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Old 01-27-2013, 14:49   #351
OlliesRevenge
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The notion that conspiracy theorists "Can't handle the truth", and fabricate elaborate theories in order to avoid "unpleasant realities" is becoming a tired old saw, and doesn't hold up to logical scrutiny.

Here's why -

There seem to be 3 separate Sandy Hook conspiracy theories, lets consider them separately and compare their "scariness" to the standard mainstream media reports-

CT #1) No one really died and the whole thing was a completely fabricated media op.

Sure, it's kind of "scary" to think that a kid like Lanza can come out of nowhere with a rifle and kill people you love... especially for parents. But if I am seeking alternate explanations in order to elude fear, is it really less frightening to believe that I live under a government that has the will and the means to pull off such a vast deception simply to deprive me of my rights? I think if anything it would be more frightening to believe this... especially when you consider what the ultimate plans of such a government might be (ie. NWO, FEMA camps, genocide, et al.)

CT #2) Adam Lanza was a "manchurian candidate" who was drugged, brainwashed, and brought to the school by a "handler" who ensured the event went roughly as planned... and that the patsy comitted "suicide".

In my view this is the most frightening theory of all... at least in CT#1 no kids were killed. In this version we are living under a government that is willing to systematically execute 5-6 year old children in order to advance a political agenda. Seems quite horrifying to me. Lets compare this to the idea that a lone, mentally disturbed 20 year old, shot up Sandy Hook -- In terms of "scariness"... it's not even close.

CT #3) Deranged Adam Lanza acted alone, shot his mother, drove to Sandy Hook with 2 pistols and 2 long guns -- then shot up the school with only the pistols -- perhaps because he couldn't have gotten buzzed into the secure school front door if he'd been carrying a long gun. When it's all over, the story is twisted to include the Bushmaster because it helps advance a gun ban agenda.

This is the easiest conspiracy theory to entertain. But it is important to note that if I am repelled by the "scariness" of the mainstream story, this version offers me little solace, because it is exactly the same as the mainstream version, with a bit of government deception after the fact... to advance a gun ban agenda. Fear simply isn't an issue with this conspiracy theory.

To summarize -- CT#1 & CT#2 are, quite clearly, far more frightening than the mainstream story. With CT#3 fear simply cannot be a factor.

The idea that conspiracy theorists are running away from the "hard truth" of the mainstream story is total nonsense.


(Edit: To include clarification of what the supposed "hard truth" is)
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Old 01-27-2013, 15:01   #352
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What exactly is the "hard truth?" Where does one get the "hard truth" about this elementary school shooting?
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Old 01-27-2013, 15:04   #353
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Where does one get the "hard truth" about this elementary school shooting?
On InfoWars, Silly! HH
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Old 01-27-2013, 15:08   #354
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What exactly is the "hard truth?" Where does one get the "hard truth" about this elementary school shooting?
You misunderstand.

According to some here, the "hard truth" is the mainstream story that the conspiracy theorists are supposedly running from.
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Old 01-27-2013, 15:20   #355
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Originally Posted by OlliesRevenge View Post
You misunderstand.

According to some here, the "hard truth" is the mainstream story that the conspiracy theorists are supposedly running from.
They are not running from anything. They're running towards something because it makes them somehow feel better. HH
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Old 01-27-2013, 15:22   #356
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They are not running from anything. They're running towards something because it makes them somehow feel better. HH
I agree with your statement!

Cheers!
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Old 01-27-2013, 15:35   #357
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They are not running from anything. They're running towards something because it makes them somehow feel better. HH
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Originally Posted by OlliesRevenge View Post
I agree with your statement!

Cheers!
And that may be part of the problem. The only way anyone will end up knowing what happened is if they approach the event from a perspective based on facts and evidence, not emotions or what one feels.
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Old 01-27-2013, 16:13   #358
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...The only way anyone will end up knowing what happened is if they approach the event from a perspective based on facts and evidence, not emotions or what one feels.
Agreed. We do not currently know all the specifics of what happened yet.

