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Old 01-19-2013, 16:44   #141
ICARRY2
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Originally Posted by DaBigBR View Post
That's exactly right. We are not a lobby, we are part of the executive branch of government and engage in law enforcement activities.
Correct. You are not a lobby, but police agencies and police unions do lobby legislatures all the time for legislation you would like to see enacted for the benefit of police officers.

Too often when it comes to gun rights, your lobbying stops with leos and leaves out the rest of us.

Just like with the 2004 nationwide ccw for active/retired leos and NYS efforts to exempt themselves from the 7 round magazine limit.

I am sure others here can cite other examples as well.
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Old 01-19-2013, 16:58   #142
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Furthermore, ICARRY2, who have you seen on TV speaking about these issues? Universally, it's someone with stars on their lapels. Chiefs, Deputy Chiefs, administrators and obviously Sheriffs are political positions and thereby carry a certain weight with their opinions (no matter how hackneyed they are). Think about the last time you saw Patrol Officer Jones on the news espousing their opinions on national CCW. Why is that? Because the media and those in the higher levels of government don't care about the opinions of peons like us. They rely on our Chief to express our opinions on our behalf. If the opinions expressed don't reflect ours, we don't really have much in the way of recourse, do we?

I dare say the average police officer in this country couldn't care less about high capacity magazines, or if you're carrying a firearm legally. Those in the upper eschelons of police adminsitration care, and their views must align with those of their betters so they can keep their position and advance. Politics, see?

Add to that the very real possibility a department may have a general order or some such directive barring a plain old street cop from expressing personal opinions while representing the department, and you'll never hear what the officer pushing the squad car really thinks.
I understand your point about individual leos speaking out in an official capacity, but as Grimlet stated you belong to police organizations that represent your interest. Grimlet is asking you to contact those reps to amend leosa so the police are not affected by magazine limits. Which is exactly what I'm talking about. Passing exemptions for the police and not fighting for gun rights in general so there wouldn't be a need for an exemption in the first place.
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Old 01-19-2013, 16:58   #143
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Originally Posted by ICARRY2 View Post
Correct. You are not a lobby, but police agencies and police unions do lobby legislatures all the time for legislation you would like to see enacted for the benefit of police officers.

Too often when it comes to gun rights, your lobbying stops with leos and leaves out the rest of us.

Just like with the 2004 nationwide ccw for active/retired leos and NYS efforts to exempt themselves from the 7 round magazine limit.

I am sure others here can cite other examples as well.
The NRA is much more powerful than any police association. They have more money. More connection. More juice. Really.

And thank you for your past support of, and financial contributions to, LE associations. And all your future support as well. Really.
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Last edited by Patchman; 01-19-2013 at 17:00..
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Old 01-19-2013, 16:59   #144
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My fight is winnable.

The other 50-50.


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Old 01-19-2013, 17:00   #145
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Originally Posted by GRIMLET View Post
However, we do belong to certain LE organizations who look out for our interests.

And I hope all here are petitioning their PBA, FOP, Union or other association to amend LEOSA to include high capacity magazines.

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Yes. Exactly what I am talking about.
Thank you.
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Old 01-19-2013, 17:23   #146
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Originally Posted by Patchman View Post
OK, so basically, a lot of the anti-LEO posters on GNG are on the same mental level as Cuomo, Bloomberg and company. Not surprised.

Gotcha. Thanks.

I would hope you are discerning enough to see that I am posting akin to reporting like a fly on the wall, and not my own thoughts.

Please tell me you at least get this.
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Old 01-19-2013, 17:42   #147
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I would hope you are discerning enough to see that I am posting akin to reporting like a fly on the wall, and not my own thoughts.

Please tell me you at least get this.

Yes, yes, yes. I don't associate you with the likes of Cuomo, Bloomberg or any other politician.

I'm just noting that their logic flow on issues is the same as the logic flow from some GNG posters. Which is, there's no logic flow. And also, the issues are different.
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Old 01-19-2013, 17:44   #148
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The NRA is much more powerful than any police association. They have more money. More connection. More juice. Really.
Last time I checked leos could ccw nationwide. The average gun owner could not.
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Old 01-19-2013, 18:10   #149
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Originally Posted by Patchman View Post
Yes, yes, yes. I don't associate you with the likes of Cuomo, Bloomberg or any other politician.

I'm just noting that their logic flow on issues is the same as the logic flow from some GNG posters. Which is, there's no logic flow. And also, the issues are different.



I'd much rather you accuse me of fondling farm animals than that I have an affinity for Bloomberg et al.


