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Old 02-25-2013, 07:06   #51
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Originally Posted by 686Owner View Post
You do have to run at half throttle in the draft.
I wonder if half throttle is really "half throttle" or if the throttle cam is set up to make it really 3/4 throttle or something (to give more sensitivity/ responsiveness at the higher end of the scale).

Of course I doubt that when she said "half throttle" that she was at exactly 50% throttle either. Just an estimate (like anyone else would make).

Dale Jr said the same thing in 2001 at Daytona, but he was leading at the time.
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Old 02-25-2013, 07:06   #52
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Yes, the the Nascar boys do the left and right twice a year. What F1 race dares to run oval track?
Is this sarcasm or a joke? Seriously.
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Old 02-25-2013, 07:07   #53
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You do have to run at half throttle in the draft.
Thanks for the heads Up on that!
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Old 02-25-2013, 07:10   #54
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I wonder if maybe her being a rookie caused others not to want to draft with her in the last few laps.

I would bet the James Franco intended to say "gentlemen and Danica, start your engines", but since he is used to reading scripts.......
While I am not sold on Danica (among several other drivers out there BTW) she had a BEAST of a car. They were probably worried that if they went with her they could never pass her.

Would love to have known what Harvick could have done at the end. That guy is the ultimate closer when the big money is on the line.
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If you're gonna be stupid, don't pull up short. Saddle up and ride it all the way in.

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Old 02-25-2013, 07:13   #55
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I grew up a NASCAR fan. The 80s and 90s were the apex of the sport. Bobby and Davey, Ernie, Kyle, Rusty, Dale, Rudd, Waltrip, Gant, Martin, Terry Labonte, etc.

Those guys were NASCAR to me. Today's drivers are boring and the great tracks are gone, replaced with cookie cutter tri ovals.

I think I'll watch some Senna footage to brighten my day.
Agreed! NASCAR just sucks these days... I miss Rockingham, North Wilkesboro, etc.


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Old 02-25-2013, 07:17   #56
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Originally Posted by SC Tiger View Post
I wonder if half throttle is really "half throttle" or if the throttle cam is set up to make it really 3/4 throttle or something (to give more sensitivity/ responsiveness at the higher end of the scale).

Dale Jr said the same thing in 2001 at Daytona, but he was leading at the time.
1/2 throttle is still making a large percentage of power in the restricted engines. Because of the plate the carb only flows at about 60% of its capability. So if they make around 460 at WOT they still make over 400 at 1/2 throttle. When you are not the lead car you are constantly dragging the brake and modulating the throttle to keep from running over the car in front of you. Now of course as soon as the nose of your car peeks out from behind the lead car you will need full or very close to full throttle to maintain speed.
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Old 02-25-2013, 07:19   #57
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Originally Posted by SC Tiger View Post
I wonder if half throttle is really "half throttle" or if the throttle cam is set up to make it really 3/4 throttle or something (to give more sensitivity/ responsiveness at the higher end of the scale).

Of course I doubt that when she said "half throttle" that she was at exactly 50% throttle either. Just an estimate (like anyone else would make).

Dale Jr said the same thing in 2001 at Daytona, but he was leading at the time.
Considering most of the engine power is going to overcome air resistance, it wouldn't surprise me at all. Look at how much power is required to go 100mph vs 200mph vs 300 mph.
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Old 02-25-2013, 07:25   #58
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Considering most of the engine power is going to overcome air resistance, it wouldn't surprise me at all. Look at how much power is required to go 100mph vs 200mph vs 300 mph.
Good point - this and Skinny99's.

Also I don't think the cars are allowed to "port match" the intake to the plate either.

At one time I was told they ran smaller engines (around 315 cu in) at Daytona/Talladega since they couldn't get enough air to take advantage of the bigger (358 cu in) ones. Could be BS though.
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Old 02-25-2013, 07:28   #59
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While I am not sold on Danica (among several other drivers out there BTW) she had a BEAST of a car. They were probably worried that if they went with her they could never pass her.

Would love to have known what Harvick could have done at the end. That guy is the ultimate closer when the big money is on the line.
Something to remember is that she had the same engine and shares technology with the cars that finished 1st,2nd,5th and led the first 28 laps. when Tony and Mr. Haas joined forces it was with the agreement that Hendrick would share technology. It is why Tony was competitive so quickly. Chevy helped put the deal together and I am sure some rather large checks changed hands. Tony hated being in a Toyota and Chevy hated him being in one.

