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Old 07-01-2013, 16:56   #1
cddanjr
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230 vs 200 vs 185g

Ok have been reloading for my 45acp's. So far I have only used x-treme 230g copper round nose bullets, IMR 700x powder at 4.75-4.8g, CCI 300 primers, OAL 1.22" They shoot Awesome! super tight out of my Sig 1911.

NOW, the price of X-Treme bullets has gone up from $62/500 to almost $80/500!

So I am gonna try some 200g Lead flat point, and 185g lead wad cutter bullets. Much cheaper, and aside from a different load data for EACH bullet, what are your pros and cons about the 200g and 185g loads.

my shooting as for indoor targets up to 25yds, mostly 7-10 yds

Chuck
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Old 07-01-2013, 17:21   #2
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Personally, I find three distinct advantages to the heavier (230 grain) bullet.

One, the recoil is much tamer, being more of a gradual push than a slap.

Two, the heavier bullet takes up more case volume, making combustion very consistent. With the heavy bullet, I regularly see single digit extreme spreads. The lighter bullets often produce velocities with 50-60 fps extreme spreads.

Three, it's much easier to achieve power factor when the multiplier is 230 rather than 200.

I know the heavier bullets are more expensive. But, they seem to be a real advantage in operating a 1911.
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Old 07-01-2013, 18:15   #3
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Since Xtreme raised their prices I'll be ordering http://www.precisiondelta.com/product.php?indx=5.

Unless TJ Conevra doesn't raise his Xtreme prices. I would assume Xtreme raised his cost and he will be raising his prices too.
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Old 07-01-2013, 18:49   #4
cddanjr
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Originally Posted by ursoboostd View Post
Since Xtreme raised their prices I'll be ordering http://www.precisiondelta.com/product.php?indx=5.

Unless TJ Conevra doesn't raise his Xtreme prices. I would assume Xtreme raised his cost and he will be raising his prices too.
The day I saw multiple price stickers on boxes of Xtreme bullets at my local gun store, The Stockade in Garden Grove, I realized they were old stock that was jacked up from earlier prices. I told the guy behind the counter he could have atleast removed all the old price stickers off before he jacked up the prices! I told him I had a source where I could get 1000 bullets for $135! he said," where is that?" YEAH I'm gonna tell you so you can buy it up and raise the price on them too! ya rube. I have several orders in with precision delta. S&S also.

Chuck
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Old 07-01-2013, 20:45   #5
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I use 185 and 200gr LSWCs all the time for range shooting. I like 5gr of Solo-1000 under them. They work great in my 1911 and my 625. There are many good recipes for them using Clays, Bullseye, Titegroup, and other fast powders in most reloading manuals.
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Old 07-01-2013, 22:13   #6
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Originally Posted by Three-Five-Seven View Post
Personally, I find three distinct advantages to the heavier (230 grain) bullet.

One, the recoil is much tamer, being more of a gradual push than a slap.
That assumes you're trying to keep the PF equal. If you don't mind shooting .45 minor PF, 200gr and 185gr can be loaded with really minimal recoil.

i.e. to keep the PF equal to 230gr factory loads, a 185gr needs to be doing around 1000fps...but my Glocks will run on 185s loaded to only about 800fps. If you're just punching paper or knocking down plates, the extra 200fps won't be missed.
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Old 07-01-2013, 22:51   #7
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Montana gold for me

http://montanagoldbullet.com/index.p.../result/?q=.45

Great if you want a jacket bullet.
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Old 07-02-2013, 13:29   #8
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Originally Posted by Three-Five-Seven View Post
Personally, I find three distinct advantages to the heavier (230 grain) bullet.

One, the recoil is much tamer, being more of a gradual push than a slap.

Two, the heavier bullet takes up more case volume, making combustion very consistent. With the heavy bullet, I regularly see single digit extreme spreads. The lighter bullets often produce velocities with 50-60 fps extreme spreads.

Three, it's much easier to achieve power factor when the multiplier is 230 rather than 200.

I know the heavier bullets are more expensive. But, they seem to be a real advantage in operating a 1911.
All pretty much true BUT. The 200gr has pretty much been the target bullet of choice for decades, lots of data, soft recoil running under 800fps. Yes, if you need to make min 165PF, it is easier to get there w/ a heavier bullet, but all my 45s; XD, 1911, all will run stock springs w/ a 200gr bullet @ 830fps. Recoil still seems soft, but a 230gr @ 750fps is a bit softer still. For a minor load, the 200gr is perfect running 700fps, but may require one spring rate reduction for 100% in some guns.
The issue w/ the 185gr is in many guns, you have to drop a spring rate to get reliable feeding or to get min PF, run them @ 920fps, they get snappy. So if you don't want to respring the gun, I think you can save a little $$ & go 200gr & not be recoil penalized w/ a min PF of 170ish.
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Old 07-02-2013, 14:28   #9
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I would shove a 250gr Colt bullet on it and run it at 680 fps. Just sayin.
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Old 07-02-2013, 18:15   #10
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I would shove a 250gr Colt bullet on it and run it at 680 fps. Just sayin.
Tried it, I doubt anyone can tell the recoil diff between that & a 230gr @ 730fps. For that matter, I doubt you can really tell the diff between either & a 200gr @ 830fps.
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Old 07-02-2013, 22:19   #11
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Never gone below 200g myself. However, I've shot thousands of 200g LSWC over 4.3g of Clays. Nice soft shooting, accurate load.


