Drone strikes on Americans suspected of being terrorists......

hogship · 02-09-2013, 00:27

I'm having trouble understanding why this issue has come up right now, and why Obama is the one doing it.

It seems to me that anyone, regardless of nationality, who is engaged in killing Americans (or any innocent people, for that matter), needs to be eliminated.

I am having trouble making sense of this ruling, though. To my thinking, it just doesn't seem like Obama is all that worried about protecting American lives....Benghazi, rules of engagement, obamacare, conduct which emboldens our enemies, etc.

So, why this, and why now?

On the surface, I'm inclined to support the ruling. It isn't support for Obama, but the ruling seems in the best interests of protecting American lives, in general.

I'm having great difficulty believing Obama doesn't have a reason for this, beyond what is on the surface......but, what?

Have we had a problem with Americans joining terrorist organizations? I know there has been an example, or two......but, why has this ruling suddenly become important?

In case there are those who think I should support the CIC, because he is our president.....sorry, there has just been too many questionable decisions and actions on his part for me to have faith and trust in his motives for doing what he does.

ooc

Lowjiber · 02-09-2013, 06:16

If a person is an American Citizen and is a member of a terrorist cell, or has ideas about killing Americans, I will kill them if given the opportunity. For those who fail to believe there are terrorists among us, go to Oklahoma City and visit the site of Timmothy McVeigh's terrorist act.

JBnTX · 02-09-2013, 06:51

It's the anti-government anarchists and a few TV reporters, like Judge Andrew Napolitano, who have sensationalized this story beyond any limits of sanity.

Neither Obama, nor the US government, has any plans to kill innocent American citizens with drones.

The airborne drone is just another tool to be used in the fight against crime in this country.

What's the difference if a cop shoots a criminal, or that same criminal is killed by an airborne drone?

If a drone attack was the best option to prevent a terrorist attack, would you condemn it's use just because the terrorists happen to be American citizens?

snerd · 02-09-2013, 08:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBnTX

It's the anti-government anarchists and a few TV reporters, like Judge Andrew Napolitano, who have sensationalized this story beyond any limits of sanity.

Neither Obama, nor the US government, has any plans to kill innocent American citizens with drones.

The airborne drone is just another tool to be used in the fight against crime in this country.

What's the difference if a cop shoots a criminal, or that same criminal is killed by an airborne drone?

If a drone attack was the best option to prevent a terrorist attack, would you condemn it's use just because the terrorists happen to be American citizens?

There are none so blind as they who will not see.

Respectfully.

Ruble Noon · 02-09-2013, 09:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBnTX

It's the anti-government anarchists and a few TV reporters, like Judge Andrew Napolitano, who have sensationalized this story beyond any limits of sanity.

Neither Obama, nor the US government, has any plans to kill innocent American citizens with drones.

The airborne drone is just another tool to be used in the fight against crime in this country.

What's the difference if a cop shoots a criminal, or that same criminal is killed by an airborne drone?

If a drone attack was the best option to prevent a terrorist attack, would you condemn it's use just because the terrorists happen to be American citizens?

Look at all the people that are mistakenly put on the governments no fly list.
I think some modicum of proof would be prudent.

CAcop · 02-09-2013, 09:16

Here is another thing. Just because drones are used to kill abroad in very difficult areas to send men to do the same task does not mean they will be used in the same manner here.

Obama is using drones like no other president because he is trying to keep terrorists out of Gitmo and avoid US troops and/or casualties in politically sensitive areas like Pakistan.

Here drones would most likely be used for dangerous missions, such as forest fire fighting, or surveillance, such as pursuits or manhunts. They would be used because they are cheaper and less dangerous than a fully loaded Jet Ranger crashing into a neighborhood. To be honest most drones if used by fire or police are going to be essentially large recreational RC planes with cameras. A department could probably piece one together now.

RC-RAMIE · 02-09-2013, 09:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBnTX

It's the anti-government anarchists and a few TV reporters, like Judge Andrew Napolitano, who have sensationalized this story beyond any limits of sanity.

Neither Obama, nor the US government, has any plans to kill innocent American citizens with drones.

The airborne drone is just another tool to be used in the fight against crime in this country.

What's the difference if a cop shoots a criminal, or that same criminal is killed by an airborne drone?

