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Old 04-28-2013, 20:08   #76
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What is the second highest degree that you can be? Is it 34th? I don't remember exactly, my grandpa told me once, but his dad was the second highest degree you could be, I just don't remember the number.

And doesn't the person with the very highest degree actually live at the lodge? Or is that just a rumor?
I really don't know. There are so many side organizations or appendant organizations that all have their own degrees that I don't think anyone even knows how many degrees there are. In Scottish rite there are 33 degrees, which are really 34 because there are two kinds of 33rd degrees, the honorary degree and the actual degree which gives the member a seat on the governing body of the Scottish rite. No one lives in the lodge so far as I know. If there was a homeless brother I can imagine him living in his lodge with permission of the master, until he got back on his feet, although I've never heard of anything like that I'm trying to think of circumstances where it might actually occur.

In the blue lodge there are 3 degrees, but really 4 because past master is a separate degree, which you need to be master of a lodge. In Red lodge they have more, in Scottish rite they have more, etc. My dad for example has four masonic degrees which are the 3 blue lodge degrees and 32nd degree Scottish rite. He's a 32nd degree mason but has 4 degrees, lol. If you tried to add up the degrees from all the appendant organizations I think they'd count into the hundreds. Whether any of them make you a higher ranked mason is of some controversy. In the organizations that give additional degrees they certainly do. My best guess is that some people get addicted to receiving degrees and to making a lot of dues payments for reasons that escape myself.
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Old 04-28-2013, 20:15   #77
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My grandfather was a mason. His father was a member of the invisible empire. I've been asked if I am interested. On advice of three Pastors (two of whom are Scots) my response was "no". As a Christian I am wary of the Masons requirement to believe only in a "Higher Power". There are many "higher powers" that are not the Judeo-Christian God.
That's perfectly fine. As a mason I wouldn't want you to do anything that would violate your conscience. You can never go too far wrong erring on the side of upholding your highest ideals and ideas imo. The people who argue the point I think are more just trying to convince others for their own sake of not feeling slandered, which I think again is rather silly because all people will never agree on anything. No one will ever ask you to join, you have to want to. If someone says they don't like it I see no reason to continue telling them about it. Its not for everyone. Regards.
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Old 04-28-2013, 21:03   #78
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I've never known anyone to actually live in the lodge. In fact, most lodges I've ever been to share /rent building space with other groups. Our local lodge houses a church, a synagogue,a girl scout troop,as well as the lodge, Eastern Star Chapter and our Rainbw Assembly.

There us so much silliness and unbelievable nonsense " out there", but there are just as any ridiculous Goofball theories about any/everything else,,I suppose.
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Old 04-28-2013, 21:07   #79
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Many times we have had non masonic guests come and talk on a variety of subjects as well as strictly masonic lessons.
How do they get past your tyler? Why would your master allow a nonmason in a tyled lodge under any circumstances? Is your district deputy cool with this? That is bizarre imo.
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Old 04-28-2013, 21:17   #80
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How do they get past your tyler? Why would your master allow a nonmason in a tyled lodge under any circumstances? Is your district deputy cool with this? That is bizarre imo.
Why does it have to be in a tyled lodge?


Lots of things can happen in a room next to a lodge.
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Old 04-28-2013, 21:21   #81
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Why does it have to be in a tyled lodge?


Lots of things can happen in a room next to a lodge.
Well duh... I never thought of that. We have a LEO (lodge education officer) and occasionally a visiting brother who stands in for him, always part of lodge, after conducting business before being dismissed for refreshment. Of course if it were not in lodge it wouldn't matter. Sometimes I miss the obvious. lol
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Old 04-28-2013, 21:31   #82
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How do they get past your tyler? Why would your master allow a nonmason in a tyled lodge under any circumstances? Is your district deputy cool with this? That is bizarre imo.
It is not tyled at the time they are in the room. We call off. When the non masons are in the room the lodge is not at work. They are excused and we procede to close as a tyled meeting.
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Old 04-28-2013, 21:32   #83
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Would a Deist who believes in some form of unknowable higher power but not in any organized religion be accepted?
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Old 04-28-2013, 21:38   #84
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Would a Deist who believes in some form of unknowable higher power but not in any organized religion be accepted?
In our jurisdiction we only ask if a man professes a belief in a Supreme Being. What and how he believes and how devoute or active he is in his belief is his own buisness.
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Old 04-28-2013, 21:44   #85
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Would a Deist who believes in some form of unknowable higher power but not in any organized religion be accepted?
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Would a Deist who believes in some form of unknowable higher power but not in any organized religion be accepted?
Yes, 100% yes. This was the most common belief of early masons to the best of my knowledge. I believe in 'divine providence' and an all encompassing spirit. The Christians have a habit of taking over organizations and they have to a certain extent made a lot of lodges Christian, requiring a belief in the Bible or something but that is unique to a few lodges, but it'll never really be a religious group, except for some of the appendant orgs which might be. To join the commandery for instance you must have a trinitarian christian belief, buts that's totally separate from craft masonry.
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Old 04-28-2013, 21:55   #86
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interesting... how long does it take to get to the top? how much time and money would one have spent?
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Old 04-28-2013, 22:01   #87
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I really don't know. There are so many side organizations or appendant organizations that all have their own degrees that I don't think anyone even knows how many degrees there are. In Scottish rite there are 33 degrees, which are really 34 because there are two kinds of 33rd degrees, the honorary degree and the actual degree which gives the member a seat on the governing body of the Scottish rite. No one lives in the lodge so far as I know. If there was a homeless brother I can imagine him living in his lodge with permission of the master, until he got back on his feet, although I've never heard of anything like that I'm trying to think of circumstances where it might actually occur.

