[razdog76]

Its my day off, and all I can do is come back to this thread, and chuckle.

[wprebeck]

Great - now I'm gonna be in trouble....again. Mkay - I take back what I said. Do not, under any circumstances, take advantage of any search engine, to search any particular username.

[wprebeck]

As an aside, and completely unrelated to the thread - I have recently discovered that I have a body type best described as "athletic". This greatly increases my self esteem, as I've always considered my rather substantial gut to be "fat".

[razdog76]

Originally Posted by wprebeck

As an aside, and completely unrelated to the thread - I have recently discovered that I have a body type best described as "athletic". This greatly increases my self esteem, as I've always considered my rather substantial gut to be "fat".

You keep it up, and you will force me to change my tag line to, "Have a great gun carrryin' Teddy Bear day."

[razdog76]

Just got the mail, and opened the National Rifleman... looks like they are beating the political drum for the national issue. Lets hope they can direct a little to NY.

[wprebeck]

Just to answer Clyde's question -

Who stopped the Utah mall shooting? Hint - it wasn't a permit holder, it was an off duty cop.

Locally, a retired cop intervened after a double murder occurred right in front of him. Guy was subdued and captured because the retiree was armed.

I personally was glad to armed after encountering someone I know professionally who followed me out from a restaurant to my car. He didn't engage any further because he got a clue that I was carrying.

[razdog76]

To add to the proof I submitted, as an LEO during a 20 to 30 year career of fighting crime and suppressing evil, there is a tendency to meet some unsavory people at the grocery store on a regular basis.

This would tend to raise the chances of being assaulted/killed than that of the rest of the population.

[kenpoprofessor]

Ah, man, good to see you guys so interested in me you find my POF profile . Hell, if you wanted a link, I'd give it to ya.

So anyways, not one of you has given me any stats, you've just bagged on me, why??? You guys obviously don't have truth and facts to bang, so, you bang the table, good for you .

Aren't there some stats that say cops are more likely to be attacked while off duty or retired in right to carry states????? Bueller, Bueller, anyone there?

Clyde

[kenpoprofessor]

Originally Posted by razdog76

To add to the proof I submitted, as an LEO during a 20 to 30 year career of fighting crime and suppressing evil, there is a tendency to meet some unsavory people at the grocery store on a regular basis.

This would tend to raise the chances of being assaulted/killed than that of the rest of the population.

And because of my job, I'm much more likely to get electrocuted than the other common citizens.

What's your point???? Have you had to use your firearm to defend the public or yourself while off duty????

Clyde

[lawman800]

Originally Posted by kenpoprofessor

Have you had to use your firearm to defend the public or yourself while off duty???

Yes, I have. More than once.

[razdog76]

Originally Posted by kenpoprofessor

Ah, man, good to see you guys so interested in me you find my POF profile . Hell, if you wanted a link, I'd give it to ya.

So anyways, not one of you has given me any stats, you've just bagged on me, why??? You guys obviously don't have truth and facts to bang, so, you bang the table, good for you .Clyde

I provided links to piles of data, but can't click on the links and look for your endeavor.

Originally Posted by kenpoprofessor

Aren't there some stats that say cops are more likely to be attacked while off duty or retired in right to carry states????? Bueller, Bueller, anyone there?

Clyde

Not sure where you would find an data to support that, and why you would want to, since it doesn't seem like it would be a good thing for the advocates of gun rights.

With your mensa test scores, you cannot expect to troll an LE forum, and not have members look at it closer... its what we do for a living.

[kenpoprofessor]

Originally Posted by lawman800

Yes, I have. More than once.

Good, I hope it was useful. So, with that said, would it have been any different if your weren't a cop???

Have a great gun carryin' Kenpo day

Clyde

[kenpoprofessor]

Originally Posted by razdog76

I provided links to piles of data, but can't click on the links and look for your endeavor.



Not sure where you would find an data to support that, and why you would want to, since it doesn't seem like it would be a good thing for the advocates of gun rights.

With your mensa test scores, you cannot expect to troll an LE forum, and not have members look at it closer... its what we do for a living.

You're right, not much use for it until you start asking for rights over and above the common joe citizen.

And yea, seems you guys are focusing on me and not the questions. Kinda like a rape trial where the girl is put on trial for the action that happened to her. Weird huh?

And your answers so far are much akin to Hillary's statements today on Benghazi. What a sad bunch.
Clyde

[lawman800]

Originally Posted by kenpoprofessor

Good, I hope it was useful. So, with that said, would it have been any different if your weren't a cop???

Have a great gun carryin' Kenpo day

Clyde

Once I made that decision to take action, not much different, but being a cop, you are apt to take action whereas otherwise you could just be a good witness or walk away.

[razdog76]

Originally Posted by kenpoprofessor

You're right, not much use for it until you start asking for rights over and above the common joe citizen.

And yea, seems you guys are focusing on me and not the questions. Kinda like a rape trial where the girl is put on trial for the action that happened to her. Weird huh?

