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Old 01-08-2013, 12:25   #1
2-8 Marine
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Pros and Cons on 45 GAP, G39 please.

My neighbor, a retired military officer and a casual friend told me yesterday that he is applying for a CCW permit. Although he has had experience with 9mm and 45 ACP weapons, he has ruled them out and is considering purchasing a G39. He plans that this will be his sole handgun for target shooting, home and personal defence including concealed carry. Now I'm no expert as my knowledge of the 45 GAP cartridge is limited to the basic information, but I advised him that he might be better served buying a 9mm, 40 S&W or even a 357 sig pistol. He knows even less about the 45 GAP than I do but seems to be sold on getting one.
I'd appreciate our resident experts with real experience with the 45 GAP avising the pros and cons of the gun and cartridge. Please, no bashers or praisers. I'd appreciate some good solid information that I can relay to my friend.
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:40   #2
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Pro - same size as G26, same performance as 45 ACP. Con - cartridge not as mainstream as 9mm, 40, 45 ACP.
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:42   #3
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Ammo is also going to be harder to find and more expensive than 9mm, .40 or even .45 ACP.


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Old 01-08-2013, 12:47   #4
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Con: Ammo cost, lack of versatility, few manufacturers, only one brand of gun that actually use that ammo and availability of it.

Pro: It has a funny name.
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Old 01-08-2013, 12:48   #5
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Originally Posted by G26S239 View Post
Pro - same size as G26, same performance as 45 ACP. Con - cartridge not as mainstream as 9mm, 40, 45 ACP.
Thank you, while I appreciate your input, that much I know. What I'd like is some indepth info from those who use the gun and cartridge on a regular basis. ie: problems particular to the gun or cartridge, how expensive is it to shoot, reliability, accuracy. I'd also appreciate recomendations or non-recomendations and why.
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Old 01-08-2013, 13:10   #6
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Hi,

I have several guns in 380 ACP, 9mm, 357 Sig, 40 S&W, 45 ACP and 45 GAP. I carry my GAP guns everyday. My primary carry is a Glock 39 and sometimes I carry a Glock 38. I usually ankle carry a second G39.

For me, the G39 is the best platform for the GAP round. The G39 gives you the excellent concealability of the baby Glock with ballistics comparable to 45ACP. Like all Glocks, it accepts the bigger glock GAP magazines as well. So you can CCW with a 6 round mag and have a 10 round mag as a spare.

At the range, the G39 is fun to shoot. Of all my Glocks, the G39 is the only one my wife likes to shoot (she loves her Berettas). I have shot just about every brand of ammunition through it without problems. My perception is that the Federal 230gr HST is the hottest round I have fired through it (my current EDC round).

If I were to go to only one Glock, I think the G39 would be the pistol.

As for ammunition availability, I get WWB 230gr JHP at Bass Pro (good back-up round) for $31 per box of 50. Otherwise, I get ammunition on-line at prices comperable to 45 ACP. Also, gunshows are another good place (at least they were) to find GAP ammunition.

On a side note, the full size GAP mags are 10 rounds, so if you fear a ban on high-cap mags, you need not worry about paying too much for mags, since they are only 10 round to begin with.

Most folks who bash the GAP round have never shot one or owned one. I have 5 GAP guns. 2 x G39, G38, G37 and an XD Tactical LE.

When I carry something other than the G39 or G38, it's usually a G26.

I think it's a fine choice if that's what your neighbor wants to get.
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Old 01-08-2013, 13:11   #7
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I have all three GAP Glock models. Carry the G39 as CCW just slightly less often than the G36. Like all my Glocks, it is reliable, and as accurate as need be at reasonable close-combat ranges. Ammo (at least before the recent "panic"), is readily available online, or at my local gun store - smaller cities, less so. Check ammo prices online at Midway, Cheaper Than Dirt, Georgia Arms, Cabela's, etc.