The tragedy of course is that Sandy Hook will be used as the USA's "Port Arthur Massacre" before all the facts and evidence are officially released.
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Old 01-27-2013, 19:59   #359
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Originally Posted by OlliesRevenge View Post
The notion that conspiracy theorists "Can't handle the truth", and fabricate elaborate theories in order to avoid "unpleasant realities" is becoming a tired old saw, and doesn't hold up to logical scrutiny.

Here's why -

There seem to be 3 separate Sandy Hook conspiracy theories, lets consider them separately and compare their "scariness" to the standard mainstream media reports-

CT #1) No one really died and the whole thing was a completely fabricated media op.

Sure, it's kind of "scary" to think that a kid like Lanza can come out of nowhere with a rifle and kill people you love... especially for parents. But if I am seeking alternate explanations in order to elude fear, is it really less frightening to believe that I live under a government that has the will and the means to pull off such a vast deception simply to deprive me of my rights? I think if anything it would be more frightening to believe this... especially when you consider what the ultimate plans of such a government might be (ie. NWO, FEMA camps, genocide, et al.)
While I think this is the most unlikely scenario, the art of propaganda creation has become nearly perfected. You see it on tv all the time. Even "reality shows" are now admitted being staged and scripted. Same with the false news reports on various subjects we see all the time.

Quote:
CT #2) Adam Lanza was a "manchurian candidate" who was drugged, brainwashed, and brought to the school by a "handler" who ensured the event s roughly as planned... and that the patsy comitted "suicide".

In my view this is the most frightening theory of all... at least in CT#1 no kids were killed. In this version we are living under a government that is willing to systematically execute 5-6 year old children in order to advance a political agenda. Seems quite horrifying to me. Lets compare this to the idea that a lone, mentally disturbed 20 year old, shot up Sandy Hook -- In terms of "scariness"... it's not even close.
Our gov't does this to kids overseas all the time. Drone missile strikes are a perfect example.

Quote:
CT #3) Deranged Adam Lanza acted alone, shot his mother, drove to Sandy Hook with 2 pistols and 2 long guns -- then shot up the school with only the pistols -- perhaps because he couldn't have gotten buzzed into the secure school front door if he'd been carrying a long gun. When it's all over, the story is twisted to include the Bushmaster because it helps advance a gun ban agenda.

This is the easiest conspiracy theory to entertain. But it is important to note that if I am repelled by the "scariness" of the mainstream story, this version offers me little solace, because it is exactly the same as the mainstream version, with a bit of government deception after the fact... to advance a gun ban agenda. Fear simply isn't an issue with this conspiracy theory.
It's the hardest to entertain because of the logistical issues of a sopping wet 120 pound dork kid popping off at least a hundred rounds from an AR INDOORS, in a matter of moments. The logistics of how the official story could have actually occurred (where are the now deaf children?) makes this theory the most unlikely to me.
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Old 01-27-2013, 20:20   #360
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You misunderstand.

According to some here, the "hard truth" is the mainstream story that the conspiracy theorists are supposedly running from.
Actually that is about the psychology of it. The Conspiracy theorists create a scenario of their own, which because they invented, they are in control of. They cans spin the theory out as far as they need to shield themselves from the reality of a lone nut.

You summed it up well.
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Old 01-27-2013, 20:27   #361
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Actually that is about the psychology of it. The Conspiracy theorists create a scenario of their own, which because they invented, they are in control of. They cans spin the theory out as far as they need to shield themselves from the reality of a lone nut.