If a drone attack was the best option to prevent a terrorist attack, would you condemn it's use just because the terrorists happen to be American citizens?

Do you think you have a better understanding of the constitution than Judge Andrew Napolitano?

posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire

JBnTX · 02-09-2013, 09:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by RC-RAMIE

Do you think you have a better understanding of the constitution than Judge Andrew Napolitano?

It's not about me and how much I know about the constitution.

It's about Napolitano and others trying to scare the American people by exaggerating this drone issue into something it's not.

I distrust the government as much as anyone here, but we have to use some common sense, and we have to pick and choose which battles to fight against that government.

What Napolitano does in this video is the same thing as yelling fire in a crowded movie theatre. He's using the constitution to prey upon the fears of Americans and to gain ratings for his own personal benefit.

We can play "what if" all day long.
He knows better.

Judge Napolitano What If - YouTube

RC-RAMIE · 02-09-2013, 10:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBnTX

It's not about me and how much I know about the constitution.

It's about Napolitano and others trying to scare the American people by exaggerating this drone issue into something it's not.

I distrust the government as much as anyone here, but we have to use some common sense, and we have to pick and choose which battles to fight against that government.

What Napolitano does in this video is the same thing as yelling fire in a crowded movie theatre. He's using the constitution to prey upon the fears of Americans and to gain ratings for his own personal benefit.

We can play "what if" all day long.
He knows better.

Judge Napolitano What If - YouTube

The government using unconstitutional powers to kill American citizens, is not one of the battles we should be taking up with the Government?

Should we save all the outrage for just Obama phones?

posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire

Triple7 · 02-09-2013, 10:28

If they are American citizens it is their right to have a trail.... Don't squash someone's routs because of emotions

JBnTX · 02-09-2013, 10:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by snerd

There are none so blind as they who will not see.

Respectfully.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruble Noon

Look at all the people that are mistakenly put on the governments no fly list.
I think some modicum of proof would be prudent.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RC-RAMIE

Do you think you have a better understanding of the constitution than Judge Andrew Napolitano?

posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire

Quote:

Originally Posted by RC-RAMIE

The government using unconstitutional powers to kill American citizens, is not one of the battles we should be taking up with the Government?

Should we save all the outrage for just Obama phones?

posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire

What if Adolf Hitler had been an American citizen?

I wonder how many American citizens were in Hiroshima and Nagasaki during WWII?

..

Ruble Noon · 02-09-2013, 10:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBnTX

What if Adolf Hitler had been an American citizen?

..

I wonder what the Jews thought of Hitler's extermination list?

First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Socialist.
Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Jew.
Then they came for me--and there was no one left to speak for me.

JBnTX · 02-09-2013, 12:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruble Noon

I wonder what the Jews thought of Hitler's extermination list?

Would you have defended Hitler's right to constitutional protection if he had been a US citizen?

..

EnemyOfTheState · 02-09-2013, 12:33

Dont waste your time, folks.

The folks on GTPI who support this are stubborn.

They can't see past the war on terror, of which they are egotistically invested in. When it comes to killing middle easterners they have no problem giving the government any power it claims is "just for the battlefield", with no idea of the potential for the abuse of that power down the road.

As I said in another post, these folks support the Constitution until it stands in the way of their political and imperial agendas. Much like
the current Anti-gunners do.

The simple fact is, killing any American citizen without due process is UNCONSTITUTIONAL. When the government is allowed to sidestep it's regulating document, what's to stop it from sidestepping it in other instances? like the 2A for example. You complain and moan about the size of government and it's spending, but completly support it adhering to the COTUS only when it wants to, and now you wonder why it's coming for our guns?

There is nothing like a sheep that rolls over on it's back on it's own when it comes shearing time.

Saberman · 02-09-2013, 12:52

I think the Govt is priming the pump. So when americans resist gun confication they can do whatever they want to "We The People".. They just need to call us terrorists. And it's open season on Americans.

JBnTX · 02-09-2013, 12:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by EnemyOfTheState

Dont waste your time, folks.

The folks on GTPI who support this are stubborn.

There is nothing like a sheep that rolls over on it's back on it's own when it comes shearing time.

Would you have defended Hitler's right to constitutional protection if he had been a US citizen?

