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Old 09-02-2013, 09:17   #126
Buffyfan
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Typical of some non-cyclists are these misconceptions:
1) Cyclists hold you up. No, hundreds of drivers, one-to-a-car hold you up. If they were all on bicycles you would not be held up;

2) Cyclists, going 15mph even riding two-abreast hold you up. Dudes if you can't pass a two cyclists going 15mph at less than the width of a car how in the world can you pass a car or a truck going 40mph?;

3) Cyclists must travel in the gutter. It's much better for them to take the road (i.e. ride in the right hand tire track of cars), and it's very predictable. It's unpredictability that's a hazard not the speed of a narrow bicycle;

4) Sometimes cyclists must take the road (riding in the center) because it's unsafe for the cars to pass them, usually when they can see on-coming traffic on a blind curve. If they don't take the road they risk frightened drivers trying to pass veering back into the lane;

5) It's not all about you. People say that cyclists do not respect them. That's hubris on the driver's part. We are just trying to get some exercise and stay alive;

6) Cyclists must use cycling lanes. Look at the lanes - they are often just 2-3 ft wide paths that do not even go where the cyclist must travel. A true cycling lane is 4 ft wide. If you want to pass a cyclist safely you should give them 3 feet of space. Often cities will paint a lane that's completely unrealistic or exists in the 'dooring' area of parked cars. You just can't ride safely in that space;

7) Consider any rider as you would a beloved friend and give them space and time. It's worth 10 seconds not to risk running over your next-door-neighbor's kid;

8) Every rider means one less car in the road to 'hold you up', or cause you to go into 'road rage'. A cyclist can't really 'cut you off';

9) Cyclists also drive so yes, they pay road taxes, too;

10) A cyclist can not harm you by 'running into your car'. You are in a two ton vehicle surrounded by steel and metal.

HtH
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Old 09-02-2013, 09:37   #127
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Originally Posted by Buffyfan View Post
Typical of some non-cyclists are these misconceptions:...
Courtesy--it's a two-way street. It seems many people don't have it anymore.
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Old 09-02-2013, 09:42   #128
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Originally Posted by Buffyfan View Post
Typical of some non-cyclists are these misconceptions:
1) Cyclists hold you up. No, hundreds of drivers, one-to-a-car hold you up. If they were all on bicycles you would not be held up;

2) Cyclists, going 15mph even riding two-abreast hold you up. Dudes if you can't pass a two cyclists going 15mph at less than the width of a car how in the world can you pass a car or a truck going 40mph?;

3) Cyclists must travel in the gutter. It's much better for them to take the road (i.e. ride in the right hand tire track of cars), and it's very predictable. It's unpredictability that's a hazard not the speed of a narrow bicycle;

4) Sometimes cyclists must take the road (riding in the center) because it's unsafe for the cars to pass them, usually when they can see on-coming traffic on a blind curve. If they don't take the road they risk frightened drivers trying to pass veering back into the lane;

5) It's not all about you. People say that cyclists do not respect them. That's hubris on the driver's part. We are just trying to get some exercise and stay alive;

6) Cyclists must use cycling lanes. Look at the lanes - they are often just 2-3 ft wide paths that do not even go where the cyclist must travel. A true cycling lane is 4 ft wide. If you want to pass a cyclist safely you should give them 3 feet of space. Often cities will paint a lane that's completely unrealistic or exists in the 'dooring' area of parked cars. You just can't ride safely in that space;

7) Consider any rider as you would a beloved friend and give them space and time. It's worth 10 seconds not to risk running over your next-door-neighbor's kid;

8) Every rider means one less car in the road to 'hold you up', or cause you to go into 'road rage'. A cyclist can't really 'cut you off';

9) Cyclists also drive so yes, they pay road taxes, too;

10) A cyclist can not harm you by 'running into your car'. You are in a two ton vehicle surrounded by steel and metal.