In the blue lodge there are 3 degrees, but really 4 because past master is a separate degree, which you need to be master of a lodge. In Red lodge they have more, in Scottish rite they have more, etc. My dad for example has four masonic degrees which are the 3 blue lodge degrees and 32nd degree Scottish rite. He's a 32nd degree mason but has 4 degrees, lol. If you tried to add up the degrees from all the appendant organizations I think they'd count into the hundreds. Whether any of them make you a higher ranked mason is of some controversy. In the organizations that give additional degrees they certainly do. My best guess is that some people get addicted to receiving degrees and to making a lot of dues payments for reasons that escape myself.
If I had to take a wild stab, I'd guess he was part of the Scottish rite, but I truly have no idea. I need to talk to my grandpa more about his dad, the Masons have always interested me, and I've always wanted to know more about them.

And I honestly have no idea where I heard that there is one guy who lives in the lodge. I might have picked it up from my grandpa, maybe it was an old tradition that was done for his dad's lodge, I don't know, I don't remember where I heard it. It's also entirely possible that it's purely rumor and doesn't actually happen

That's part of the fun of learning about the masons, it's not exactly easy to pick out fact from rumor.
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Old 04-28-2013, 22:01   #88
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interesting... how long does it take to get to the top? how much time and money would one have spent?
In my lodge the three degrees cost $425. That mostly covers the cost of renting the lodge room. Most people finish in less than a year. There is some memorization to be completed for each degree. How fast you finish depends on how fast you memorize. I did one in a week. I was sick in bed and had nothingn else to do. Dues are $120 a year.
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Old 04-28-2013, 22:04   #89
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interesting... how long does it take to get to the top? how much time and money would one have spent?


To become a Master Mason, will take several months (at least, my Jurisdiction gives you a year to get it done).

It doenst cost the same everywhere but a couple of hundred bucks at most and then annual dues...which can be under a hundred bucks a year in some places and several hundred a year in others.

Onc can move up into leadership roles or into other Masonic groups after they are a Master Mason.

It really isnt an expensive experience. One would probably spend a more joining an adult softball league.
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Old 04-28-2013, 22:05   #90
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I kind of think if the masons werent so secretive, if there was more defined fact and less rumor, they may get more people to attend
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Old 04-28-2013, 22:07   #91
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It really isnt an expensive experience. One would probably spend a more joining an adult softball league.
I is one of the least expensive thngs I do. And has one of the greatest returns.
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Old 04-28-2013, 22:07   #92
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interesting... how long does it take to get to the top? how much time and money would one have spent?
Initiation fees and first year dues were a grand total of $165 at my lodge. That covered all the expenses of the lodge in the stuff you're given which I won't get into because I don't want to spoil it for you if you do it. Time, usually a minimum for 30 days between degrees, usually 6 or 8 months total. There are also one day classes where they give candidates receive all three degrees. I'd avoid those and don't even like the idea of them though except for perhaps a man who's just been given orders to ship out for combat and who may benefit from his masonry while serving our country in peril of his life. But it has become common for lots of guys to do the one day class without any real reason to except to save time and avoid the memory work.
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Old 04-28-2013, 22:12   #93
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I kind of think if the masons werent so secretive, if there was more defined fact and less rumor, they may get more people to attend
Here is a thread, where a bunch of Masons are talking a lot about Masonry.

You want a map and a contact to the lodge closest to you (or any place)...google it. The Masons themselves will say "here we are"

Masons are happy to tell you a lot about various aspects of Masonry. Masons are not an secret group, they are a group with secrets and good people who are genuinely interested, without mercenary reasons and qualify(for example, cant be an athiest) can join.