You summed it up well.
They are very much like this Teo guy from Notre Dame. Someone creates a scenario for them as a joke and they fall for it hook, line and sinker to the point of denial simply because the joke fills a huge void in their lives or covers a subconscious guilt or feeling of inadequacy. HH
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Old 01-27-2013, 21:18   #362
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They are very much like this Teo guy from Notre Dame. Someone creates a scenario for them as a joke and they fall for it hook, line and sinker to the point of denial simply because the joke fills a huge void in their lives or covers a subconscious guilt or feeling of inadequacy. HH
So because some of us believe something other then you we are feeling guilt or inadequacy? This is the same thinking Adolf Hitler and Barack Obama share along with many liberals. You have been posting over and over again how crazy anyone is who doubts the police, it seems you are the one who is feeling remorse or guilt for something. Tell us what you did to make you feel this way, if you don't want to talk about it it's OK because it's your right under the Constitution. By the way I was wondering what a police officer like yourself(I think your a cop)makes of this video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...v=ri9ioCbqJCU#!
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Old 01-27-2013, 22:04   #363
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So because some of us believe something other then you we are feeling guilt or inadequacy? This is the same thinking Adolf Hitler and Barack Obama share along with many liberals. You have been posting over and over again how crazy anyone is who doubts the police, it seems you are the one who is feeling remorse or guilt for something. Tell us what you did to make you feel this way, if you don't want to talk about it it's OK because it's your right under the Constitution. By the way I was wondering what a police officer like yourself(I think your a cop)makes of this video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...v=ri9ioCbqJCU#!
Not a cop. That should be obvious. HH
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Old 01-27-2013, 22:21   #364
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Not a cop. That should be obvious. HH
I appreciate you answering that question, thank you sir.
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Old 01-28-2013, 05:10   #365
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Actually that is about the psychology of it. The Conspiracy theorists create a scenario of their own, which because they invented, they are in control of. They cans spin the theory out as far as they need to shield themselves from the reality of a lone nut.

You summed it up well.
If you think we are in agreement then there is a significant misunderstanding here.

Conspiracy theorists are not motivated by fear. Their "conspiracy theories" are more frightening than any mainstream news, as I pointed out in post #351. If anything, the conspiracy crowd is comprised of people who enjoy horror movies.

If you are sincerely trying to understand conspiracy theorists, then you are way off track thinking they are fear based, and trying to "shield themselves from the reality of a lone nut".
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Old 01-28-2013, 05:51   #366
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A few times a year they do some training here. Some of the training involves high rise buildings in urban areas. That would of course eliminate places without those. Of the places that do have that, there is also an ocean here handy for some other training. A bit west there is a huge rural area good for some other training. There is a transitional airport nearby that has a couple miles of runway and also used for training. There is a good range here available for them. There is some military presence which presumably helps with logistics and there are government helicopters based here which may be of some use for maintanence. There is a world class trauma unit here in case something goes horribly wrong. There are probably other cities that have all the same logistics. Most of the others may not get to 81 degrees today.
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Old 01-28-2013, 07:08   #367
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A few times a year they do some training here. Some of the training involves high rise buildings in urban areas. That would of course eliminate places without those. Of the places that do have that, there is also an ocean here handy for some other training. A bit west there is a huge rural area good for some other training. There is a transitional airport nearby that has a couple miles of runway and also used for training. There is a good range here available for them. There is some military presence which presumably helps with logistics and there are government helicopters based here which may be of some use for maintanence. There is a world class trauma unit here in case something goes horribly wrong. There are probably other cities that have all the same logistics. Most of the others may not get to 81 degrees today.
I have my fingers crossed it's not a preparation for something else. A lot of things going on lately got me a little jumpy and very prepared. I hope I am just a nut job and me and my family have nothing to worry about.
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Old 01-28-2013, 07:16   #368
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There are alot of things to worry about but I do not think this specific news item is one of them if for no other reason than it is nothing new here. Eespecially this time of the year.
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Old 01-28-2013, 07:41   #369
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A few times a year they do some training here. Some of the training involves high rise buildings in urban areas. That would of course eliminate places without those. Of the places that do have that, there is also an ocean here handy for some other training. A bit west there is a huge rural area good for some other training. There is a transitional airport nearby that has a couple miles of runway and also used for training. There is a good range here available for them. There is some military presence which presumably helps with logistics and there are government helicopters based here which may be of some use for maintanence. There is a world class trauma unit here in case something goes horribly wrong. There are probably other cities that have all the same logistics. Most of the others may not get to 81 degrees today.
I could start up some internet postings about what's "really" going on with that and have a substantial following in short order. I'm resisting the temptation.
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Old 01-28-2013, 10:18   #370
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By the way I was wondering what a police officer like yourself(I think your a cop)
Curious, what made you believe he is a cop?
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Old 01-28-2013, 10:21   #371
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I could start up some internet postings about what's "really" going on with that and have a substantial following in short order. I'm resisting the temptation.
too late there is already a thread on it .

posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire
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Old 01-28-2013, 10:30   #372
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Curious, what made you believe he is a cop?
I don't want him to think I am talking smack about him because I am not. I believed he was a cop because it seems he can't believe a officer is capable of wrong doing sometimes and another GT member mention he was a officer. I give the police a lot of credit risking their lives everyday along with firefighters and many other professions but as in any field I know there's bad apples. I contribute the news media and news paper for my lack of trust in the police because they mostly only report the bad deeds because that sells more papers which is sad. I guess I'm a victim of one sided reporting.