HtH
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Old 09-02-2013, 10:20   #129
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Originally Posted by Buffyfan View Post
Typical of some non-cyclists are these misconceptions:


2) Cyclists, going 15mph even riding two-abreast hold you up. Dudes if you can't pass a two cyclists going 15mph at less than the width of a car how in the world can you pass a car or a truck going 40mph?;
Math fail.
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Old 09-02-2013, 10:22   #130
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Math fail.
I think Buffy's entire post is a fail.

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Old 09-02-2013, 10:37   #131
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Originally Posted by Buffyfan View Post
Typical of some non-cyclists are these misconceptions:
1) Cyclists hold you up. No, hundreds of drivers, one-to-a-car hold you up. If they were all on bicycles you would not be held up;
Likely not true. In popular cycling areas, I've often seen cyclists delayed by others.

2) Cyclists, going 15mph even riding two-abreast hold you up. Dudes if you can't pass a two cyclists going 15mph at less than the width of a car how in the world can you pass a car or a truck going 40mph?;
Many people exercise more caution when passing cyclists, especially on roads where there is not a bike lane. It has nothing to do with a driver's level of competence. As a cyclist, I would much rather they exercise caution.

3) Cyclists must travel in the gutter. It's much better for them to take the road (i.e. ride in the right hand tire track of cars), and it's very predictable. It's unpredictability that's a hazard not the speed of a narrow bicycle;
Generally, yes...it's better to take the road. Of course as a cyclist, your choice in equipment will help dictate your options.

4) Sometimes cyclists must take the road (riding in the center) because it's unsafe for the cars to pass them, usually when they can see on-coming traffic on a blind curve. If they don't take the road they risk frightened drivers trying to pass veering back into the lane;
I haven't seen that situation as much as the need to enter for making a left turn.

5) It's not all about you. People say that cyclists do not respect them. That's hubris on the driver's part. We are just trying to get some exercise and stay alive;
There's disrespect on both sides. I've seen cyclists with an attitude of cars need to 'deal with it' and I've seen drivers that intentionally want to induce fear. I had a friend who was hit by the side mirror on a truck who moved toward the cyclist before he was struck. I think he got closer than he intended, but it certainly appeared he intended to scare him to move over or off the road.

6) Cyclists must use cycling lanes. Look at the lanes - they are often just 2-3 ft wide paths that do not even go where the cyclist must travel. A true cycling lane is 4 ft wide. If you want to pass a cyclist safely you should give them 3 feet of space. Often cities will paint a lane that's completely unrealistic or exists in the 'dooring' area of parked cars. You just can't ride safely in that space;
You cite the lack of skill on car drivers and then post this. Odd. I can make use of the pretty small space.

7) Consider any rider as you would a beloved friend and give them space and time. It's worth 10 seconds not to risk running over your next-door-neighbor's kid;
Agreed.

8) Every rider means one less car in the road to 'hold you up', or cause you to go into 'road rage'. A cyclist can't really 'cut you off';
True...but a thoughtless cyclist can obstruct traffic. Point being, courtesy and care goes both ways.

9) Cyclists also drive so yes, they pay road taxes, too;
True.

10) A cyclist can not harm you by 'running into your car'. You are in a two ton vehicle surrounded by steel and metal.
True, although I've heard of a cyclist or two that has threatened to mark the side of a car if they come "too close".

HtH
As I cyclist (one that commutes via bike), I felt compelled to comment.
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Old 09-02-2013, 10:40   #132
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I ride. I enjoy riding. I also know the dangers of riding.

I wish other bikers would realize that the tow mirrors on my Dodge Ram come very close to knocking their head off when they ride on the white line.

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Old 09-02-2013, 10:49   #133
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Screw that, and screw bikers. They are the biggest bunch of selfish, arrogant, jerks on the road.

I just LOVE how it can sometimes take you miles to get around one and then he (illegally) lane splits at the red light and get in front of you again. If there is space I always pull way over so they can't do it. I love the dirty looks I get.

Oh, and I love 4 way stops and red light. The spandex must cut off circulation because they obviously think rules don't apply to them. If a bicyclist tries to blow through a 4 way when it's my turn I go and watch them dive out of the way. And if they think they are going to yell and be a tough guy about it I gladly stop and give them the chance. Not to many takers when they see 6'9" 260lbs of muscle.