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Old 07-03-2013, 00:49   #12
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The most accurate .45acp I have ever loaded was Nosler 185 HP Custom Comp with WSF. I also really favor Berry's 185 HBRN. But for plinking I like 230 because you use less powder.
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Old 07-03-2013, 08:51   #13
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The most accurate .45acp I have ever loaded was Nosler 185 HP Custom Comp with WSF. I also really favor Berry's 185 HBRN. But for plinking I like 230 because you use less powder.
So let me get this, you use a 1c more expensive bullet to save 1/2c less powder? You've ben living in Kalif too long.
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Old 07-03-2013, 09:23   #14
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So let me get this, you use a 1c more expensive bullet to save 1/2c less powder? You've ben living in Kalif too long.
? I don't use the nosler's to save money. I use the berry's and usually buy local and they are all priced the same. Yes it sounds like Kali math if you use online prices.
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25acp,.223,25-20win,.308, 8mm M, 7mm Rem Mag, 9mm,.40,10mm .45acp, .475 Wildey Mag
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As Reloaders we should adapt the load to the gun, not the gun to the load.
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Old 07-03-2013, 09:51   #15
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Tried it, I doubt anyone can tell the recoil diff between that & a 230gr @ 730fps. For that matter, I doubt you can really tell the diff between either & a 200gr @ 830fps.
But it's way cooler to shoot a 45 Colt Bullet.

Also,

Long Colt, Long Colt.

That was for Steve.
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Old 07-03-2013, 12:35   #16
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Originally Posted by Three-Five-Seven View Post
Personally, I find three distinct advantages to the heavier (230 grain) bullet.

One, the recoil is much tamer, being more of a gradual push than a slap.

Two, the heavier bullet takes up more case volume, making combustion very consistent. With the heavy bullet, I regularly see single digit extreme spreads. The lighter bullets often produce velocities with 50-60 fps extreme spreads.

Three, it's much easier to achieve power factor when the multiplier is 230 rather than 200.

I know the heavier bullets are more expensive. But, they seem to be a real advantage in operating a 1911.
I like my practice ammo to be as zippy as my carry ammo. I'm a bit old-school in that I'm more confident that my 1000+fps 185gr JHP will open up.

The muzzle rise difference between hot 230gr and 185gr fodder is significant to me - that's why I like 185gr. I switched from 200gr to 185gr lswc years ago to match my 185gr XTP and I try to keep the velocities equal.
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Old 07-03-2013, 16:30   #17
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? I don't use the nosler's to save money. I use the berry's and usually buy local and they are all priced the same. Yes it sounds like Kali math if you use online prices.
No, you said you like to use 230gr to plink with to save powder. Powder is cheap compared to bullets & even primers now days. At most places a 230gr bullet costs a bit more than 200 or 185.
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Old 07-03-2013, 20:06   #18
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Originally Posted by fredj338 View Post
No, you said you like to use 230gr to plink with to save powder. Powder is cheap compared to bullets & even primers now days. At most places a 230gr bullet costs a bit more than 200 or 185.
Well here in SD @ LMC (LGS) all Berry's 250ct used to be $38. So in that point its cheaper to buy 230gr. But in the real world its not cheaper to shoot 230. Now at the LGS powder ain't so cheap $59 for 1lb.
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se carga el diablo de la pistola...
25acp,.223,25-20win,.308, 8mm M, 7mm Rem Mag, 9mm,.40,10mm .45acp, .475 Wildey Mag
On 2 Hornady LNL's And a Super 1050

As Reloaders we should adapt the load to the gun, not the gun to the load.
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Old 07-03-2013, 22:48   #19
fredj338
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Well here in SD @ LMC (LGS) all Berry's 250ct used to be $38. So in that point its cheaper to buy 230gr. But in the real world its not cheaper to shoot 230. Now at the LGS powder ain't so cheap $59 for 1lb.
Ouch, & you still buy from them? Fortuantely, I always keep stuff on hand, so haven't even been local to look @ powder prices. There are no primers to really price, but here & there U still get stuff at a good price. Hopefully this all blows over sometime next year & I can restock, but Kalif aint looking so good. If they ban internet sales, then I am gonna have to make a trip to AZ or NV once a year & stock up.
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Old 07-03-2013, 23:52   #20
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Man, at $60 a pound you could drive to Portland and pick up some powder...
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