GlockTalk.com
Home Forums Classifieds Blogs Today's Posts Search Social Groups



  
SIGN-UP
Notices

Glock Talk
Welcome To The Glock Talk Forums.
Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-18-2012, 17:48   #1
mrmike7189
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 22
Glock 26 vs. Kahr PM9?

I have a glock 26 that i carry in a bianchi leather belt slide holster and i love it...but its too big to carry IWB or pocket .
So i looked at the PM9 the other day. it is smaller than the Glock, by a little, not much, it weighs less, because it only holds 6 rounds of 9mm, it looks like a copy of my G26.
The kahr arms co. says it needs a 200 round break in period, plus it costs 700 bucks!!!!!!!!!!!Ouch.....I think i paid 500 bucks for my glock 26.... i'm keeping the Glock!
mrmike7189 is offline  
Old 12-18-2012, 18:01   #2
JBP55
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 7,943
The PM/CM9 Kahr is much smaller and much thinner than a G26 and the CM9 is about $400.
I have owned a few Kahr's and currently own several and never had any break in issues with them. I am not getting rid of my Glocks either.
JBP55 is offline  
Old 12-18-2012, 18:18   #3
cciman
Senior Member
 
cciman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: SW Ohio
Posts: 2,299
6 or 10, make your personal choice. You cannot have both size and capacity.
cciman is offline  
Old 12-18-2012, 18:32   #4
HOTHEAD
Senior Member
 
HOTHEAD's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 993
I would say the pm/cm carry like ½ the glock. There is a considerable difference.
HOTHEAD is offline  
Old 12-18-2012, 18:35   #5
SDGlock23
Glockoholic
 
SDGlock23's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Land of Forgetfulness
Posts: 7,504
Definite size difference. It's about the same height as the G26, but it's thinner, and shorter back to front and lighter. The CM9 is the same pistol, more or less, for $375 and fits into my jean pockets easily.

Break in period is nonsense too. Clean it, lube it and quickly hand rack the slide a few hundred times to loosen up the factory tightness a bit and you're good to go.
__________________
"Condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance."

Last edited by SDGlock23; 12-18-2012 at 18:38..
SDGlock23 is offline  
Old 12-18-2012, 20:35   #6
LampShadeActual
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 226
Mike,

I have a M26 that I shoot well and like, but it is a chunky monkey in my pocket. So I usually end up with my S&W M&P340 .357 in a pocket for light clothing use.

Last late winter I decided to get a Kahr CW9. I worked on it, had it fixed, tried this and that, and finally gave up when it started flexing its plastic frame and dropping magazines.

Too much waste to repeat the typing, but if you go to this URL you will get the flavor. It was like a KelTec. A kit gun that the owner had to finish for any hope of correct function. The frame flexing and dropping mags was the final end.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/t_5_35/12...ent_there.html

I don't doubt that the metal frame ones were somewhat better, but the plastic framed ones are stinkers.

I got tired of writing it up at the ar15.com forum, but after that thread stops, the gun started dropping its mags. Kahr sent me a new spring and a new mag catch and a couple other little parts. It did it anyhow.

I took the slide off. I stripped a mag down to the empty tube. That way you could see what was going on with the catch and mag looking down the top. If the mag body turned one way, the catch went through inside of the tube. If the mag body turned the other way in the frame, the catch tip hung on about half the thickness of the mag wall. When it fired and flexed, there was so little engagement, good by magazine, sometimes.

The ammo for testing cost more than the gun. And it was never trustable. The Kahr just got thrown into the GD mistake pile and is useless since I would never trust it even after having it fixed yet again.

Gaston rules. Or at least my Smith Scandium .357. On either I would bet my axx.

Last edited by LampShadeActual; 12-18-2012 at 20:51..
LampShadeActual is offline  
Old 12-18-2012, 21:02   #7
Dooger
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: MI
Posts: 267
I have both and the PM9 is much easier to conceal and less weight. It's a different gun altogether though...
Dooger is offline  
Old 12-18-2012, 22:18   #8
High Altitude
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Tennessee
Posts: 2,056
I had a CW9.