My friend is a police officer in the 1st district in South Philadelphia and 15 years ago he was the 1st on the scene to a 2 story house fire. A senior was hanging out of the 2nd story bedroom window screaming for help as the house was in flames. My friend kicked in her front door and ran upstairs and carried her out of the house as she was froze with fear and couldn't even walk. The story never made the paper but when he and his partner crashed into another cruiser years later speeding to a officer assist call it made the paper.

A female officer responded to a domestic dispute call and when the female officer arrived she was attacked by a 6' 3" 300lb man on drugs who was breaking bones in her face screaming in her radio for help. I will admit that if I see a officer in a fight and losing I would 100% jump in and start swinging. When I was a teenager working at CVS I helped a lady cop take a shoplifter down and handcuff when he tried to out power her.

I am not a cop hater, I just am weary of who I speak to and what I say when it comes to LE.
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Old 01-28-2013, 10:39   #373
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If you think we are in agreement then there is a significant misunderstanding here.

Conspiracy theorists are not motivated by fear. Their "conspiracy theories" are more frightening than any mainstream news, as I pointed out in post #351. If anything, the conspiracy crowd is comprised of people who enjoy horror movies.

If you are sincerely trying to understand conspiracy theorists, then you are way off track thinking they are fear based, and trying to "shield themselves from the reality of a lone nut".
I actually hope we don't agree but I find you "Movie; reference to be quite apropos.

that is exactly what they and the gun band crowd are doing, you see, for years one of the great terms in pop Psychology has been "Closure" and everyone is supposed to be seeking in for various situations in life, but closure is a two-edged sword. Putting "The End" up on the movie screen and rolling the credits, with only one name (that of the nut/shooter) is something that they don't want to face, so they keep the movies rolling by keeping the action, be it the fight to ban guns or the conspiracy, going.

They never have to have that forced closure. they can close the movie on their own terms later when they and time, have reduced the impact of the events on the psyche to a manageable level.
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Old 01-28-2013, 11:03   #374
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While I think this is the most unlikely scenario, the art of propaganda creation has become nearly perfected. You see it on tv all the time. Even "reality shows" are now admitted being staged and scripted. Same with the false news reports on various subjects we see all the time.



Our gov't does this to kids overseas all the time. Drone missile strikes are a perfect example.



It's the hardest to entertain because of the logistical issues of a sopping wet 120 pound dork kid popping off at least a hundred rounds from an AR INDOORS, in a matter of moments. The logistics of how the official story could have actually occurred (where are the now deaf children?) makes this theory the most unlikely to me.
what official story

Have you seen the released report...?

Are you privy to the private medical records (Hippa law) of the children that may have suffered injuries or hearing damage.


Seen plenty of 120 lbs dorks popping off rounds from AR15s in three gun matchs, not that hard.
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Old 01-28-2013, 11:11   #375
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I don't want him to think I am talking smack about him because I am not. I believed he was a cop because it seems he can't believe a officer is capable of wrong doing sometimes...
I never said an officer is not capapble of wrongdoing. What I keep saying there were simply far too many people who were not cops who were there as it unfolded for this to have been skewed by cops alone. I order for this event to have happened in any other way than has now been reported, the following would have absolutely had to have a hand in it:

Newtown Police Dept.
Connecticut State Police (I believe multiple troops responded)
Connecticut Dept. of Criminal Investigation
FBI local
FBI Washington
BATFE local
BATFE Washington
Newtown VFD
Danbury Hospital
St. Mary's Hospital
Waterbury Hospital
The local ME
The surviving teachers, staffers and kids (and their families)
The families of the victims
Countless mortuaries and funeral homes
The painters/cleaners who just this week are now restoring the site.

I could go on and on. HH
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