If Biffle would have been in a Chevy and his and Danica's spotters could have made a deal they could have made a good run for the lead. But there is no way that Biffle being part of the the Flagship Ford team was going to push a Chevy to the front. It would have been sponsor suicide.
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Old 02-25-2013, 07:46   #60
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Good point - this and Skinny99's.

Also I don't think the cars are allowed to "port match" the intake to the plate either.

At one time I was told they ran smaller engines (around 315 cu in) at Daytona/Talladega since they couldn't get enough air to take advantage of the bigger (358 cu in) ones. Could be BS though.
After restrictor plates became SOP in 1989 the engine builders tried all kinds of things to make more power. Including smaller engines. NASCAR just changed the rules to make you have to run essentially the same engine at all tracks. Easier to tech and less R+D and parts for the teams.

What actually made the most power was an increased Compression ratio. Typically they had ran around 13:1 up to close to 14:1 compression ratio's. For a couple of years they got up close to 19:1 on the restricted engines. It was so high and developed so much cylinder pressure that they couldn't go WOT til the engine got over about 5500 RPM's and the volumetric efficiency dropped enough that it wouldn't fill the cylinders completely. If they did go WOT to early it would burn a piston almost instantly. Made for some tense pit road exits.
After 6 or 7 engine failures by some of the big names in one race, NASCAR mandated a 14:1 max compression ratio.
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Old 02-25-2013, 07:58   #61
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Well, they have certainly done a good job of making all of the cars so equal that everyone just goes around the circle in a pack for 200 laps.
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Old 02-25-2013, 08:03   #62
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Drafting and throttle opening...

On a nice straight section of expressway one can easily draft behind an 18-wheeler and actually feel the load on the car motor decrease once in the slipstream of the truck.

Or so I'm told...


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Old 02-25-2013, 08:30   #63
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Well, they have certainly done a good job of making all of the cars so equal that everyone just goes around the circle in a pack for 200 laps.
Can you say IROC?
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Old 02-25-2013, 08:35   #64
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Is this sarcasm or a joke? Seriously.
He's serious.
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Old 02-25-2013, 08:38   #65
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I actually enjoy many forms of motorsport. Nascar, Indy car, sprint cars, AMA roadracing. I enjoy the 24 hours of Daytona and Lemans.
Other then Monoco, I find F1 crushingly dull to watch. But to each his own.
Senna. Not dull.
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Old 02-25-2013, 09:20   #66
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I'm sure you are trying to be funny. But let's look at her before the last lap, in 3rd place. Took plenty of skill to get there. If she is in that position a few more times, are you saying none of the endings will play out in her favor? Ever?

She wouldn't need everyone to crash out, because by finishing 8th she was well ahead of most the guys.

Of course if you were there, you could have turned that 8 into a 1. You would have picked the right moment to slip down to the inside lane without losing any speed, and flew past the leaders. You just don't have the looks, so they won't give you her car
They just won't let it go, will they?

It's funny how folks were predicting a poor showing at Daytona, and instead of just admitting they were wrong, they are deflecting with "let's see how she does on short tracks", or 'week to week' etc

They predicted a poor showing at Daytona, and were wrong. If she is a complete failure on short tracks, it doesn't change the fact they were wrong about Daytona.
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Old 02-25-2013, 09:23   #67
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1/2 throttle is still making a large percentage of power in the restricted engines. Because of the plate the carb only flows at about 60% of its capability. So if they make around 460 at WOT they still make over 400 at 1/2 throttle. When you are not the lead car you are constantly dragging the brake and modulating the throttle to keep from running over the car in front of you. Now of course as soon as the nose of your car peeks out from behind the lead car you will need full or very close to full throttle to maintain speed.
Something else - quite often the lead car doesn't open it up too much (they are probably at 95% throttle though). They don't want to pull away too far and outrun their own draft.
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Old 02-25-2013, 09:23   #68
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Not sure if Franco meant it as a cut at Danica, but I thought that was funny as h###.
My bet is that he was debating in his mind whether to say "gentlemen and Danica start your engines" or "Drivers start your engines", and in the nervousness of the situation, mixed the two up. We've all had gaffs like that.