Never had any issues with it, but could never get use to the trigger. I did not like the long reset. I constantly short stroked it.

Replaced it with a M&P Shield. It's a keeper.
High Altitude is offline  
Old 12-18-2012, 22:34   #9
Patchman
Florist
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Land of Flora, Fauna & Merriweather
Posts: 11,598
I'd have to also agree the Kahr's thiness makes a considerable difference.
__________________
Sounds like he has nothing left but be a monkey's uncle. It's not like he's got a monkey's manhood left.

And thank YOU for being perfect, all the time, every time. Go forth and reproduce. We need more of you.
Patchman is offline  
Old 12-18-2012, 22:42   #10
ksmedman
Senior Member
 
ksmedman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: In the middle
Posts: 290
I have a CM9, it is considerably smaller than a G26/27. It's a pocket gun for me. Carrying it IWB is almost a joke.
It holds 6+1 with standard mags. I carry an 8 rounder for reload. I do use a pinkie extension on my 6 rounder, I don't like the dangling pinkie. Though I guess I should get used to it.

It's smaller than a J-frame, and 7 x 9mm > 5 x 38spl. I do have and carry an Airweight sometimes though, not bashing them. It has been every bit as reliable as my Smith, or my Glock for that matter.

It's accurate, easy to shoot, and has surprisingly manageable recoil in a gun basically the size of most 380's. Decent trigger, too.
I put Talon grips on mine (my wife has them on her CW9 also). It doesn't really add any bulk, but stops the gun from slipping around if your hands get sweaty/wet, etc...

They are great little guns, they do a great job filling a needed niche - pocket gun in full size caliber.

Last edited by ksmedman; 12-18-2012 at 22:45..
ksmedman is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 05:50   #11
Big Bird
NRA Life Member
 
Big Bird's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 10,054
I own three Kahr pistols and have never had an issue with them I currently own a PM9 a P40 and a CW9. The PM9 is the oldest and has more than 1500 rounds through it. Never a hiccup even when new.

I bought the P40 from a guy who didn't trust the gun because the slide started locking back on him. He said it shot great at first but after a few range sessions the slide would lock back and wouldn't stay open on an empty magazine. I showed him how he bent the slide lock spring probably during an improper reassembly. But he wanted nothing to do with it and I got it for a song. Ordered a new spring from Kahr for $6 and the thing has run like a champ ever since. Bought the new CW9 last week from a guy who said it wouldn't run for him. I've got 300 rounds of WWB, Win HST and some Ranger T +P through it and its been perfect.

Small semi-auto handguns require perfect technique to run reliably. Your grip is important and its REALLY easy to screw up with the things as they run on the edge of reliability as it is. Thats just the nature of the ultra compact autos. I'm firmly convinced tha a lot of people--even really experienced people--simply cannot run these guns. And that's understandable and not a dig on those folks at all. But they work for me and I've taken "unreliable" Kahr's off people's hands who had problems and have run the snot out of them without a hiccup. But for the life of me I can't get a SIG 238 to run worth a crap? Who knows.

I bought a used G19 that had issues with the mag release, slide locking back etc. It was a combination of really worn magazines and a worn mag catch. Glock fixed both and the gun runs great since.
__________________
Big Bird,

“Est Nulla Via Invia Virute”
Big Bird is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 06:08   #12
cowboywannabe
you savvy?
 
cowboywannabe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: on a planet near you
Posts: 20,582
two different birds.
__________________
with Sarah Jane, Leela, Romana, Nyssa, and Tegan.

Facts are no match against enthusiasm and ignorance...
cowboywannabe is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 06:21   #13
LampShadeActual
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 226
Small semi-auto handguns require perfect technique to run reliably. Your grip is important and its REALLY easy to screw up with the things as they run on the edge of reliability as it is. Thats just the nature of the ultra compact autos. I'm firmly convinced tha a lot of people--even really experienced people--simply cannot run these guns. And that's understandable and not a dig on those folks at all.

