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Old 01-12-2013, 09:17   #176
engineer151515
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Originally Posted by fnfalman View Post
I don't run to mommy either, but I was taught by my drill sergeants that in order to defeat your enemies, you have to be ready to better them at their games.
Classic Sun Tzu.
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Old 01-12-2013, 09:57   #177
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What about the possibility that you are Lind to how you come across?
What if you are ranting here and using what dr. Terry Warner has defined as "self justifying images?" Is it possible that, if you, me, your boss and coworkers were sitting together and could take about this, we would ear a dramatically different story?

I wish I was able to help you in person. My fear is you are bringing us, your cyber friends, into a collusion. We all do this. So please don't misunderstand... EVERYONE OF US thinks we seldom are the root cause of problems we have, right? I mean, hey, none of us could possibly be the reason for our failed relationships, with our siblings, children or spouse... Right?

This is the wrong forum, to work through this with you. Here is my offer. I travel and am responsible for HR or my company for several western states. I'll PM you and you can call me if you wanna take me up on my offer to coach or counsel you.

Too often, we are the root cause of our own failings and shortcomings. I'm not saying you are to blame here, but as someone who does this for a living, often he culprit is tearing at us in the mirror. I don't prescribe any pills, not that type of doctor, but metaphorically, I can help people with coaching pills, so we can grow elbows and point back to ourselves, if that makes any sense. My first recommendation is order the book, "Leadership and self deception," by he Arbinger Institute. Here is some back ground or context to what I suspect are your self justifying images in the work place:

Freud noticed that people are often blind to their actual motivations and fail to understand their influence on others. Alone this is an interesting observation. But there was more. He noticed that this blindness seemed willful or strategic. That is, to an outside observer, it appeared that people systematically created their own obstacles to well- being—without knowing they were creating them—and then resisted any attempts to overcome those obstacles.
But this creates a paradox. How can one who is blind to the trouble he has created see and resist so perfectly any attempts to correct that trouble? As one of Freud’s critics noted, wouldn’t we have to know the truth very exactly in order to hide it from ourselves so carefully? Modern psychology began as an attempt to explain this paradox, a paradox that has become known as “self-deception.”
The personal and organizational implications of this issue are immense. Recognizing this, for over a hundred years scholars working at the deepest levels of the human sciences have attempted to explain the paradox. Meanwhile, most of the popular psychological debate has continued forward, with the participants and the public unaware that everything being debated has a problem at its very core.
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Old 01-12-2013, 10:00   #178
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Quote:
Originally Posted by engineer151515 View Post
Classic Sun Tzu.
In today's society you have to learn to play games and most of us "men" don't like games. So being sneaky and devious has to be gleaned.
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Old 01-12-2013, 10:00   #179
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Oops, some typos in there.... Sorry, lots happening... I'll PM you in a bit, OP.
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Old 01-12-2013, 13:05   #180
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glock20 10mm View Post
... "There have been some complaints that you are intimidating people by your presence."

... It appears that I am too masculine for where I work and that because I carry myself with confidence (I am not a small man, nor excessively large, 6'3" @ 215lbs) people are intimidated by me. I am polite and cordial when speaking to people. But apparently because I walk with my head up high, I look people in the eye when I speak to them and I speak with confidence and a deep solid resonating voice (what my woman tells me) I am intimidating and I have to "tone it down".
I don't know you, or have had the pleasure of meeting you, but I've thought about some of your comments.

First of all, consider that more than 95% of our daily personal communication occurs via body language. For good or ill, this is where people get much of their info about someone when meeting with them in person.

This is also where perception (and culture) may differ quite a bit between the message content we think we're giving out, versus what everyone else may be seeing.

Did your boss actually state that you were "too masculine"? Or, is that just your interpretation & spin on it? Seriously.

Do you think other people are intimidated by your physical size & presence? Is that something you pride yourself in producing in other people at some level?

Serious questions, and not being critical or judgmental. Just wondering what you think you're projecting, especially when you seem to take a certain pride in your demeanor, carriage and manner of speaking.

Okay, then this comment ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glock20 10mm View Post
I had a very difficult time keeping my cool at this point of the conversation.
Sorry, but if this wording is accurate regarding your reaction, are you that easily antagonized or provoked? Do you share some responsibility in how someone may have reacted to your demeanor?

How we'd like others to see us ... How we're actually seen by others ... How we really are ... These are things that may, or may not, be the same or have some overlap.

I've never met you, but I could offer that your written words in some threads on this forum may have created an impression among other members which you might not expect, nor wish. And that's without having your actual physical presence, body language and demeanor added to the mix.

I also agree with Bill Lumberg's comments, though. If you want to interact and effectively communicate with people in society, you have to take into consideration the context and nature of any social & professional groupings. Give some consideration to exactly how you wish to be perceived, if you really want to effectively communicate and whether your mien and body language are working to your benefit, or detriment.

FWIW, unfortunately, this seems to be a lesson not always quickly or easily learned by men until they reach their 40's. Lots of chances for resulting problems and disadvantage in our 20's & 30's, though.

