It has as much to do with interest as it does with intelligence.
__________________
Hug your barking irons as the Devil hugs a witch

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keoking View Post
If you're gonna be stupid, don't pull up short. Saddle up and ride it all the way in.
SC Tiger is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 10:28   #41
BradD
Senior Member
 
BradD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Mid-South
Posts: 4,825
Quote:
Originally Posted by SC Tiger View Post
...is it because they cannot figure it out, or is it because they are wealthy enough to pay someone else to do it, too busy to have time to do it, and don't have any interest in doing it themselves? Mechanical things (for the doctor example) just don't interest everybody. And perhaps the engineer just doesn't want to do it.

There are a few things I pay to have done that I could do myself, just because I don't want to do it.
As an engineering professor, you're describing me except for the wealthy part LOL.

I just don't care about, nor enjoy figuring out how to do something to one of our vehicles, house, computer, etc. I have had to fix something myself a few times, and I have always been able to. However, I will go to pretty good lengths to avoid such activities.

Reminds me of Windows vs Linux. I downloaded and installed Ubuntu and almost immediately regretted it. The last thing I need is more sitting there researching, trying to make my computer work.
__________________
GT Strength and Conditioning Forum

Romans 3:23 -> 6:23 -> 5:8 -> 10:9 -> 10:13

An Excellent Gospel Presentation
BradD is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 10:41   #42
Fear Night
NRA Life Member
 
Fear Night's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Sweet Home Alabama
Posts: 3,853
Quote:
Originally Posted by SC Tiger View Post
Bear in mind with your FIL that the farming and mechanical work are things he finds interesting. People who find things interesting tend to learn more about them. If he did not find those things interesting he would probably know little about them and would know more about the stuff that did interest him.

It has as much to do with interest as it does with intelligence.
Yeah, I'm with you. Somebody with no interest in a subject would never bother to pursue it, even though they could possibly perform it.
Fear Night is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 10:48   #43
CAcop
Senior Member
 
CAcop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: California
Posts: 21,237
I work in a college town. You would be amazed at what people with advanced degrees do. I think it has to do with the fact they become very educated in one area and think that translates to other areas just as easily without having to put in the work.

My first exposure to it was in college when a physics grad student fell flat on his face trying to catch a bus. Good running shoes. Flat, level ground. Did not know to make sure he picks up his feet when running fast.
__________________
I wonder if your assessment of "The Wizard of Oz" would sound something like "A teenaged orphan runs away with three psychotic AD/HD patients and a little dog. She kills the first two women she meets." --Sinecure 07/03/2006
Freakin' awsome!! Kickin it old school. Hot sheet on the dash. The report was probably only two sentences. Long live Rencko and Bobbie Hill!--WhiskeyT
CAcop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 10:56   #44
czsmithGT
Senior Member
 
czsmithGT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 9,390
Quote:
Originally Posted by Narkcop View Post
One example is how people are buying into this notion of bombing Syria because the media is telling them "It's the right thing to do".
Most people aren't.
czsmithGT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 10:57   #45
2bgop
Senior Member
 
2bgop's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: In the SEC
Posts: 5,679
Quote:
Originally Posted by czsmithGT View Post
Most people aren't.
This.

It isn't even close to most.
2bgop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 11:03   #46
czsmithGT
Senior Member
 
czsmithGT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 9,390
People who aren't smart don't get Ph.Ds in electrical engineering, specialize in pediatric heart surgery, design bridges over the Mississippi River, or or discover how to turn uranium into a WMD. If the Nobel Prize winner in literature can't change the head gaskets in his Dodge pick-up or doesn't agree with my politics it doesn't mean he isn't smart.
czsmithGT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 11:06   #47
SC Tiger
Shaved Ape
 
SC Tiger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 6,997
Quote:
Originally Posted by CAcop View Post
I work in a college town. You would be amazed at what people with advanced degrees do. I think it has to do with the fact they become very educated in one area and think that translates to other areas just as easily without having to put in the work.

My first exposure to it was in college when a physics grad student fell flat on his face trying to catch a bus. Good running shoes. Flat, level ground. Did not know to make sure he picks up his feet when running fast.
That would be typical "Nerd coordination."

That is why very few college football players major in Physics or Engineering.

I would not consider it an indicator of intelligence, though.
__________________
Hug your barking irons as the Devil hugs a witch

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keoking View Post
If you're gonna be stupid, don't pull up short. Saddle up and ride it all the way in.

Last edited by SC Tiger; 09-05-2013 at 13:44..
SC Tiger is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 13:30   #48
Bigpoppie50
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 273
I once had interest in a young lady that was a counselor at the school that we both worked. She supposedly had a masters degree in something but anyway she asked me did I have a masters and I told her no I do not. She thought somehow having a masters made her a step above me and at that time I had a half million sitting in the bank collecting interest. Everything she did she had to pray about and everything was church church church. I kick her arse to the curb and never looked back. These are some of the people that are in the school system counseling children/students.
Bigpoppie50 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 14:08   #49
Bruce M
Senior Member
 
Bruce M's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: S FL
Posts: 20,060
I also think it just because someone has come to a different conclusion about a political issue does not mean he is not intelligent or not educated.
__________________
Bruce
I never talked to anyone who had to fire their gun who said "I wished I had the smaller gun and fewer rounds with me" Just because you find a hundred people who agree with you on the internet does not mean you're right.
Bruce M is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-05-2013, 14:20   #50
Obi-Wan Kenobi
Senior Member
 
Obi-Wan Kenobi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Kenai, AK
Posts: 220
Curiosity makes people smart. Lack of it creates mediocrity.
__________________
I keep smashing bugs, and they just keep a-hatching - elgoatropo.
Obi-Wan Kenobi is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 19:57.



Homepage
FAQ
Forums
Calendar
Advertise
Gallery
GT Wiki
GT Blogs
Social Groups
Classifieds


Users Currently Online: 1,408
452 Members
956 Guests

Most users ever online: 2,244
Nov 11, 2013 at 11:42