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Old 05-11-2013, 05:38   #1
vyper005
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Do you guys use a light on your Glocks ??

If so, what brand ?? any problems/complaints etc ?? I recently ordered an Insight M3X Led for my 21SF. I think it said it puts out around 150 lumens....
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Old 05-11-2013, 05:55   #2
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TLR-2s.

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Old 05-11-2013, 06:13   #3
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No. A light can give away your location and I don't want any metal projectiles traveling at a high rate of speed, aimed at my gun light.

Anyway, it's a totally personal choice to make.
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Old 05-11-2013, 06:56   #4
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M3X is a good light, you will like it.
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Old 05-11-2013, 06:59   #5
cmr287
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I use a Insight Technology Light with my 19 or 22.

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Old 05-11-2013, 07:05   #6
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No. A light can give away your location and I don't want any metal projectiles traveling at a high rate of speed, aimed at my gun light.

Anyway, it's a totally personal choice to make.
100% correct Bro!!
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Old 05-11-2013, 07:12   #7
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Personal choice. I do use a light (surefire), just not on my gun as I don't want to be pointing my gun at anything until I know it is a threat.
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Old 05-11-2013, 07:20   #8
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No. A light can give away your location and I don't want any metal projectiles traveling at a high rate of speed, aimed at my gun light.

Anyway, it's a totally personal choice to make.
I respect your opinion and I hear this line of thinking a lot, but I disagree. Ideally your light should not be "always on" (quick bursts to help you find your way while moving) unless you are on target. At which point the disorienting and blinding nature of quality WMLs shined at someone's face will give you enough of an advantage to stop your threat before they can take action.
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Old 05-11-2013, 07:22   #9
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It should be noted that when I say "quick bursts" I mean with the weapon pointed at an angle down and at hard ready. And by quick I mean under a second, enough to give me a mental image of the next several feet I'll be covering.
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Old 05-11-2013, 07:26   #10
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Lose the Light

I am of the school of thought that a light on my weapon is bad for at least two reasons: 1. It could very well give away my location to the bad guy; 2. It adds unwanted bulk and weight to the firearm. It also incurs (to me) an extra expense, which funds could be applied more judiciously towards other defensive means (e.g., a case of ammo, a tomahawk, baseball bat, foghorn, grizzly bear pepper spray, etc.).

Just my opinion.

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Old 05-11-2013, 07:37   #11
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Yes, streamlight TLR-1, Surefire x200, insight. In that order IMO. The TLR locking system is the best if you are carrying in a kydex type holster. I've had the other come off my Glock when drawing out of certain kydex (custom made) holsters. However if I am using one of the other two I have holter specifically for that light combo. My Surefire has been on one of my many guns (multiple ARs, Glocks, Sigs, 1911s, shotgun) everyday for the last 4years and I've never changed the battery. All are amazing

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Old 05-11-2013, 07:55   #12
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Gents, I'm not trying to argue tactics here, there is a down side to everything. But the "the light will give away my position" statement makes no sense. Unless you are in a pitch black setting wearing NVGs and the bad guy isn't in which case you wouldn't need the light or you don't use at that time.

I don't know of any ninjas running around on GT that have to shoot a bad guy that can't see the ninja in first place. I don't know if you've ever trained to shoot a threat with 150lumens shining at you but its pretty freaking hard.

Last every military, LEO entering an objective with little or no light present has a weapon light attached or a hand held ready to go and they aren't all dead. When was the last time you heard a navy seal dying in a late night raid because he used his weapon light?

Just IMO, thank you for sharing yours. I'll stop now
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Old 05-11-2013, 08:07   #13
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My line of thought on weapon attached lights:

1. Quickly identify friend or foe if in a position where either is not identified.... Oops doesn't work once the trigger is pulled.

2. Target and location acquisition... in complete or near darkness tripping over a toy, flower pot, stump, etc.. would still expose location and you would have a severe disadvantage.

3. Allows weak hand access to other devices... grabbing or holding cell phone, door knobs...etc..

4. Just because its there doesn't mean you have to use it.... but I would hate to be in a position where I am wishing I had a flashlight with gun drawn.... I want all the advantage if it comes down to a dark engagement.

5. Makes me buy more stuff!!
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Old 05-11-2013, 08:29   #14
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Originally Posted by Infidel4life11 View Post
Gents, I'm not trying to argue tactics here, there is a down side to everything. But the "the light will give away my position" statement makes no sense. Unless you are in a pitch black setting wearing NVGs and the bad guy isn't in which case you wouldn't need the light or you don't use at that time.