I am thinking about writing a letter to the NYT, to ask them if they would publish an "open letter" to His Royal Majesty, The Rt. Honorable Andrew M. Coumo. It would be about 4-5 paragraphs long, would piss off some gun owners, and be lost on mostly anyone south of I-84 and again south of I-495.
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Old 01-19-2013, 18:12   #150
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The NRA is much more powerful than any police association. They have more money. More connection. More juice. Really.
.
If that were the case, the NRA would have been able to sway Congress as LE did to enact HR218.

In all the noise, thank you (everybody except Patchman ) for doing a thankless, demoralizing job. I've tried to instill in my offspring a healthy respect and appreciation for public "servants", and especially for LE.

- G
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Old 01-19-2013, 18:26   #151
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If that were the case, the NRA would have been able to sway Congress as LE did to enact HR218.

In all the noise, thank you (everybody except Patchman ) for doing a thankless, demoralizing job. I've tried to instill in my offspring a healthy respect and appreciation for public "servants", and especially for LE.

- G
Hey, if any of your off springs want to better themselves by become a LEO, so they can better themselves socially (not economically-that's what your estate is for), let me know. I'll gladly call whatever agency they're applying for and put in a good word.
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Old 01-19-2013, 18:36   #152
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If that were the case, the NRA would have been able to sway Congress as LE did to enact HR218.
G
Immediately after 9/11/2001, both President Bush and Congress knew what was right, and did right. Just goes to show, money can't always buy congress all the time, on all issues.

Sorry, but talk to the NRA about it.
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Old 01-19-2013, 18:54   #153
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Originally Posted by ICARRY2 View Post
I understand your point about individual leos speaking out in an official capacity, but as Grimlet stated you belong to police organizations that represent your interest. Grimlet is asking you to contact those reps to amend leosa so the police are not affected by magazine limits. Which is exactly what I'm talking about. Passing exemptions for the police and not fighting for gun rights in general so there wouldn't be a need for an exemption in the first place.
http://www.examiner.com/article/gun-...cial-treatment

Have a great gun carryin' Kenpo day

Clyde
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Old 01-19-2013, 19:38   #154
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http://www.examiner.com/article/gun-...cial-treatment

Have a great gun carryin' Kenpo day

Clyde
Always trying to keep the blue man down........




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Old 01-19-2013, 20:18   #155
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Always trying to keep the blue man down........




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Nope, just trying to make our politicians and public servants live up to the 14th amendment.

Have a great gun carryin' Kenpo day

Clyde
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Old 01-19-2013, 20:24   #156
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I wonder if the exemption would/is going to cover just duty weapons or all of our Weapons and what about our AR's and could we purchase new ar's and Hi Caps 10 or more rounds.

And I must say I I would like to see the mag and AR restrictions lifted for everyone not just LE.
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Old 01-19-2013, 20:27   #157
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Originally Posted by ICARRY2 View Post
Cochese,

The only problem with repealing or stopping gun control is that it seems like when politicians do pass gun control that affects the police too, the police dont fight the legislation they only fight to get an exemption for themselves.

Once the police do get exempted, you never hear from the police again about how wrong or ineffective the new gun control law is other than places like GT. The police don't lobby our legislature to overturn anything or to support ccw nationwide.

I remember watching a chief on the news testifying before Congress about LEOSA back on 2004 when the law was being considered. The chief thought federal law should allow active/retired leos to ccw nationwide, but it should be up to the states when it comes to private citizens ccw.

I know you and other leos here on GT are very pro-2A, citizen ccw nationwide, but leos as a whole do not fight very often or very hard for citizens gun rights.

I really think if the police in this country became more vocal and publicly supported the 2A everytime some gun grabber introduced ridiculous legislation we would ALL be better off.

Look at the police in NY. They are not fighting the new magazine restriction, they are just trying to get an exemption for themselves.

I don't know about the others here but I cannot use my position for personal gain or political favoritism nor can I advocate for or on behalf of something in any type of association with my employment. We have public information officers for that.

Bosses can say what they want but they have a different dog in the fight than Joe beatcop.

It is what it is. I'm fighting it as a citizen... just like everyone else.
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Old 01-19-2013, 20:29   #158
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Originally Posted by kenpoprofessor View Post
Nope, just trying to make our politicians and public servants live up to the 14th amendment.

Have a great gun carryin' Kenpo day

Clyde
You are so ignorant it makes my cats taint itch.
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Old 01-19-2013, 20:40   #159
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Nope, just trying to make our politicians and public servants live up to the 14th amendment.

Clyde
Professor, you don't pay nearly enough taxes to turn your public servants into your advocates.
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Last edited by Patchman; 01-20-2013 at 02:50..
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Old 01-19-2013, 20:45   #160
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Originally Posted by kenpoprofessor View Post
Nope, just trying to make our politicians and public servants live up to the 14th amendment.

Have a great gun carryin' Kenpo day

Clyde
Sorry double and fixed



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Last edited by GRIMLET; 01-19-2013 at 20:48..
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