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Old 03-08-2013, 08:11   #226
TX OMFS
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Wow. I saw this thread before there were any responses. Today I click on last page and see it's now a dicussion on the pros and cons of infantacide. I really didn't see it going there. I figured it would be a bunch of one liners.

Back to page 1:
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Originally Posted by BEER View Post
you either know what freedom is, or you don't.
People post about how much they love freedom and how limits on freedom are terrible.

Very, very few people want total freedom. We call that anarchy and it means I can rape your sister if I feel like it.

I cotton to some Libertarian ideas but all civilized societies give up some freedoms.
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Old 03-08-2013, 08:12   #227
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Originally Posted by jay29 View Post
If you left that clump of cells alone without any human intervention and everything else is medically normal what happens after 9 months?
It goes to an orphanage.

BTW how many children have you adopted out of the system?
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Old 03-08-2013, 08:16   #228
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TX OMFS View Post
Wow. I saw this thread before there were any responses. Today I click on last page and see it's now a dicussion on the pros and cons of infantacide. I really didn't see it going there. I figured it would be a bunch of one liners.

Back to page 1:


People post about how much they love freedom and how limits on freedom are terrible.

Very, very few people want total freedom. We call that anarchy and it means I can rape your sister if I feel like it.

I cotton to some Libertarian ideas but all civilized societies give up some freedoms.
Libertarian ideology does not embrace anarchy so your example is rather confusing. Libertarians believe that your rights end when they affect other people negatively. That would including raping your sister.

For instance, a Libertarian would say it is fine for you to grow pot in your home for your own consumption. It would not be OK to put that pot into brownies and send it to school with your child for him to pass out. Stuff like that.
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Old 03-08-2013, 08:39   #229
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Originally Posted by og23 View Post
Gay marriage, pro choice, separation of church and state. I think religion should not be a factor in any laws and freedom includes choices too.


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You are aware "separation of church and state" is not in the US Constitution.

If you find it there, I will give you my Glocks.
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Old 03-08-2013, 08:47   #230
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A newborn could be fair game for killing then, right? It's not going to survive without its mother or other other adult, so it therefore has no rights, correct? Good to go to kill it?
No, not at all. I thought I made this clear. Something that cannot exist other than as a physical part of another human being is not an autonomous being or individual. If you cannot separate a fetus from its mother and it be able to live(with any means available) then it is not an individual. The crux of the argument is fetus rights versus mothers' rights. As long as it is a part of the mother I claim it logically cannot have rights.

"The fact of birth is an absolute -- that is, up to that moment, the child is not an independent, living organism. It's part of the body of it's mother. But at birth, a child is an individual, and has the rights inherent in the nature of a human individual. " Ayn Rand
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Old 03-08-2013, 08:49   #231
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I can't find any definition of civil rights to support the idea that fetuses have them since they are neither individuals or citizens.
I find this interesting - In some states, when a pregnant woman is murdered, the person is charged with a double murder. A "fetus" is not a person in the very same states.

Read - Laci Peterson
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Old 03-08-2013, 08:57   #232
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It goes to an orphanage.

BTW how many children have you adopted out of the system?
I pay enough for them in taxes and that is a foolish argument. Either let the woman destroy her pregnancy or I should be forced to adopt it. Dumb argument.
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Old 03-08-2013, 08:59   #233
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You are aware "separation of church and state" is not in the US Constitution.

If you find it there, I will give you my Glocks.
When arguments about the 2nd Amendment come up, a common (and completely appropriate!) point is made to use the Federalist Papers and other writings of the founders to expand and expound on the Constitution.

Does that only apply to issues involving the 2nd Amendment?
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Old 03-08-2013, 09:06   #234
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After not having good health insurance for four years during grad school, I find myself much more sympathetic to at least revising the current health insurance system. I have good health insurance now, but many don't.

I don't know what needs to be done, but what we have now is pretty undesirable if one doesn't work as an employee in a company with a good group plan.

I do realize that at some point, one runs out of others' money, so I'm not for socialized medicine. I can see where they're coming from, however, and am interested to see where that debate goes.
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Old 03-08-2013, 09:07   #235
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When arguments about the 2nd Amendment come up, a common (and completely appropriate!) point is made to use the Federalist Papers and other writings of the founders to expand and expound on the Constitution.

Does that only apply to issues involving the 2nd Amendment?
Make no mistake, Constitutionalists and pro freedom/liberty folk are the minority on this site. Outside of the 2nd amendment, most folk here don't care for the constitution or those pesky rights and civil liberties. Just their own flavor of a dictatorship.
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Old 03-08-2013, 09:09   #236
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those persons who want to stand by the Bible saying abortion is wrong might want to sit down and read Leviticus to see how closely you are living to the Bible.

You can start cleaning up your own act by getting the pork and shellfish out of your diet.

I really have no like for selective Christians. They're no better than selective constitutionalists.

In the new testament Christ says you should love your neighbor as yourself. There were not any qualifiers in that statement.

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Old 03-08-2013, 09:14   #237
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Originally Posted by dwhite53 View Post
those persons who want to stand by the Bible saying abortion is wrong might want to sit down and read Leviticus to see how closely you are living to the Bible.

You can start cleaning up your own act by getting the pork and shellfish out of your diet.

I really have no like for selective Christians. They're no better than selective constitutionalists.

In the new testament Christ says you should love your neighbor as yourself. There were not any qualifiers in that statement.

