[Ljutic]

I just posted a test on this load from a 3.3" barrel. You may find it useful if you tote a G30 or G36.

http://mousegunaddict.blogspot.com/2...-gel-test.html

Corbon 45 AUTO +P 185 Grain DPX Gel Test - YouTube

Corbon 45 AUTO +P 185 Grain DPX Gel Test - YouTube

[SCmasterblaster]

Is there any lead in that bullet?

[RichardB]

DPX is an all copper bullet.

[Berto]

Great consistency, needs to go deeper....IMO. One reason I've never been very hip on light for caliber bullet weights.

[M 7]

Surprised to see it only going 900fps, but then you did fire from a 3.3" barrel. How was reliability from the XD with that load?

[SCmasterblaster]

What .45 has a 3.3-inch barrel?

[RichardB]

From Ljutic's web site.

http://mousegunaddict.blogspot.com

Test Pistol Specs:
Springfield XDs 3.3" Barrel

[Ljutic]

Originally Posted by M 7

How was reliability from the XD with that load?

100% across 9 shots. Statistically insignificant sample size to determine anything other than this particular box will chamber and fire in my specific XDs.

[Ljutic]

Originally Posted by SCmasterblaster

What .45 has a 3.3-inch barrel?

I always include a picture of the test pistol in the video. For this video it's 15 seconds into the video and it was indeed a Springfield XDs.

[WinterWizard]

185gr and below sucks. Stick to 200gr or above, preferably 230gr. People get sucked into the velocity gimmick. But reduced bullet weight reduces sectional density and momentum, therefore penetration. And because of the extra velocity, they often expand violently, thereby reducing penetration even more. Stay away from the light stuff, .45 fans.

[Tiro Fijo]

Originally Posted by WinterWizard

185gr and below sucks. Stick to 200gr or above, preferably 230gr. People get sucked into the velocity gimmick. But reduced bullet weight reduces sectional density and momentum, therefore penetration. And because of the extra velocity, they often expand violently, thereby reducing penetration even more. Stay away from the light stuff, .45 fans.

All that you wrote applies to regular bullets and not solid copper bullets.

[WinterWizard]

Originally Posted by Tiro Fijo

All that you wrote applies to regular bullets and not solid copper bullets.

Then explain the poor penetration. Weight is weight, regardless of lead or copper.

[Tiro Fijo]

Originally Posted by WinterWizard

Then explain the poor penetration. Weight is weight, regardless of lead or copper.

3.3" barrel. Weight ≠ mass. Solid copper bullets have more mass.

[Glock19Fan]

Originally Posted by Tiro Fijo

3.3" barrel. Weight ≠ mass. Solid copper bullets have more mass.

A longer barrel could have possibly gave less penetration becuase of the more aggressive expansion due to the higher velocity. IMO, the shorter barrel could have aided the bullet by giving deeper penetratioon due to less aggressive expansion.

Still impressive though. Im not a huge .45ACP fan, but this would still get the job done regardless.

[WinterWizard]

Originally Posted by Tiro Fijo

3.3" barrel. Weight ≠ mass. Solid copper bullets have more mass.

They may require more mass to be the same weight, but it's still a .451" bullet weighing 185 grains. Just because it's made of copper doesn't mean it's diameter or weight has changed.

I've seen reports of these DPX 185-grainers penetrating under 11", even with a 5" 1911.

As I understand it, copper bullets were a hunting invention. Less lead pollution in the environment and in the kill, and they tend to hold together. They later adapted them to handgun hollow points, and it seems to me, as a gimmick. They don't do anything that a bonded lead bullet can't do.

JMO.

[Captain]

The 160 gr DPX load was designed for short barreled 45 autos. That load from a 3.5" barrrel penetrates 14" in 4 layer denim clad 10% ballistic gel.

[Tiro Fijo]

Originally Posted by WinterWizard

...They don't do anything that a bonded lead bullet can't do...

They do two things better: penetrate hard barriers better as well as open up more reliably. The downside, which is considerable, is the hefty cost.

[WinterWizard]

Originally Posted by Tiro Fijo

They do two things better: penetrate hard barriers better as well as open up more reliably. The downside, which is considerable, is the hefty cost.

Is there any scientific data on this, or is it an Internet marketing rumor? Because there are bonded bullets that penetrate auto glass with ease and often with no deflection, and with enough oompf left over to do quite a bit of damage on the other side. But not that this is needed for civilians, really. More of a law enforcement thing. And yet, how many LE agencies are rocking copper bullets?