I have never regretted purchasing any of my GAP's (am wearing the G38 as I type this in the local library), and appreciate the efficiency and uniqueness of this Twenty- First cartridge design.

I would recommend that your neighbor give the G39 a go - can always resell here on GT if it doesn't work out.

Hope this helps.
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Old 01-08-2013, 13:32   #8
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The best choices for a first all around hand gun are 9mm .40 and .45acp. This is purely my opnion, but is based on availability of practice ammo and defensive ammo locally, popularity of the cartridges, and track record of performance.

To step away from the original three is to specialize and is for experienced gun owners.

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Old 01-08-2013, 13:56   #9
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Got to shoot a G38 a few timesthe best shooting Glock I've ever shot!
I'd own one if ammo was more available,that's the only down side.
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Old 01-08-2013, 13:58   #10
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Pros-Right now 45gap mags and ammo are about all you can find.

Cons-I would take a Glock 26 over a Glock 39 (I owned both and not the G39 anymore). It is a little snappier and only holds 6 rounds.
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Old 01-08-2013, 14:23   #11
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I'd like to know why he's so set on a caliber that going to
cost more to shoot, and not as easy to find ammo for
as an only gun?

Most would pick a G26 for that size with good capacity.

And there's a reason you can still find GAP mags. And
G19 mags, etc are no where to be found.
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Old 01-08-2013, 14:26   #12
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Your neighbor should not rule out the 45ACP, or 40S&W. Two fine cartridges, with truckloads of brand/gun models. Cheers.
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Old 01-08-2013, 14:26   #13
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My store has metric tons of Glocks...w/that said we very rarely carry any GAPs and at best have 500 rds or less of GAP ammo.

No one has ever even asked about them. The ammo we do have runs about the same as prem .41 Mag. If I am paying that $$$ I am shooting .41 Mag
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Old 01-08-2013, 14:37   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clarkz71 View Post
I'd like to know why he's so set on a caliber that going to
cost more to shoot, and not as easy to find ammo for
as an only gun?

Most would pick a G26 for that size with good capacity.

And there's a reason you can still find GAP mags. And
G19 mags, etc are no where to be found.
I'd like to know the same thing . . . that's why I'm asking for as much info as possible. Not to argue him out of getting the G39 but simply to be able to provide the best argument I can citing all the good and bad about the cartridge and the gun. Personally, I recommended the G27 to him but he'll make his own decision.
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Old 01-08-2013, 14:41   #15
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I have a Gen 4 Model 19.....it's been sitting in my safe ever since I bought my 38. Carry a .40 cal 22 on duty....hate it, I'd never spend the money on a .40 cal anything.

After shooting my 38 it's now my EDC for off duty and plainclothes. Ammo is the same cost as .45ACP, in fact I've found a couple places where the GAP ammo is cheaper than .45ACP. I bought several boxes of carry ammo (Gold Dot 200gr) and reload all my practice ammo with Berry's plated bullets so ammo is not an issue for me. If you have a LGS that you do business with I'm sure they would order ammo for you. Here's .45GAP Speer Lawman at $19.99 a box of 50 -
http://www.targetsportsusa.com/p-138...mmunition.aspx
and .45ACP Speer Lawman at $20.99 a box of 50 - http://www.targetsportsusa.com/p-942...mmunition.aspx

To me the cost is a wash. Granted you will have more ammo choice in .45ACP but the only carry ammo I'm interested in is either Gold Dot or Federal HST. One point on the "it's not mainstream" comment above. That can be a good thing. For example, Target Sports is sold out of a lot of .45ACP but they've got plenty of GAP in stock. You don't have to deal with the mad rush of bullet buyers grabbing up all the GAP on the shelves so there will be something left for you.

With the threat of the impending mag capacity limit on either the federal or various state levels, the GAPs may come into their own with the less than 10 round magazines. It's got .45ACP (NOT .45ACP+P) ballistics in a mid size frame. I set my 38 down on top of my 19 when I got it and other than looking at the barrel end, all the other dimensions are almost identical.