I don't think it was intentional. After all, the guy is used to reading words written by others.
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Old 02-25-2013, 09:32   #69
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Claiming she was running half throttle most of the race was kind of funny.
That was silly bravado. At one point in the race, she was reporting a vibration under the ball of her foot when she had the pedal against the floor.
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Old 02-25-2013, 09:37   #70
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Although I like all motorsports, open wheel racing is my preference. When I lived in Europe I was like a Grateful Dead fan following the Formula One show around from Monaco to Silverstone.

In the States, I like the Indycar Racing League. When CART existed, I liked it better. A friend owned PacWest and I rarely missed a domestic race.

http://www.indycar.com/

For me, watching a whole bunch of cars with nearly identical performance turning left for a couple of hours is just boring. Besides I don't think I could drink enough beer to be a NASCAR fan - a friend took me to the Charlotte Motor Speedway and beer cans were flying over my head the entire race.

When I was a kid, I attended races at Riverside, CA until NASCAR dropped the circuit. Watching the cars come through the the esses was spectacular! Those races were magnificent and road courses should be a larger part of NASCAR racing.

The Okie Corral

I watched the Daytona 500 only because it was the only race available...and for me, only the last half dozen laps qualified as racing. It irritated me that Darrell Waltrip made the race all about Danica - even going so far as to offer her advice on how to stay in third place during the final laps of the race. I'm pretty sure there were other qualified drivers on the pavement at Daytona.
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Old 02-25-2013, 09:38   #71
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Something else - quite often the lead car doesn't open it up too much (they are probably at 95% throttle though). They don't want to pull away too far and outrun their own draft.
The leader usually doesn't back off much but he does drag the brake in the corners some. If he has a really good car corner speed is usually higher but on the straight the draft evens it out.

Matt Kenseth talked about it at all 4 plate races last year. His plate car was phenomenally fast and the pushers couldn't keep up. Nasty fast! It was very hard for him to manage.
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Old 02-25-2013, 09:42   #72
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Although I like all motorsports, open wheel racing is my preference. When I lived in Europe I was like a Grateful Dead fan following the Formula One show around from Monaco to Silverstone.

In the States, I like the Indycar Racing League. When CART existed, I liked it better. A friend owned PacWest and I rarely missed a domestic race.

http://www.indycar.com/

For me, watching a whole bunch of cars with nearly identical performance turning left for a couple of hours is just boring. Besides I don't think I could drink enough beer to be a NASCAR fan - a friend took me to the Charlotte Motor Speedway and beer cans were flying over my head the entire race.

When I was a kid, I attended races at Riverside, CA until NASCAR dropped the circuit. Watching the cars come through the the esses was spectacular! Those races were magnificent and road courses should still be a part of NASCAR racing.

The Okie Corral

I watched the Daytona 500 only because it was the only race available...and for me, only the last half dozen laps qualified as racing. It irritated me that Darrell Waltrip made the race all about Danica - even going so far as to offer her advice on how to stay in third place during the final laps of the race. I'm pretty sure there were other qualified drivers on the pavement at Daytona.
I liked CART on the roads. Oval racing is for boring stock cars. Open wheels are meant for the road courses and streets.

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Old 02-25-2013, 09:47   #73
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My bet is that he was debating in his mind whether to say "gentlemen and Danica start your engines" or "Drivers start your engines", and in the nervousness of the situation, mixed the two up. We've all had gaffs like that.

I don't think it was intentional. After all, the guy is used to reading words written by others.
I'm certain it wasn't intentional, since, in the prerace stuff he was talking about being a big fan of hers. I think you're spot on with the "gentleman" vs "drivers" thing being the issue.
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Old 02-25-2013, 09:53   #74
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When I was a kid, I attended races at Riverside, CA until NASCAR dropped the circuit. Watching the cars come through the the esses was spectacular! Those races were magnificent and road courses should still be a part of NASCAR racing.
You mean like Watkins Glen?

The Okie Corral

Or Infineon in Sonoma?

The Okie Corral

Road courses are still a part of NASCAR.
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Old 02-25-2013, 10:03   #75
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I liked CART on the roads. Oval racing is for boring stock cars. Open wheels are meant for the road courses and streets.
Yep, me too. I went to a CART race at Homestead and it wasn't nearly as entertaining as say Mid Ohio.
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