[SCmasterblaster]

Originally Posted by WinterWizard

Is there any scientific data on this, or is it an Internet marketing rumor? Because there are bonded bullets that penetrate auto glass with ease and often with no deflection, and with enough oompf left over to do quite a bit of damage on the other side. But not that this is needed for civilians, really. More of a law enforcement thing. And yet, how many LE agencies are rocking copper bullets?

I don't suppose that there are many LEO agencies using the more expensive copper cartridges. $ talks.

[ChallengerSRT]

Originally Posted by Tiro Fijo

3.3" barrel. Weight ≠ mass. Solid copper bullets have more mass.

I've no clue what are you talking about regarding, "solid copper bullets have more mass." If you put two equal size bullets side by side, one made of solid copper, and one of lead, the density of the lead bullet should be 3.26 times that of the copper one based upon their molecular weights. That increase in weight should pack much more punch if traveling at the same velicity.
Now, if you're talking about the HARDNESS of each metal, there should be a marked difference in penetration of one metal vs. the other due to the lead being so much softer. It will deform much faster with energy lost in doing so, plus more resistance due to increase in diameter.
Your statement of Solid copper bullets having more mass makes absolutely no sense to me.

[SCmasterblaster]

Originally Posted by ChallengerSRT

I've no clue what are you talking about regarding, "solid copper bullets have more mass." If you put two equal size bullets side by side, one made of solid copper, and one of lead, the density of the lead bullet should be 3.26 times that of the copper one based upon their molecular weights. That increase in weight should pack much more punch if traveling at the same velicity.
Now, if you're talking about the HARDNESS of each metal, there should be a marked difference in penetration of one metal vs. the other due to the lead being so much softer. It will deform much faster with energy lost in doing so, plus more resistance due to increase in diameter.
Your statement of Solid copper bullets having more mass makes absolutely no sense to me.

And I agree with you, for lead has far more density than copper.

[WinterWizard]

I think Tiro meant that the copper bullet must be a little longer in order to equal 185gr because of the density of lead vs. copper. So it does, in fact, have slightly more mass. But the mass is not where it will make a difference, in my opinion. The diameter and weight is the same (.451" and 185gr).

And I don't buy the whole "copper penetrates better" thing, at least not in handgun rounds. IMO, that is a bullet design factor, not bullet material. A lead or copper bullet will pass through assuming no expansion. It's the bullet shape, design and nature of expansion (combined with weight and velocity) that determine penetration.

If copper handgun bullets were so much better, then why aren't more LE agencies using them? And why do only a few ammo companies make them?

It's marketing, guys. Convince people that something is better, even if only slightly, and they will pay more for it, even if that product doesn't offer any real advantage. There is no truth in advertising.

But JMO. To each their own.

[happyguy]

10% Ballistic Gelatin Tests for:
Corbon .45 ACP 185gr. +p DPX

Testing Platform:
S&W 2 ½” Snub

Barrier:
4 Layers of Denim

TEST RESULTS:

Round # 1:
Penetration: 13.875"
Recovered Weight: 182.7 gr.
Expansion*: .824 cal.


* Expansion measured at widest point.


10% Ballistic Gelatin Tests for:
Corbon .45 ACP 185gr. +p DPX

Testing Platform:
Glock 21

Barrier:
2 Layers of 16 gauge steel

TEST RESULTS:

Round # 1:
Penetration: 15.75"
Recovered Weight: 184.9 gr.
Expansion*: .551 cal.


* Expansion measured at widest point.

It's a different different gun and a different day but it is what it is. (copper corbon 185)

FYI DPX was the only round that penetrated two layers of 16 gauge steel.

Also: http://www.ar15.com/ammo/project/Sel...icturerev3.jpg

Make up your own mind.

Regards,
Comrade Happyguy

[jhaynes]

10" may not sound like alot of penetration, but I would rather my bullet stay in the bad guy than pass through and hit something or someone behind him. That said I still like heavier bullets. I have not tried 230 grain in a short barrel gun to see how much velocity they drop.

[Tiro Fijo]

Originally Posted by WinterWizard

I think Tiro meant that the copper bullet must be a little longer in order to equal 185gr because of the density of lead vs. copper. So it does, in fact, have slightly more mass...

Bingo.

...If copper handgun bullets were so much better, then why aren't more LE agencies using them? And why do only a few ammo companies make them?....

Simple reason as I stated earlier: cost.