Does your daily presence and manner make someone want to meet and know you, and feel comfortable around you, or make them reluctant to be around you? What do you want to project, and to whom do you want to project it?

Just some thoughts.
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Old 01-12-2013, 13:56   #181
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Having been in management for a long time, let me give you a slightly different point of view than most prior posts that I've read.

First, be thankful your boss had the guts to lay things out for you regarding a negative performance area. Many managers/supervisors do their best to minimize or avoid negative performance discussions, especially with competent, confident subordinates, because its uncomfortable for them.

Second, I've never known anyone who has intimidated co-workers because of posture, presence, confidence, competence or positive demeanor unless there are some other characteristics in the mix that offset the positive attributes. Things like over confidence, presence that reflects a bit of arrogance or know-it-all attitude, a propensity to criticize the work of others, etc. In fact, your characteristics, as you describe them, generally attract people rather than repel them; colleagues usually admire leadership qualities when presented in positive way.

I recommend that you have another session with the boss or anyone else in the organization that you trust, to get some specifics about why some see you in a negative light. How many people complained? What specifically did they complain about? This is a permanent performance record, so you are entitled to know what behavior caused the problem; how else can you correct your demeanor around colleagues? If the 'facts' are thin, or can be shown to be questionable, the appraisal should be corrected or modified to dilute the negative remarks. The people who felt intimidated might be the ones with a personality issue.

Your research might reveal that you come on too 'strong' and/or your choice of phrases ("...someone wets their pants in my presence...") and vocabulary ("wimpification classes") might be offensive to 'civilians', in which case it would be appropriate (smart) to modify those behaviors. Or, maybe you should be working in a different environment where being a smart ass is acceptable.

Congratulations on being willing to do some introspective analysis, if in fact you are. Good luck in sorting out what might improve your peer relationships; they are important to career success.

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Old 01-12-2013, 14:40   #182
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Are you seeing yourself as you really are? You may be an arse hole and not know it.
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Old 01-12-2013, 15:39   #183
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I feel for you.

Last May a female coworker filed a sexual harrassment complaint about me. The end result was a 60 day probation period and I had to review a online video.

Here was the situation.

Me and two coworkers were heading down the elevator to a meeting.

I asked one of them what she was doing over the weekend? She and her husband planned on attending a Memorial Day party. I had heard radio advertisements for this over the past several weeks.

The other woman I know is single so I said "Hey, you should check it out might be a lot of nice guys to meet there?"

This is is. This is the entire conversation which took place.

I nearly lost my job. To this day, I don't know if how she was offended? Is she possibly gay? She and I have bantered back and forth over the past seven years; I know she is a partier - at least she says she and friends are constantly going on cruises, trips to Mexico/Florida, etc. She even joked a recent convertible she bought was "just to pick up men."

I haven't said a word to her since in fear of my job. At any time she could 1) complain a second time and it will cost me my job 2) Not that I would care, but she could harrass me and I can't file a complaint since it appears to be a retaliation.

In short, I'm screwed.

Trust me. There are stupid people everywhere.
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Old 01-12-2013, 15:45   #184
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gjk5 View Post
this thread made me LOL.


so much raw masculinity in GNG.......
I think my bench went up seventy-five pounds just from reading this thread.

I once got complaints about being a sexual harasser, all I would do was leave pictures of myself naked lying around everywhere at work. They couldn't handle my alpha maleness.
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Old 01-12-2013, 15:54   #185
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glock20 10mm View Post
So Monday I had a meeting with my boss (we have one every week or two to touch base and see where projects are going and what's coming up and so forth) and I get the normal "you're doing a great job!", "I am pleased with the data accuracy..." and so forth. Great! I am doing above and beyond and holding high standards for my job.

Then I get this bomb dropped on me... "There have been some complaints that you are intimidating people by your presence."

What did you just say boss? It appears that I am too masculine for where I work and that because I carry myself with confidence (I am not a small man, nor excessively large, 6'3" @ 215lbs) people are intimidated by me. I am polite and cordial when speaking to people. But apparently because I walk with my head up high, I look people in the eye when I speak to them and I speak with confidence and a deep solid resonating voice (what my woman tells me) I am intimidating and I have to "tone it down".

I had a very difficult time keeping my cool at this point of the conversation. But I made my point clear, I was raised in a Marine family with Marine discipline and pride. I was raised to be proud of who and what I am and to be confident in my abilities in life. I was raised to speak with pride and to be heard clearly and to not be ashamed of my ability to speak clearly. I then served 14 years before being medically separated, in the Navy and further solidified my confidence and pride.

I will not change who I am just because someone wets their pants at my presence. I was clear that this was out of line and that if this came up again I would pursue legal action. My boss pretty much agrees with me, but he has to tell me what's going on. Anyhow the conversation continued and apparently they have wimpification classes... and I have been signed up for a couple. I am not happy about it at all.