While I understand your point and don't really wish to argue it, I don't agree. My experience with the CW9 was that it was well designed and poorly made/finished/fitted. The spring systems were marginal for the trigger return and hold open. The design of the trigger curve itself was poor.

If you read the series in the AR15 forum noted above, I worked through an endless collection of little shiest that made it run. The death sentence was when I realized why it occasionally dropped it magazines.

The frame magazine well was simply too big for the magazines. This is a mould casting of plastic and every one they made is the same. A sloppy fit. The sloppy fit on one hand lets the mag catch disengage if the mag is turned one way. The same sloppy fit on the other hand lets the mag catch go too deep into the mag well and catch the follower coming up when the mag turns the other way.

This is the reason for the endless failures to feed between rounds 4-3 and 3-2 left in the magazine. The remedy of course was to remove plastic from the front right corner of the followers. Really smart system.

While you could file away enough follower to make it work twisting one way, the elephant in the room was always having it twist the other way and losing your mag. They rarely dropped out. They just dropped down and the catch grabbed the outside of the mag body. Then you thought you were dumb enough to push the release.

I liked the damn CW9 in general, but it was not up to keeping my axx alive. Not ready for prime time.

Last edited by LampShadeActual; 12-19-2012 at 06:23..
LampShadeActual is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 06:25   #14
Bob Hafler
Senior Member
 
Bob Hafler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,205
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmike7189 View Post
So i looked at the PM9 the other day. it is smaller than the Glock, by a little, not much, it weighs less, because it only holds 6 rounds of 9mm, it looks like a copy of my G26.
The kahr arms co. says it needs a 200 round break in period, plus it costs 700 bucks!!!!!!!!!!!Ouch.....I think i paid 500 bucks for my glock 26.... i'm keeping the Glock!
You my friend need to get a grip on reality. The PM/CM 9 is much smaller than a glock 26. I own both and trust me it is. The CM 9 can be had for about $100 less than a Glock 26. How you can possibly say it looks like a copy of a glock is totally beyound me. Try this. Place a PM/CM 9 on top of a glock 26, then place it on top of a XD9sc and then tell me how much it looks like a copy of a Glock. I understand you like your Glock as most fanboys do,but for the love semi auto pistols lets at least try to keep things some what real. You are talking about two completely different guns that have different uses. Other than the PM9 having a polygonal barrel and having black poly frame there is nothing about it that resembles a glock ergo or mechanical wise.
Bob Hafler is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 07:02   #15
drewski1325
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Ohio
Posts: 8
I love my PM9. It goes every where with me.....because it can. I can't say that about my G27. The 27 is a good gun but the PM is so light and small compared to the 27. Visually you can tell the PM is smaller and to some it may not look "that much smaller" but when you are carrying it is a huge difference.
drewski1325 is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 10:37   #16
Big Bird
NRA Life Member
 
Big Bird's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 10,054
Quote:
Originally Posted by LampShadeActual View Post
Small semi-auto handguns require perfect technique to run reliably. Your grip is important and its REALLY easy to screw up with the things as they run on the edge of reliability as it is. Thats just the nature of the ultra compact autos. I'm firmly convinced tha a lot of people--even really experienced people--simply cannot run these guns. And that's understandable and not a dig on those folks at all.

While I understand your point and don't really wish to argue it, I don't agree. My experience with the CW9 was that it was well designed and poorly made/finished/fitted. The spring systems were marginal for the trigger return and hold open. The design of the trigger curve itself was poor.

If you read the series in the AR15 forum noted above, I worked through an endless collection of little shiest that made it run. The death sentence was when I realized why it occasionally dropped it magazines.

The frame magazine well was simply too big for the magazines. This is a mould casting of plastic and every one they made is the same. A sloppy fit. The sloppy fit on one hand lets the mag catch disengage if the mag is turned one way. The same sloppy fit on the other hand lets the mag catch go too deep into the mag well and catch the follower coming up when the mag turns the other way.