Would you have supported killing him without advising him of his rights, providing a lawyer for him, or denying him a trial by a jury of his peers?

Should American troops have gotten a search warrant before going into his bunker?

That is "if" he had been an American citizen.

..

snerd · 02-09-2013, 13:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBnTX

Would you have defended Hitler's right to constitutional protection if he had been a US citizen?

Would you have supported killing him without advising him of his rights, providing a lawyer for him, or denying him a trial by a jury of his peers?

Should American troops have gotten a search warrant before going into his bunker?

That is "if" he had been an American citizen.

..

I hereby invoke Godwins Law. You lose.

JBnTX · 02-09-2013, 14:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by snerd

I hereby invoke Godwins Law. You lose.

Funny how nobody wants take on that question?...

Ruble Noon · 02-09-2013, 14:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBnTX

Would you have defended Hitler's right to constitutional protection if he had been a US citizen?

Would you have supported killing him without advising him of his rights, providing a lawyer for him, or denying him a trial by a jury of his peers?

Should American troops have gotten a search warrant before going into his bunker?

That is "if" he had been an American citizen.

..

We were at WAR. Americans fought on the side of the Germans and we're killed by us but we were at WAR with Germany. Who are we at WAR with JB?

BTW, the Russians took Hitler's bunker.

Ruble Noon · 02-09-2013, 14:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBnTX

Funny how nobody wants take on that question?...

JB, why didn't you vote for Obama? You and he agree on so much.

jeager · 02-09-2013, 14:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBnTX

What if Adolf Hitler had been an American citizen?

I wonder how many American citizens were in Hiroshima and Nagasaki during WWII?

..

'dolf was Fuer-buerger for all us Nationalized Socialists
("would you like subsidized fries with that?
Sorry!, No access to 20+oz Sodas.
I will provide you with a 4-seater Cup Caddy, of Coaurse!
we accept .gov nutrition cards for your snack this afternoon"

There were American "witnesses" (PoWs) on the hillside just outta town.

JBnTX · 02-09-2013, 14:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruble Noon

We were at WAR. Americans fought on the side of the Germans and we're killed by us but we were at WAR with Germany. Who are we at WAR with JB?
.

We are at war with Islamic terrorism conducted by the terrorist group known as Al Qaeda.

Anwar al-Awlaki was an enemy soldier killed on the battlefield in that war.

My Hitler analogies are based on him being an American citizen, not on historical facts.

I don't agree with Obama on anything.

countrygun · 02-09-2013, 14:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ruble Noon

JB, why didn't you vote for Obama? You and he agree on so much.

My father and indeed my whole family hated FDR with a passion, they didn't dodge the war because of it, or decry the steps FDR took to win the war.

Really, with all the resources available to a POTUS if he can find people to operate the drones against Americans here don't you think he could find people to eliminate his "enemies" in a much less spectacular fashion?

If he were that evil do you think he would wait to get permission, or use such an obvious method?

Ruble Noon · 02-09-2013, 14:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBnTX

We are at war with Islamic terrorism conducted by the terrorist group known as Al Qaeda.

Anwar al-Awlaki was an enemy soldier killed on the battlefield in that war.

My Hitler analogies are based on him being an American citizen, not on historical facts.

I don't agree with Obama on anything.

Get real JB. You don't agree with Obama on anything? Seriously? WTF are you doing arguing for his ability to assassinate American citizens then?

Can you produce this declaration of war?

jeager · 02-09-2013, 15:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by JBnTX

Would you have defended Hitler's right to constitutional protection if he had been a US citizen?

Would you have supported killing him without advising him of his rights, providing a lawyer for him, or denying him a trial by a jury of his peers?

Should American troops have gotten a search warrant before going into his bunker?

That is "if" he had been an American citizen.

..

That's why we allied w/ the ruthless English due to our collective memory
as Colonials and ethnic Irish Muck.
Don't forget the Smallpox blankets!
Churchill, the SAS, and a Gibraltar StayCation
would have solved the Fascist Final Solution Questionne.
Brits had a great track record;
Doctrine of nite-firebombing German Cities since 1941.

Endgame is why we allowed Soviets take Berlin
(200,000 killed in last week, ALONE!)

We sacrificed <500,000 GIs+civillians
Pacific and Europa combined.