And your answers so far are much akin to Hillary's statements today on Benghazi. What a sad bunch.
Clyde

I think your analogy is disgusting. You are comparing yourself to someone sexually assaulted, because you get grief for being the king of invalid arguments.

You ask questions, but don't don't read answers.

[rockapede]

Originally Posted by kenpoprofessor

You're right, not much use for it until you start asking for rights over and above the common joe citizen.

And yea, seems you guys are focusing on me and not the questions. Kinda like a rape trial where the girl is put on trial for the action that happened to her. Weird huh?

And your answers so far are much akin to Hillary's statements today on Benghazi. What a sad bunch.
Clyde

Were it up to you, would you repeal LEOSA in the interest of fairness?

[kenpoprofessor]

Originally Posted by rockapede

Were it up to you, would you repeal LEOSA in the interest of fairness?

I'd repeal it under the guise of the 14th amendment. If that means fair to you, take it that way, but it's a clear violation.

Have a great gun carryin' Kenpo day

Clyde

[kenpoprofessor]

Originally Posted by razdog76

I think your analogy is disgusting. You are comparing yourself to someone sexually assaulted, because you get grief for being the king of invalid arguments.

You ask questions, but don't don't read answers.

How is my argument invalid?

Clyde

[kenpoprofessor]

Originally Posted by wprebeck

Just to answer Clyde's question -

Who stopped the Utah mall shooting? Hint - it wasn't a permit holder, it was an off duty cop.

Locally, a retired cop intervened after a double murder occurred right in front of him. Guy was subdued and captured because the retiree was armed.

I personally was glad to armed after encountering someone I know professionally who followed me out from a restaurant to my car. He didn't engage any further because he got a clue that I was carrying.

And how many other instances were stopped by a normal average joe with a gun??? Can you give me any stats for that in contrast to yours?

Clyde

[wprebeck]

Clyde,

I answered your question. You asked me to show you incidents in which retired or off duty officers needed their guns, and needed them more than an average citizen might. I did. And, I wasn't even a dick about it - I didn't include all the incidents in which an officer is working a side job while off duty. Wanna throw those in there for fun?

Point is, we've proven that police tend to need guns more often than the average person. This doesn't mean we want fewer rights for civilians - you DO realize that the few regular LEO's that remain here in GT are pro-gun, right? Honestly, dealing with people like you makes us want to NOT support people like you.

So, take your athletic self elsewhere for an argument. We are done.

[rockapede]

Originally Posted by kenpoprofessor

I'd repeal it under the guise of the 14th amendment. If that means fair to you, take it that way, but it's a clear violation.

Have a great gun carryin' Kenpo day

Clyde

So could several other laws depending on one's interpretation. Be that as it may, let me rephrase in a more direct way: The location is Chicago. LEOs can carry concealed firearms in the city. Non-LEO citizens can't. Do you support taking one citizen's (the LEO) ability to defend himself away simply because the other citizen isn't afforded the same ability?

[lawman800]

What about work place prohibitions which affect LEO's but not Joe Public?

[kenpoprofessor]

Originally Posted by rockapede

So could several other laws depending on one's interpretation. Be that as it may, let me rephrase in a more direct way: The location is Chicago. LEOs can carry concealed firearms in the city. Non-LEO citizens can't. Do you support taking one citizen's (the LEO) ability to defend himself away simply because the other citizen isn't afforded the same ability?

Yes. They could carry the same as every other citizen, and if it means they carry illegally, then so be it. Equal protection under the law, it's that simple. No extra rights simply because of your job in the public service. That includes judges, mayors, city council, state and house members, etc..

Have a great gun carryin' Kenpo day

Clyde

[kenpoprofessor]

Originally Posted by wprebeck

Clyde,

I answered your question. You asked me to show you incidents in which retired or off duty officers needed their guns, and needed them more than an average citizen might. I did. And, I wasn't even a dick about it - I didn't include all the incidents in which an officer is working a side job while off duty. Wanna throw those in there for fun?

Point is, we've proven that police tend to need guns more often than the average person. This doesn't mean we want fewer rights for civilians - you DO realize that the few regular LEO's that remain here in GT are pro-gun, right? Honestly, dealing with people like you makes us want to NOT support people like you.

So, take your athletic self elsewhere for an argument. We are done.

You've proven nothing, you've given me examples but no relevant data other than your own experiences. Everyday, hundreds, if not thousands of people use their firearms in self defense.

In other words, are retired and off duty cops more likely to use their firearm than the average citizen? You've shown nothing to answer that.

Clyde

[4949shooter]

The thing is, off duty LEO's are OBLIGATED to act. This is why we must carry off duty. It is not an option, it is a requirement.

Retired LEO's are INCLINED to act, because of a retained sense of duty left over from their pre retirement days.

The CCWer who didn't act during the Gabrielle Giffords shooting did not react even though he had a gun. Why? Because there was no obligation to duty, nor was there sense of duty.

We can argue this all day long. It is what it is. And no, I don't see it as a 14th amendment issue, not even close. Apples to oranges.

The fact is, you want armed, trained men and women out there with a sense of duty to protect others. The point of CCW is to protect oneself.

There is a difference.