All the Best,
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I really have no like for people who make ignorant statements about the Bible. Especially when they confuse the old testament with the new and fail to understand that the new testament granted relief from the stringent old testament when God realized man could not fully adhere to it.
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Old 03-08-2013, 09:15   #238
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Originally Posted by G29Reload View Post
I really have no like for people who make ignorant statements about the Bible. Especially when they confuse the old testament with the new and fail to understand that the new testament granted relief from the stringent old testament when God realized man could not fully adhere to it.
So if God created man, and man failed to adhere to the rules God set for man, who he created, then God obviously erred in his creation of man. But how can God err if he is God? What sense does that make?

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Old 03-08-2013, 09:19   #239
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Originally Posted by dwhite53 View Post
those persons who want to stand by the Bible saying abortion is wrong might want to sit down and read Leviticus to see how closely you are living to the Bible.

You can start cleaning up your own act by getting the pork and shellfish out of your diet.

I really have no like for selective Christians. They're no better than selective constitutionalists.

In the new testament Christ says you should love your neighbor as yourself. There were not any qualifiers in that statement.
I'm sure there are Christians who selectively read the Bible. However, please do some research on the difference between Jewish moral, ceremonial, and judicial laws. We don't live in a Jewish theocracy, so the latter two categories don't apply. In many cases, it's easy to see which category a law fits into. In some others, there is debate.
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Old 03-08-2013, 09:23   #240
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I really have no like for people who make ignorant statements about the Bible. Especially when they confuse the old testament with the new and fail to understand that the new testament granted relief from the stringent old testament when God realized man could not fully adhere to it.
So, then, you ARE of the belief that the 10 Commandments have no more weight because they are Old Testament and the New Testament grants relief from those rules. Right?
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Old 03-08-2013, 09:25   #241
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I pay enough for them in taxes and that is a foolish argument. Either let the woman destroy her pregnancy or I should be forced to adopt it. Dumb argument.
So the rest of us should be forced to pay for children that are unwanted by their parents and placed into the system? You sound like a liberal.

Let me guess you don't want government involvement with your guns or with anything else that infringes on your rights but they should ban gay marriage and abortion because that doesn't affect you.
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Old 03-08-2013, 09:37   #242
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Old 03-08-2013, 09:38   #243
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What liberal/ left things do i get?

That it always seems to be rabbi who starts these whiny, lefty apologist troll threads in the lounge where theyre prohibited per the sticky above, always posed as some well meaning innocent andy rooney style question thats ends up devolving into a political/religious pissing match, like the last one. Went something like, even though he was an impeached pervert rapist lying scumbag, dont you just get that bill clinton was really awesome? Something like that. Then if you disagree with him he suggests you just dont get it and goes on endlessly about it.

You ever notice that? I do.
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Old 03-08-2013, 09:43   #244
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WOW!

I see that GT is infested with Liberals.

You people want to drag "marrage" through the dirt with gay marrage, Allow people to kill other humans freely (abortion). Just ask your self this, When did you become a "human"? Were you, "You", immediately after inception? In the 2nd trimester? 3rd trimester? Or would it be "OK" to kill you 5 mins before birth?

Place your self in the position of the fetus, and it will correct your perspective on this issue.
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Old 03-08-2013, 09:44   #245
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I generally think that personal freedoms should be respected (i.e. gay marriage) until they cause an externality.

I also believe that there is some level of govt that is needed. An educated population, for example, makes the entire population wealthier and makes everyone better off.

If you look at 3rd world countries vs the USA, there is a lot of infrastructure that has been built by govt that helps make the USA successful.
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Old 03-08-2013, 09:47   #246
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Originally Posted by FloridaGun View Post
WOW!

I see that GT is infested with Liberals.

You people want to drag "marrage" through the dirt with gay marrage
LOL..Heterosexuals have that covered. What is the divorce rate now? Over 50%?
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Old 03-08-2013, 09:49   #247
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Originally Posted by G29Reload View Post
What liberal/ left things do i get?

That it always seems to be rabbi who starts these whiny, lefty apologist troll threads in the lounge where theyre prohibited per the sticky above, always posed as some well meaning innocent andy rooney style question thats ends up devolving into a political/religious pissing match, like the last one. Went something like, even though he was an impeached pervert rapist lying scumbag, dont you just get that bill clinton was really awesome? Something like that. Then if you disagree with him he suggests you just dont get it and goes on endlessly about it.

You ever notice that? I do.
OK, you convinced me to delete my post.

I posted the below about Rabbi's posting style in another thread.

I didn't think he also had trollish tendicies. But, you might be right.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulMason View Post
Rabbi, you're staying true to form with your posts.

Rabbi - Makes a statement - poster shows it to be wrong - don't address poster directly as a result.

Rabbi's next post tries to direct the discussion with a non sequitur - poster doesn't bite

Rabbi tries to insult poster

Rabbi tries logic which doesn't work. - See below.

If tipping is such a great system; why isn't it in wide use in diverse employment situations?



Your usual response is to declaire victory and tell us you won't be posting again.
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Old 03-08-2013, 09:53   #248
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Originally Posted by FloridaGun View Post
WOW!

I see that GT is infested with Liberals.

You people want to drag "marrage" through the dirt with gay marrage.
BTW, hetero's do a fine enough job of dragging 'marrage' through the dirt, anyone else dragging 'marrage' through the dirt is just beating a dead horse anyhow.
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Old 03-08-2013, 09:53   #249
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OK, you convinced me to delete my post.

I posted the below about Rabbi's posting style in another thread.

I didn't think he also had trollish tendicies. But, you might be right.
Looks like im not the only one to notice. Seems to be a trend.
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Old 03-08-2013, 09:54   #250
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You ever notice that? I do.
The numbers don't lie
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