I was thinking about buying a SA XD-S .45ACP for summer carry but I think I'm going to go with a Glock 39 so I can keep all my ammo the same.
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Old 01-08-2013, 14:47   #16
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Originally Posted by 2-8 Marine View Post
Personally, I recommended the G27 to him but he'll make his own decision.
I like the .40 as well, would like a G27 as a
back up in an ankle holster to my G23 EDC.
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Old 01-08-2013, 14:51   #17
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[QUOTE=Sheepdog689;19836850]I have a Gen 4 Model 19.....it's been sitting in my safe ever since I bought my 38. Carry a .40 cal 22 on duty....hate it, I'd never spend the money on a .40 cal anything.
QUOTE]

I appreciate your info re: 45 gap, but I'm curious . . . why the hate for the 40 S&W? Something in particular you don't like?
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Old 01-08-2013, 14:57   #18
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[quote=2-8 Marine;19836887]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheepdog689 View Post
I have a Gen 4 Model 19.....it's been sitting in my safe ever since I bought my 38. Carry a .40 cal 22 on duty....hate it, I'd never spend the money on a .40 cal anything.
QUOTE]

I appreciate your info re: 45 gap, but I'm curious . . . why the hate for the 40 S&W? Something in particular you don't like?
To me the .40 is a much snappier recoil. The Gen 4 19 (9mm) is like shooting a .22 pistol in comparison. The GAP recoils more than the 19 but nowhere near as snappy as the .40. The GAP is more like the ACP where it's more of a push type recoil with much less muzzle flip. And I can get all the .40 cal ammo I want for free as it's issued to us....and I still won't buy a .40 cal pistol!

I'm reloading 185gr RN bullets for the GAP and it's a pleasure to go through 200 or 300 rounds in one session. When I qualify with my duty .40 (Glock 22) I want to throw it against the wall after 60 rounds. I know that there's a lot of people who swear by the .40. Good for them, they can buy them. I love my GAP and as I'm the one who's carrying it and shooting it, it's my decision.

Pennsylvania State Police, New York State Police, Georgia Patrol, South Carolina Highway Patrol and Florida Highway Patrol are all issuing the .45GAP (mod 37) to their officers. I figure they're a lot smarter than I am so they must know something.

I've been an LEO for over 37 years. Started out with a .357 magnum, then 9mm then .40 but the GAP is going to be my retirement pistol.
My suggestion for your friend is to try to locate a range/store near you that has a GAP for rent. Try it compared to a ACP and 9mm and let him decide for himself.
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Old 01-08-2013, 15:00   #19
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First it is not the same size as a G26. The G39 has a thicker slide which feels funny if you are a G17/19/26 simze finatic. Obviously he is not so its not too big of a deal. He will have a slightly smaller selection of holsters though or he can buy G30 holsters which the gun most likely will fit loose.
I see nothing wrong with having baby Glock for a only gun but I don't know that he has picked the right one. With the GAP he is pretty much stuck with that caliber where with a 27 or a 33 he can convert it to other calibers.
Ammo is harder to find than every other caliber of Glock and if we loose the right to mail order ammo, he will be even more limited.
I don't know that I would spend a lot of time trying to convince him otherwise if he is that set on it. There are a few GAP lovers out there. If it had a regular size slide I would own one.
I'm a .40 fanboy but I think the G26 is the winner of the baby Glocks.
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Old 01-08-2013, 15:20   #20
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[quote=Sheepdog689;19836913]
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2-8 Marine View Post

To me the .40 is a much snappier recoil. The Gen 4 19 (9mm) is like shooting a .22 pistol in comparison. The GAP recoils more than the 19 but nowhere near as snappy as the .40. The GAP is more like the ACP where it's more of a push type recoil with much less muzzle flip. And I can get all the .40 cal ammo I want for free as it's issued to us....and I still won't buy a .40 cal pistol!