And the speedlimit thing....yeah....newsflash. I have the right to go the posted speed limit unless a cop or weather says otherwise. YOU don't get to dictate what speed I go. It's called impeding traffic and it's a citable offense.

And when they ride side by side....another one of my favorites. I'm very versed in NY bike law and I know that they are allowed to ride two abreast they have to go back to single file when a car is coming up behind them. Do they do that? NEVER. Which is fine. Train horn up the ass for them.

I could go on and on.

I don't mean to try and be the ITG, but there are very few things that tee me off more than selfish, arrogant people who think the world revolves around them.

Oh, and if you really want your blood to boil look up news stories on the idiot group "Critical Mass". They form huge groups and purposely clog the roads in cities because they are freaking babies who want to stomp their feet to get attention.

Sorry bicyclists, you bring the hate upon yourselves and it's well deserved.
The road rage is strong in this one... Hope you live in NYC so odds of you having a firearm in car is minimal. (legally)

I really have not seen bikers be any more PITA then any other traffic. (IOWA bike thing excluded) and really they were not that much of a issue.
Same with farm equipment on roads. Some folks get as mad as you. Funny thing is I drive same areas. Its rare the tractor/equipment is going more then a couple miles. So the delay is seconds not hrs (like folks make it sound)

I bought some stuff at auction and felt 40mph was max safe speed. (on 55mph max speed road) When I got car/truck behind I checked oncomming traffic. If none I did nothing. If oncomming I pulled over next R turn only lane and let them pass/pulled bck on.
The number of folks who "Showed me I was their #1" amazed me. Most hardly had to slow down/check oncomming/none/ pass. But felt they needed to communicate how they felt.
I got so I no longer pulled over unless it was semi, long string of cars.
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Old 09-02-2013, 11:15   #134
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Irrelavant. They don't have lights,(at least most I see), they don't have signals, they aren't registered, and they don't carry insurance.

They have no business on the road without those things.
Relevant, it's about taxes, not how you feel.
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Old 09-02-2013, 11:22   #135
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You could have just typed "I'm a D-bag, I drive like a D-bag, and am proud of it"... It would have been faster.
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Old 09-02-2013, 11:23   #136
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Originally Posted by Buffyfan View Post
Typical of some non-cyclists are these misconceptions:
1) Cyclists hold you up. No, hundreds of drivers, one-to-a-car hold you up. If they were all on bicycles you would not be held up;

2) Cyclists, going 15mph even riding two-abreast hold you up. Dudes if you can't pass a two cyclists going 15mph at less than the width of a car how in the world can you pass a car or a truck going 40mph?;

3) Cyclists must travel in the gutter. It's much better for them to take the road (i.e. ride in the right hand tire track of cars), and it's very predictable. It's unpredictability that's a hazard not the speed of a narrow bicycle;

4) Sometimes cyclists must take the road (riding in the center) because it's unsafe for the cars to pass them, usually when they can see on-coming traffic on a blind curve. If they don't take the road they risk frightened drivers trying to pass veering back into the lane;

5) It's not all about you. People say that cyclists do not respect them. That's hubris on the driver's part. We are just trying to get some exercise and stay alive;

6) Cyclists must use cycling lanes. Look at the lanes - they are often just 2-3 ft wide paths that do not even go where the cyclist must travel. A true cycling lane is 4 ft wide. If you want to pass a cyclist safely you should give them 3 feet of space. Often cities will paint a lane that's completely unrealistic or exists in the 'dooring' area of parked cars. You just can't ride safely in that space;

7) Consider any rider as you would a beloved friend and give them space and time. It's worth 10 seconds not to risk running over your next-door-neighbor's kid;

8) Every rider means one less car in the road to 'hold you up', or cause you to go into 'road rage'. A cyclist can't really 'cut you off';

9) Cyclists also drive so yes, they pay road taxes, too;

10) A cyclist can not harm you by 'running into your car'. You are in a two ton vehicle surrounded by steel and metal.

HtH
Good post.