It is true that Masonic membership has declined in a lot of places but there is actually a very real resurgence going on these days.
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I cross my heart and hope not to die. Swallow evil, ride the sky. Lose myself in a crowded room. You fool, you fool, it will be here soon
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Old 04-28-2013, 22:12   #94
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I kind of think if the masons werent so secretive, if there was more defined fact and less rumor, they may get more people to attend
If you have a library card you can learn all the secrets. There really aren't any left, aside from what brother might confide to each other in confidence. Even within the tyled lodge the secrets are not that interesting. Guess who seconded the motion to pay the bills this month, lol.
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Old 04-28-2013, 22:28   #95
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Some of the finest and most upstanding men I've personally known were Masons and considering a significant number of the founding fathers were also Masons, I'd have no problem casting my lot with them.

You could always find yourself in much worse company.
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Old 04-28-2013, 22:37   #96
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Some of the finest and most upstanding men I've personally known were Masons and considering a significant number of the founding fathers were also Masons, I'd have no problem casting my lot with them.

You could always find yourself in much worse company.
One would have to admit, a lot of fine people have been Freemasons.

here is a short list of some more notables.

http://famousmasons.com/
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I cross my heart and hope not to die. Swallow evil, ride the sky. Lose myself in a crowded room. You fool, you fool, it will be here soon
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Old 04-28-2013, 23:02   #97
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Forgive me (because I am not trying to flame) for saying this sounds incredibly silly and juvenile...sounds like a club. What do you do and what is the point?
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Old 04-28-2013, 23:03   #98
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We do not invite, recruit or have posters to join the fraternity. It is to your own accord. If you want to become a Mason ask a Mason. It is not a secret society but a society with secrets. Google for the closest lodge where you live.
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Old 04-28-2013, 23:27   #99
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Forgive me (because I am not trying to flame) for saying this sounds incredibly silly and juvenile...sounds like a club. What do you do and what is the point?
It is a club. And one that is selective about who it admits. Not selective about money or status, but about generally moral characters joining. What is the point of any club? What is the point of scouting or or any association? In centuries past (George Washington's time) masonry was a conspiracy to overthrow tyrants and install egalitarian government among men. Masonry succeeded in this in at least 3 nations which are the United States, France, and Italy. This is also the true reason Catholicism has condemned masonry. They did not like having their power overthrown. Today regular masonry exists only as a fraternal organization since the original goal has been accomplished. The history channel has a pretty good documentary on the subject you can find on youtube, with input from a historian and 33rd degree mason on the subject, much better than I can explain myself.

A good book on the subject is


. I've bought probably 5 copies of this and loaned them to people and never had them returned. My step mom gave me this book when she and my dad were getting me interested in Masonry, and it did. And I'll add that even though my family is masonic they never asked me to join. They tried to encourage me in learning about it and such, but never asked me to. Joining was of my own free will and I was the one who asked for a petition and had my dad and uncle sign it. And my dad was very pleased when I decided for myself to join, a proud moment for him.
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Last edited by Ronny; 04-28-2013 at 23:35.. Reason: added second paragraph.
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Old 04-28-2013, 23:48   #100
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It is a club. And one that is selective about who it admits. Not selective about money or status, but about generally moral characters joining. What is the point of any club? What is the point of scouting or or any association? In centuries past (George Washington's time) masonry was a conspiracy to overthrow tyrants and install egalitarian government among men. Masonry succeeded in this in at least 3 nations which are the United States, France, and Italy. This is also the true reason Catholicism has condemned masonry. They did not like having their power overthrown. Today regular masonry exists only as a fraternal organization since the original goal has been accomplished. The history channel has a pretty good documentary on the subject you can find on youtube, with input from a historian and 33rd degree mason on the subject, much better than I can explain myself.

A good book on the subject is Born in Blood: The Lost Secrets of Freemasonry (Hardcover): -John J. Robinson-: Amazon.com: [email]Books. I've bought probably 5 copies of this and loaned them to people and never had them returned. My step mom gave me this book when she and my dad were getting me interested in Masonry, and it did. And I'll add that even though my family is masonic they never asked me to join. They tried to encourage me in learning about it and such, but never asked me to. Joining was of my own free will and I was the one who asked for a petition and had my dad and uncle sign it. And my dad was very pleased when I decided for myself to join, a proud moment for him.
Thanks. So it is more for nostalgia and tradition than an actual large scale political/power purpose? Or is it the core values and belief system that it is based on? Or just guys chilling out? Or really any combination...
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