I don't know of any ninjas running around on GT that have to shoot a bad guy that can't see the ninja in first place. I don't know if you've ever trained to shoot a threat with 150lumens shining at you but its pretty freaking hard.

Last every military, LEO entering an objective with little or no light present has a weapon light attached or a hand held ready to go and they aren't all dead. When was the last time you heard a navy seal dying in a late night raid because he used his weapon light?

Just IMO, thank you for sharing yours. I'll stop now

I agree with all of your points.
its mighty hard to look into the beam of a bright tac light without being blinded, it even hurts.
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Old 05-11-2013, 08:34   #15
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Originally Posted by Infidel4life11 View Post
Gents, I'm not trying to argue tactics here, there is a down side to everything. But the "the light will give away my position" statement makes no sense. Unless you are in a pitch black setting wearing NVGs and the bad guy isn't in which case you wouldn't need the light or you don't use at that time.

I don't know of any ninjas running around on GT that have to shoot a bad guy that can't see the ninja in first place. I don't know if you've ever trained to shoot a threat with 150lumens shining at you but its pretty freaking hard.

Last every military, LEO entering an objective with little or no light present has a weapon light attached or a hand held ready to go and they aren't all dead. When was the last time you heard a navy seal dying in a late night raid because he used his weapon light?

Just IMO, thank you for sharing yours. I'll stop now
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Old 05-11-2013, 08:53   #16
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My bedside gun is a G19 with an X300. Theres a G2X sitting next to it.
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Old 05-11-2013, 09:06   #17
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To add to what Infidel4life11 stated, here's some of my $0.02.

I agree 100% with everything he stated, and I will just add my perspective now that I am older and have a family. I have (2) kids in the house (and one on the way), my girls are 5 and 20 months. The 5 year old is always getting up in the middle of the night because she had a bad dream, heard a noise that scared her etc. My 20 month old, she doesn't climb out of bed because we raised the rails on the crib, lol, but soon she will be in a regular bed and doing as her big sister I am sure. My point is, there are people in my house, (big and little) that get thirsty in the middle of the night, get scared, whatever, but they're up and moving. The BIGGEST factor for me to have a light is to NOT shoot a loved one, not TO shoot a bad guy. The target needs to be identified, period, whether good or bad. And in MY house the chances of something moving around in the dark being "friendly" are much greater than it being the other way around. I have spoken with LE from various parts of the country and almost all of them have stories about someone's Dad shooting one of their kids who had snuck out and come back home, or a loved one snooping around downstairs, etc.

While many of us might have pre conceived notions of what really happens with a light in the dark, getting training doing a night shoot, especially in a shoot house really opens your eyes to things.

To demonstrate a point the other day at the shop to a customer (he just bought an X-300 Ultra, when he was clicking his light on in the shop which was well lit, the owner came up beside him un noticed and blocked the light with his hand, which momentarily blinded the customer. And this was in a well lit area. There are many scenarios that could take place, and people can theorize about whatever they want, there is no substitute for training (experience).

"For Me" I first want to make sure what I might think is a bad guy, is not my wife or one of my kids.

YMMV

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Old 05-11-2013, 09:33   #18
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No. A light can give away your location and I don't want any metal projectiles traveling at a high rate of speed, aimed at my gun light. Anyway, it's a totally personal choice to make.
I like the way you think!

My personal opinion is that attached tac lights are both useful and entirely acceptable to use IF you are part of a multi-member team; or if you have someone else, there, to immediately back your movements up (like a sniper on the periphery). Otherwise if you don't catch the bad guy(s) in the beam on your first flash then he/they are going to know exactly where you are, and in which direction your pistol is pointing!

(Ouch!)
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Old 05-11-2013, 09:47   #19
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Armed bad guys aren't constricted by laws or policy and will generally shoot at a target whether it's identified to them or not. Good guys must id a potential threat before they can shoot or decide not to. Proper training shows with WML, good guys can id threats and make proper lawful decisions before bad guys can "shoot the light". Remember training isn't you going to the range a popping some paper targets and calling it a day.

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Old 05-11-2013, 09:57   #20
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Simple

A weapon mounted light is a flashlight, conveniently located on your weapon....

Just to state the obvious.

I see it in a more simple fashion. It's there to use, if you need light. Whether it's a WML or a hand held flashlight - it's turned on when needed, and turned off when needed. Either one will disclose your location.

I'd rather go with the one that frees my other hand up.

And...no...the weapon doesn't have to be pointed at someone, to determine threat.
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Old 05-11-2013, 10:07   #21
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Originally Posted by Infidel4life11 View Post
Gents, I'm not trying to argue tactics here, there is a down side to everything. But the "the light will give away my position" statement makes no sense. Unless you are in a pitch black setting wearing NVGs and the bad guy isn't in which case you wouldn't need the light or you don't use at that time.