I drive a large vehicle with large mirrors, so I am particularly cautious around folks on bicycles. I'd have a rough time if I injured somebody's kid because I was in a hurry.
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Old 09-02-2013, 11:25   #137
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The road rage is strong in this one... Hope you live in NYC so odds of you having a firearm in car is minimal. (legally)

I really have not seen bikers be any more PITA then any other traffic. (IOWA bike thing excluded) and really they were not that much of a issue.
Same with farm equipment on roads. Some folks get as mad as you. Funny thing is I drive same areas. Its rare the tractor/equipment is going more then a couple miles. So the delay is seconds not hrs (like folks make it sound)

I bought some stuff at auction and felt 40mph was max safe speed. (on 55mph max speed road) When I got car/truck behind I checked oncomming traffic. If none I did nothing. If oncomming I pulled over next R turn only lane and let them pass/pulled bck on.
The number of folks who "Showed me I was their #1" amazed me. Most hardly had to slow down/check oncomming/none/ pass. But felt they needed to communicate how they felt.
I got so I no longer pulled over unless it was semi, long string of cars.
People who get enraged at tractors and semi's make me wonder what the heck they eat. Perhaps they never give a thought to where their dinner comes from.

I don't like being stuck behind vehicles either, but the speed limit isn't a minimum, it's a maximum. Slow vehicles only tick me off if they're parked in the left lane, or have several vehicles stuck behind them and don't use turnouts.
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Old 09-02-2013, 11:42   #138
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A few years back I got into an accident with a bicyclist.

I travel down a stretch of road that has a beautiful bike path that runs parallel to the road. It is extremely popular with the bicyclists, they are EVERYWHERE.

As I came to the red light at the intersection, i observed a man on a bike traveling down the bike path. I put on my blinker, and stopped at the red light. After my stop, i proceeded to turn right through the red light. That is when the biker who was going straight through the intersection, ran the red light and slammed into the passenger side of my minivan just in front of the rear wheel. The damage to my vehicle was pretty extensive, he hit the power sliding door which boogered it up pretty good. Also the impact carried his head into the window and shattered it.

When I got out of my car, the first words the guy says to me are "you better have insurance, I am going to sue you". I was expecting "gee I am sorry I am such a dumbass, I cant believe I just ran a red light and plowed into your car". Not wanting to argue with this dummy, I retreated to my car to dial 911. Several cars had stopped at this point after witnessing the collision. When the police arrived 2 different witnesses confirmed my version of what happened, which sent the biker into a temper tantrum about "sharing the road".

My insurance company was contacted the day of the accident, according to their records, by this clown seeking damages, even though he "needed to go to the hospital for his significant injuries" or so he told the police. Well they needed the police report which took 2 weeks to get there. Once they received it they determined he was at fault for the collision. After they paid my claim for my car, they turned around and sued him for the full amount, plus all kinds of fees and whatnot. Not an insignificant sum of money.

Almost a full year after the accident I got served with a civil lawsuit. The jackwagon was trying to sue me for his damages as well as "pain and suffering". I contacted a lawyer, and he represented me in the matter. The day of the hearing, the jerk doesn't even show up. Judge threw the case out, and I have not heard a peep since.