I'm reloading 185gr RN bullets for the GAP and it's a pleasure to go through 200 or 300 rounds in one session. When I qualify with my duty .40 (Glock 22) I want to throw it against the wall after 60 rounds. I know that there's a lot of people who swear by the .40. Good for them, they can buy them. I love my GAP and as I'm the one who's carrying it and shooting it, it's my decision.

No need to defend your decision . . .

Pennsylvania State Police, New York State Police, Georgia Patrol, South Carolina Highway Patrol and Florida Highway Patrol are all issuing the .45GAP (mod 37) to their officers. I figure they're a lot smarter than I am so they must know something.

I've been an LEO for over 37 years. Started out with a .357 magnum, then 9mm then .40 but the GAP is going to be my retirement pistol.
My suggestion for your friend is to try to locate a range/store near you that has a GAP for rent. Try it compared to a ACP and 9mm and let him decide for himself.
Though I'm retired 12 years now, I've been an LEO for about as many years as you and similarly started out using .38 spl and .357 mag, on to the 9mm and actually retired before my dept went to the .40 S&W. Personally, I like the 40 and don't find much difference in the recoil than with the 9mm. I also like the 357 Sig, again not really being bothered by the slight (my words) increase in recoil.
My friend though a retired military officer type is not really a gun guy. His experience is limited and he's never even shot a 40 S&W or 357 Sig. My intent is to see that he definately does try out as many variations as available - within reason. Of course he will make his own decision but I don't want to see him make an uneducated choice and then be sorry later.
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Old 01-08-2013, 15:25   #21
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First it is not the same size as a G26. The G39 has a thicker slide which feels funny if you are a G17/19/26 simze finatic. Obviously he is not so its not too big of a deal. He will have a slightly smaller selection of holsters though or he can buy G30 holsters which the gun most likely will fit loose.
I see nothing wrong with having baby Glock for a only gun but I don't know that he has picked the right one. With the GAP he is pretty much stuck with that caliber where with a 27 or a 33 he can convert it to other calibers.
Ammo is harder to find than every other caliber of Glock and if we loose the right to mail order ammo, he will be even more limited.
I don't know that I would spend a lot of time trying to convince him otherwise if he is that set on it.

Not trying to convince him otherwise, just want to see he makes an educated choice. he's not a gun guy.

There are a few GAP lovers out there. If it had a regular size slide I would own one.
I'm a .40 fanboy but I think the G26 is the winner of the baby Glocks.
I too like the 40 and my gun of choice is the G27 though I have several others including a G26. I use conversion barrels and shoot 40, 9mm and 357 sig from my G27.

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Old 01-08-2013, 15:28   #22
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Hey, if your buddy likes expensive, proprietary, hard to find ammo for a handgun, then why not turn him on to an FN Five seveN?
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Old 01-08-2013, 15:31   #23
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Hey, if your buddy likes expensive, proprietary, hard to find ammo for a handgun, then why not turn him on to an FN Five seveN?
Very helpful Jay, thank you.
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Old 01-08-2013, 15:31   #24
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The frame of the G39 is the same size as the G26, G27 and G33 however the slide is 3/16" thicker than the all three of those three.

G39 negatives

1) Ammo can be pricey and hard to find locally depending on area. Online GAP ammo can be found at better prices with more options
2) Lower round count 6+1
3) Quite a few holsters for the 26,27,33 will not fit the G39 properly thus holsters can be harder to find. (internet best option)

G39 Pros

1) Smallest Glock chambered in .45
2) With the current run on guns and ammo more obscure calibers like the gap tend to be available on the shelves when the more popular calibers are picked clean (noticed that with .357sig)
3) Accurate, fairly soft shooting like all the .45 Glocks
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Old 01-08-2013, 15:34   #25
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Ammo is the biggest con. Online ammo sale bans are more then likely coming and that will make GAP ammo very difficult to find. Learn to reload if you are considering the GAP.
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