Yes, I still have my job. My superiors all know who I am and know I am a good man with solid conviction and I get the job done, on time and correct. But with this new bit of info I will be stepping up my search for a new job. But I ask myself... will it be any better anywhere else I go?
The way you described yourself made me wet my pants. Mmmhhh.
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Old 01-12-2013, 16:16   #186
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Are you seeing yourself as you really are? You may be an arse hole and not know it.
That can happen to the best of us sometimes.
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Old 01-12-2013, 16:19   #187
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I once didn't get a job because my raging boner knocked everything off the interviewer's desk.

Sucks being so masculine.
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Old 01-12-2013, 16:19   #188
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Originally Posted by s&wfan View Post
I think my bench went up seventy-five pounds just from reading this thread.

I once got complaints about being a sexual harasser, all I would do was leave pictures of myself naked lying around everywhere at work. They couldn't handle my alpha maleness.
John, I thought you passed away. Posting pictures of yourself around when you are such a star Mr Holmes may be deemed inappropriate in some places and not in the locker room. Your post is hilarious.
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Old 01-12-2013, 16:39   #189
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Originally Posted by NeverMore1701 View Post
I once didn't get a job because my raging boner knocked everything off the interviewer's desk.

Sucks being so masculine.
Knowing you, you couldn't help it because the interviewer was a guy..
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Old 01-12-2013, 19:37   #190
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Same thing happened to me at my work. I was told, I was intimidating because of the way I walk. I said what do you mean? He said I walk with too much purpose, WTF???? Idiot!!
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Old 01-12-2013, 19:45   #191
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I got written up because of my pheremones, they were causing all the wimmens to swoon
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Old 01-12-2013, 19:58   #192
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Sounds like your boss suffers from emasculation.


Here's some current editorializing regarding the subject;


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nr9Gg...tailpage#t=10s
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Old 01-12-2013, 20:19   #193
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JuneyBooney View Post
In today's society you have to learn to play games and most of us "men" don't like games. So being sneaky and devious has to be gleaned.
Sometimes, as you know, the fight is forced upon you.

The best you can do is fight well.
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Old 01-12-2013, 21:37   #194
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"...Then I get this bomb dropped on me... "There have been some complaints that you are intimidating people by your presence."
.
Is it possible that your boss was talking about "presents"?
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Old 01-12-2013, 22:07   #195
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Sounds like you work around a bunch of gays! They can't stand it when some one like you is so confident in there sexuality! You got to be more femine! Get in touch with your female side! It's all part of the Metrosexual set and working at a Uni they exspect it out of you! Go have fun in the class showing them how real men act they should have seizers! Be yourself -****em!
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Old 01-12-2013, 22:16   #196
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Borrow some of your wife's jewelry and buy a man purse. Wear it to work and then you will be OK.
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Old 01-13-2013, 01:16   #197
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Borrow some of your wife's jewelry and buy a man purse. Wear it to work and then you will be OK.
A real flowered shirt and maybe a pink dress will make him less masculine. I was told once that men have to almost act gay and I said well..you can act gay but not me. This entire country has gone ass backwards.
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Old 01-13-2013, 02:22   #198
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Old 01-13-2013, 02:51   #199
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Originally Posted by pugman View Post
I feel for you.

Last May a female coworker filed a sexual harrassment complaint about me. The end result was a 60 day probation period and I had to review a online video.

Here was the situation.

Me and two coworkers were heading down the elevator to a meeting.

I asked one of them what she was doing over the weekend? She and her husband planned on attending a Memorial Day party. I had heard radio advertisements for this over the past several weeks.

The other woman I know is single so I said "Hey, you should check it out might be a lot of nice guys to meet there?"

This is is. This is the entire conversation which took place.

I nearly lost my job. To this day, I don't know if how she was offended? Is she possibly gay? She and I have bantered back and forth over the past seven years; I know she is a partier - at least she says she and friends are constantly going on cruises, trips to Mexico/Florida, etc. She even joked a recent convertible she bought was "just to pick up men."

I haven't said a word to her since in fear of my job. At any time she could 1) complain a second time and it will cost me my job 2) Not that I would care, but she could harrass me and I can't file a complaint since it appears to be a retaliation.

In short, I'm screwed.

Trust me. There are stupid people everywhere.
I am sorry, but by saying what you did, you pointed out the fact that your co-worker was single, and she should try to meet a nice guy to be paired off... I think it's quite inappropriate. Put yourself in her shoes, how would you feel? And, if you excuse my bluntness, you did something that gained you absolutely nothing, and probably will cost you your job, where is the stupidity?

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Old 01-13-2013, 03:02   #200
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I didn't read all the responses in the thread, but there were quite a few good ones... Look, you can carry on as you always do, and have people perceive you as an a**hole. Or you can examine your behavior, and see if there something innate you can change, to get along with your co-workers better. You are not going to change how other people see you if you don't make any adjustments. If you value how others perceive you at work, you should at least look inwardly, to see if the points your boss brought up are valid. Your prerogative, your call...
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