What a PITA
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Old 09-02-2013, 12:08   #139
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I used to live outside of Seattle (Redmond) and there were bicyclists everywhere on the roads. For some reason they really liked the 2 lane hi ways out by Duvall and Carnation. Lots of hills and tight turns with no passing zones. A friend and I were coming down a hill and there were 3 cyclists riding abreast in our lane way below the speed limit, so my friend tapped on the horn. No response. So he got closer and honked again and they finally moved over so we could get by. Then the lady at the back swerved over right after we went by. And almost got herself run over by the boat we were towing. I'm surprised more of these idiots aren't run over.
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Old 09-02-2013, 12:11   #140
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I ride a road bike. I own and ride several motorcycles year round unless there is ice on the road. I drive a pick up truck. Like the rest of you, I have nothing to add but anecdotes based on my own experiences. That said, I have found that when I travel on two wheels I encounter, on a regular basis, motorists who are distracted, drunk, heedless/reckless, arrogant or some combination of these. I have also seen people on bicycles who give other cyclists a bad name. Common sense and basic courtesy will go a long way in making sure that we all get to use the roads and get to our destination safely.
I have a theory about people who drive aggressively or shout profanities, gesture at others, etc.. These people, men and women, will act this way when safely ensconced in their steel and glass cages, but would NEVER dream of doing the same thing if we were standing on the sidewalk within arms reach of one another. As with most bullies, the yellow streak up their back is a mile wide when they might be held to account for their actions.
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Old 09-02-2013, 13:31   #141
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I used to live outside of Seattle (Redmond) and there were bicyclists everywhere on the roads. For some reason they really liked the 2 lane hi ways out by Duvall and Carnation. Lots of hills and tight turns with no passing zones. A friend and I were coming down a hill and there were 3 cyclists riding abreast in our lane way below the speed limit, so my friend tapped on the horn. No response. So he got closer and honked again and they finally moved over so we could get by. Then the lady at the back swerved over right after we went by. And almost got herself run over by the boat we were towing. I'm surprised more of these idiots aren't run over.
That's exactly what happens around here. It usually involves two riders side by side on a 2 lane 65 MPH road and the bikes refuse to yield, which makes it extremely dangerous when a hill is coming up. You have no choice but to slow down to their speed in case another vehicle is coming up the other side of the hill.
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Old 09-02-2013, 13:40   #142
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Re:PostsOnPercocet's Post.

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...You could have just typed "I'm a D-bag, I drive like a D-bag, and am proud of it"... It would have been faster.
That's pretty funny.
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Old 09-02-2013, 13:41   #143
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That's exactly what happens around here. It usually involves two riders side by side on a 2 lane 65 MPH road and the bikes refuse to yield, which makes it extremely dangerous when a hill is coming up. You have no choice but to slow down to their speed in case another vehicle is coming up the other side of the hill.
Simple solution. Keep one of those little air horns for small boats in your car. Stick out window, blow untill bikers get tired of being jackasses.

Literally works every time.

Stop allowing them to create issues for all of us without repercussions and they'll quickly become civil and courteous.
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Old 09-02-2013, 13:52   #144
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...
And, if you want to mess with bikers, think about how many threads there are, even here, about CCW on a bike...do you really want to cause a shooting due to your road rage and inability to deal with what is really a minor inconvenience?
I carry this S&W .357 Magnum when I'm on either my Harley or my Trek 7.7.

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Old 09-02-2013, 13:58   #145
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I carry this S&W .357 Magnum when I'm on either my Harley or my Trek 7.7.
Well you be careful....there are plenty of guys out there in F250's with towing mirrors and 'train horns' looking to run you off the road.
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Old 09-02-2013, 14:06   #146
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I carry this S&W .357 Magnum when I'm on either my Harley or my Trek 7.7.

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I ain't the brightest, but how exactly do you plan to do anything other than get yourself flattened with a 357 against a 2 or more ton vehicle?


Because honestly if I ever saw a biker clear leather towards my vehicle, my first reaction would be to put 7K lbs of gmc on him.
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Old 09-02-2013, 14:15   #147
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Well you be careful....there are plenty of guys out there in F250's with towing mirrors and 'train horns' looking to run you off the road.
That's pretty funny. It's interesting that very few people in my bike club carry, but most riders in my motorcycle club have a concealed weapon.
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Old 09-02-2013, 14:20   #148
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You've certainly proved you have one.

Didn't it feel strange writing your long winded post admitting that you act like a petulant child, break traffic laws, and threaten other people like a schoolyard bully? I would expect that response from a 12 year old, but you said you have been driving for 19 years. I get that in your area there are cyclist idiots on some kind of social justice mission...but that doesn't make your admitted actions or attitude right.

You could have just typed "I'm a D-bag, I drive like a D-bag, and am proud of it"... It would have been faster.

LOL, so I'm a d-bag for calling out people who don't follow the rules of the road? That says a lot about you, not me.