I don't know of any ninjas running around on GT that have to shoot a bad guy that can't see the ninja in first place. I don't know if you've ever trained to shoot a threat with 150lumens shining at you but its pretty freaking hard.

Last every military, LEO entering an objective with little or no light present has a weapon light attached or a hand held ready to go and they aren't all dead. When was the last time you heard a navy seal dying in a late night raid because he used his weapon light?

Just IMO, thank you for sharing yours. I'll stop now
Sounds like really great internet palaver; but it's, also, absolutely incorrect! (No offense, OK!)

Hold onto that opinion when it really matters; and you will quickly, 'disappear'! If you're working solo, and attempt to follow an experienced gunman through the dark with a light on your pistol, several bad things are going to occur:

(1) The bad guy will go to the deepest darkest cover he can find.

(2) You will have the disadvantage of being, 'night blind'; but he will not.

(3) Not being completely stupid he will attempt to engage you obliquely; and,

(4) Instead of aggressively revealing himself, he will do the smart thing, and track your movements INDIRECTLY by using his peripheral vision in order to watch your tac light's beam.

(5) Finally, once your beam (and pistol) is pointing away from him, he will suddenly step out and furiously engage you. Is this, really, a game that you want to play?

I believe in and use tac lights; but, I'll tell you something I only rarely admit to: It's my partner, and not me who's holding the light. I'm the one who's standing across the room, holding the gun.
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Old 05-11-2013, 10:09   #22
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If so, what brand ?? any problems/complaints etc ?? I recently ordered an Insight M3X Led for my 21SF. I think it said it puts out around 150 lumens....
The only light I use and like is the muzzel flash from my Glock 33 . 357 sig.
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Old 05-11-2013, 10:24   #23
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Sounds like really great internet palaver; but it's, also, absolutely incorrect! (No offense, OK!)

Hold onto that opinion when it really matters; and you will quickly, 'disappear'! If you're working solo, and attempt to follow an experienced gunman through the dark with a light on your pistol, several bad things are going to occur:

(1) The bad guy will go to the deepest darkest cover he can find.

(2) You will have the disadvantage of being, 'night blind'; but he will not.

(3) Not being completely stupid he will attempt to engage you obliquely; and,

(4) Instead of aggressively revealing himself, he will do the smart thing, and track your movements INDIRECTLY by using his peripheral vision in order to watch your tac light's beam.

(5) Finally, once your beam (and pistol) is pointing away from him, he will suddenly step out and furiously engage you. Is this, really, a game that you want to play?

I believe in and use tac lights; but, I'll tell you something I only rarely admit to: It's my partner, and not me who's holding the light. I'm the one who's standing across the room, holding the gun.
Arc Angel...

I get your point....But your scenario outlined assumes that one would be tracking an individual with the light on.

The light is there as a useful tool...it doesn't have to be ON. One would "burst" the light if he/she intelligently sees fit...but obviously not when tracking a bad guy - for the reasons you've stated.

Options, Options, Options...The WML gives you the option of using, it...it doesn't mean you HAVE to.

But at least you have the option.

EDIT - to stay on topic...I'm leaning towards this INFORCE light...
http://www.inforce-mil.com/pistol-lights.php
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Old 05-11-2013, 10:24   #24
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Amen.
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Old 05-11-2013, 11:09   #25
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Sounds like really great internet palaver; but it's, also, absolutely incorrect! (No offense, OK!)

Hold onto that opinion when it really matters; and you will quickly, 'disappear'! If you're working solo, and attempt to follow an experienced gunman through the dark with a light on your pistol, several bad things are going to occur:

(1) The bad guy will go to the deepest darkest cover he can find.

(2) You will have the disadvantage of being, 'night blind'; but he will not.

(3) Not being completely stupid he will attempt to engage you obliquely; and,

(4) Instead of aggressively revealing himself, he will do the smart thing, and track your movements INDIRECTLY by using his peripheral vision in order to watch your tac light's beam.

(5) Finally, once your beam (and pistol) is pointing away from him, he will suddenly step out and furiously engage you. Is this, really, a game that you want to play?

I believe in and use tac lights; but, I'll tell you something I only rarely admit to: It's my partner, and not me who's holding the light. I'm the one who's standing across the room, holding the gun.
Your points are based on several incorrect assumptions on the proper use of weapon mounted lights, the level of intelligence and tactical awareness of most criminals, and the speed with which these things generally go down. Finally, no offense, but your last statement about your "partner" being the one with the light is rather ******y. I wonder if your "partners" realize that you value them for nothing more than drawing fire.
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