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Old 02-08-2013, 10:44   #26
aplcr0331
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Took a class in Consitutional Government as a junior in college and studied the federalist papers among other constituional type documents, but that was years ago.

Rarely ever read it unless someone posts an amendment or wording from the BOR on a forum.
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Old 02-08-2013, 11:49   #27
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Originally Posted by LawScholar View Post
Goodness, you must go through a lot of Che Guevara shirts.

OP, I have an app on my phone that contains them, and peruse them regularly.
What's the name of that app?
Thanks!
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Old 02-08-2013, 12:44   #28
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What's the name of that app?
Thanks!
Constitution for iPhone and iPod Touch V.1.5.1: Copyright 2012 Clint Bagwell Consulting

No problem!
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Old 02-08-2013, 13:18   #29
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I was using Google to do some research - I ended up on a Cato Institute web site.

About 2 weeks later I got a Declaration of Independence & Constitution handbook from them in the mail.

I did not leave my name or address on the web site.



Spooky coincidence or they have an amazing ability to use the internet.

Have read both several times since getting the handbook.
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Old 02-08-2013, 13:30   #30
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They are sitting right here, on my desk. I keep a copy in my car too.

All the Best,
D. White
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Amendment 10.
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.
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Old 02-08-2013, 14:44   #31
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I read the constitution plenty- I even teach government employees about it. Heck, the Army even made me read the constitution of Afghanistan before I went there.

The problem we see on Glock Talk is that reading the constitution doesn't seem to help most people here understand it. We get people who think, like Rooster Rugburn, that the constitution means anything they want, so their personal opinion is, somehow, superior to the results of trained legal experts who have gone through a process of studying precedent and arguing different points of view to arrive at an interpretation. If you think about it, that's a pretty crazy opinion to hold.
This.

I'm not a Conlaw expert, but I am a lawyer and -- not boasting, just for context here -- a pretty accomplished one. Top of my class, adjunct professor, etc.

When discussions of the Constitution come up I am regularly told, by folks who may be VERY accomplished in other fields but have no legal training at all, that this or that or the other thing is "what the Constitution says." When I mention the Supreme Court, these folks regularly give me some version of "so what?"

The Constitution doesn't belong to lawyers and judges -- God no. But this idea that you don't benefit from SOME kind of education in understanding its meaning and function -- or, worse, the idea that having that learning or experience is a DETRIMENT to such understanding -- that's not a useful notion.

Last edited by tslex; 02-08-2013 at 14:45..
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Old 02-08-2013, 14:48   #32
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Legal precedent SHOULD BE irrelevant.

Understanding the COTUS. Does not require a JD.
CF, I agree no JD is strictly required. But some study and learning is. Agreed?

Too many folks wave the thing around like a talisman, and even if they have actually read it, don't understand it or try to.
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Old 02-08-2013, 14:49   #33
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I'm all for legal analysis, I just don't think nine unelected judges should determine what is and is not constitutional without the states agreeing to the decision.
To coin a phrase: I rest my case.
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Old 02-08-2013, 17:24   #34
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Originally Posted by tslex View Post
This.

When discussions of the Constitution come up I am regularly told, by folks who may be VERY accomplished in other fields but have no legal training at all, that this or that or the other thing is "what the Constitution says." When I mention the Supreme Court, these folks regularly give me some version of "so what?"

The Constitution doesn't belong to lawyers and judges -- God no. But this idea that you don't benefit from SOME kind of education in understanding its meaning and function -- or, worse, the idea that having that learning or experience is a DETRIMENT to such understanding -- that's not a useful notion.
Plus-freakin'-one, sir
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Old 02-08-2013, 19:37   #35
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To coin a phrase: I rest my case.


Do us a favor and coin Judicial Review as a power granted by the COTUS and not a power granted by the SCOTUS and rest against that.
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Old 02-08-2013, 19:43   #36
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Or just keep supporting legislation from the bench by default. Maybe we can get other branches of government to grant themselves powers not dictated by the COTUS...
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Old 02-09-2013, 00:15   #37
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Originally Posted by syntaxerrorsix View Post
Or just keep supporting legislation from the bench by default. Maybe we can get other branches of government to grant themselves powers not dictated by the COTUS...
All three branches have repeatedly done exactly that. This country is a LOT more complex than it once was, Where in the Constitution does it say how to regulate e-commerce? Or outline the proper judicial system for the military? Or put in place a system that regulates food and medicine, keeping rat feces and toxic faux-medicines out of stores as much as possible? Etc. etc.

Requiring nothing but the text without educated analysis would make the nation literally unmanageable.
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Old 02-09-2013, 05:20   #38
syntaxerrorsix
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All three branches have repeatedly done exactly that. This country is a LOT more complex than it once was, Where in the Constitution does it say how to regulate e-commerce? Or outline the proper judicial system for the military? Or put in place a system that regulates food and medicine, keeping rat feces and toxic faux-medicines out of stores as much as possible? Etc. etc.

Requiring nothing but the text without educated analysis would make the nation literally unmanageable.
Here we have the problem. We don't play by the rules anymore.

E-Commerce can be directly dealt with in the same manner as ordinary commerce. The only thing that changes is the ordering process.

The proper outline for the UCMJ is found in the COTUS. "The Congress shall have Power... To make Rules for the Government and Regulation of the land and naval forces" Of course it specifies Navy because we aren't suppose to support a standing Army for more than two years.

Creating the FDA is NOT a power of the federal government and therefor is left to the States to form and fund. What did we do before the 1906?

The nation is more easily managed at the local level. It's when we put our full faith and trust in a central government dictated by people that don't have context of the situation and then choose to violate the basis of our law that we run into the real problems.
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