And were did I say I break the rules? I drive like a granny, and I have the records from my car to prove it.

When I come to a 4 way stop, I go when it's my turn. If some inconsiderate, arrogant, selfish d-bag on a bike thinks he can blow past a stop sign, that's not my fault or problem, and it certainly isn't me breaking the rules. And when he starts to yell at me because I called out selfishness I consider that a confession. All one has to say is, "sorry".

Something to think about. Most people don't wake up in the morning and think about how they can't wait to get frustrated in traffic and yell at someone. I'm fine until I repeatedly run into self absorbed jerks who think the rules don't apply to them.

Seriously....? You sound like a liberal. Blame the victim. I'm the one who has to deal with bikers who don't follow the rules, and you think I'm the problem? Explain how that makes sense. I just don't get it.

I'm not on any mission. I'd like people to follow the rules and not be arrogant, selfish, the world revolves around me pricks. And in your mind that makes me a d-bag? Incredible.

Let me guess, you ride a bike and have the attitude I ALWAYS hear from bikers; "I drive so I can stay alive, I don't care if I break laws and people have to wait". Translation: ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME

Do you also wait until the last second to merge so you can cut off as many as us plebes as you can? Do you turn right after the light turned red because you can't be bothered to wait until you get a green again? I mean, really, why should YOU wait? Do you also drive 55 in the left hand lane because you think you're helping out by trying to demand others drive the way you feel they should?

Do you use your blinkers? Do you stomp on the gas when someone signals to get in front of you because, hey, why should they get in front of YOU. Do you pull right up at stores and sit in the "No Parking or Standing" spots? Because hey, why should YOU park where the plebes park!! Why should YOU have to walk?

The mere fact that you think I'm a d-bag because I call people out for not following the rules says TONS about you. TONS.


Yeah, I'm proud of the fact that I do what's right and call people out who don't. Don't like that? Don't be a d-bag to others. Problem solved.

yeesh....


Edit:
Oh, and guess what? I have a camera in my car. The look on peoples' face's when they find out the lie they just told is going to have to hold up against a video is priceless. Smug turns into apologetic and misunderstanding in milliseconds. Cars should all have these, but it's a must if you ride a motorcycle.

Edit 2:
Look, I don't know you, you don't know me. You could be a great guy. I'm not going to continues this with you, it's pointless to argue on the net.

You think people should be allowed to inconveniences others, and everyone else should just deal with it. You think the victim is to blame.

I think people should act like courteous adults in public and people should be held accountable for their actions.

Since we aren't going to agree here, I'm just going to let it go and whoever reads this thread can decide who is right. I'm not going to change and I'm sure you're not either so what's the point in arguing.

It's also pointless to get mad at someone in a general forum and take the chance of them not helping you in a technical forum because of bad feelings. It's just the internet, and I'm not going to take this that serious. It doesn't do either of us any good.

Last edited by PostsOnPercocet; 09-02-2013 at 14:31..
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Old 09-02-2013, 14:24   #149
PostsOnPercocet
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Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 151
Quote:
Originally Posted by AK_Stick View Post
Simple solution. Keep one of those little air horns for small boats in your car. Stick out window, blow untill bikers get tired of being jackasses.

Literally works every time.

Stop allowing them to create issues for all of us without repercussions and they'll quickly become civil and courteous.

This.

People act like jerks today because there is no consequences. We live in a society today where the victim gets blamed and not the goons acting like they own the world.

Back in the day, if you did something stupid, you got punched in the nose and you thought twice about it next time.

Today? It's not your fault you did that! You're stressed. The car made you do it. The gun made you do it. People should just give you a break!

You should be able to inconvenience people and they should just have to deal with it because the world revolves around you!

That's one of the main problems in America today.
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Old 09-02-2013, 15:02   #150
yz9890
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Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 238
Quote:
Originally Posted by GVFlyer View Post
I carry this S&W .357 Magnum when I'm on either my Harley or my Trek 7.7.

The Okie Corral
I carry a snub in my frame bag also. But I don't carry any patches with the planes I fly with me. I doubt they're of any practical use in a defensive situation.
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