This is the reason for the endless failures to feed between rounds 4-3 and 3-2 left in the magazine. The remedy of course was to remove plastic from the front right corner of the followers. Really smart system.

While you could file away enough follower to make it work twisting one way, the elephant in the room was always having it twist the other way and losing your mag. They rarely dropped out. They just dropped down and the catch grabbed the outside of the mag body. Then you thought you were dumb enough to push the release.

I liked the damn CW9 in general, but it was not up to keeping my axx alive. Not ready for prime time.
Well, obviously they all aren't made the same way or cast from the same mold. If they were mine would have the same problems as yours and clearly it doesn't. So my experience is 180 degrees different than yours.

I'm not saying every malfunction or problem with these small guns is a shooter problem. But I am saying a lot of them are!

Clearly...YMMV
__________________
Big Bird,

“Est Nulla Via Invia Virute”
Big Bird is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 11:36   #17
JBP55
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 7,943
Lampshade, the Kahr pistols work for most shooters.
JBP55 is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 11:49   #18
LAWDOGKMS
Senior Member
 
LAWDOGKMS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: TX
Posts: 2,227
When it's a last-ditch-save-my-ass weapon, I think the Glock is the only auto that is as close to 100% reliable as an auto can be...but if I have to go "light"...I trust my 340 PD completely..

I have just read way too many reports of problems with Keltecs, Kahr's, Diamondback's etc...to ever completely trust them to always go bang and cycle like they're supposed to..
LAWDOGKMS is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 15:59   #19
Big Bird
NRA Life Member
 
Big Bird's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 10,054
Quote:
Originally Posted by LAWDOGKMS View Post
When it's a last-ditch-save-my-ass weapon, I think the Glock is the only auto that is as close to 100% reliable as an auto can be...but if I have to go "light"...I trust my 340 PD completely..

I have just read way too many reports of problems with Keltecs, Kahr's, Diamondback's etc...to ever completely trust them to always go bang and cycle like they're supposed to..
Hang out In General Glocking long enough...there are normally a couple of posts a day about Glocks that malfunction.

They are machines made out of imperfect material, by flawed people, using flawed machines. All gun companies will produce a lemon.
__________________
Big Bird,

“Est Nulla Via Invia Virute”
Big Bird is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 17:02   #20
steven07
Senior Member
 
steven07's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 264
I have several glocks but my PM40 is my carry gun. I lucked out & found one used but in great condition for $500. Size was a big factor in my choice & it carrys great in my talon iwb.
steven07 is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 17:44   #21
LampShadeActual
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 226
JBP55,

I hear that often enough. I actually believe the steel framed ones work. The plastic framed CW9 did not and had issue after issue.

The last time I fired it, my daughter actually, the mag dropped yet again and she cleared it handing it back to me saying it was unsatisfactory as a purse gun since she couldn't even depend on it in slow fire practice.

She simply bought a M19.

I believe in what The Cowboy said when he was president: Trust, but verify.

I verify that my Glocks work every time I take them out to shoot. Likewise my M&P340.

No Glock has ever dropped a magazine on me in 20 years of using them. They gobble up my handloads with JHP or FMJ 124s like Halloween candy and spit out the brass. They shoot to their sights every time. Maybe a little chunky, but I'll trade that for always working.

Last edited by LampShadeActual; 12-19-2012 at 17:45..
LampShadeActual is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 19:11   #22
NailShooter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: ...EXACTLY 16" on center
Posts: 1,905
Quote:
Originally Posted by LampShadeActual View Post
JBP55,

....No Glock has ever dropped a magazine on me in 20 years of using them. They gobble up my handloads with JHP or FMJ 124s like Halloween candy and spit out the brass. They shoot to their sights every time. Maybe a little chunky, but I'll trade that for always working.

Pretty good summation by Lamp. Wish somebody had told me 3+ yrs ago that a G26/27 was "too big to pocket carry" otherwise I wouldn't have done it (comfortably) everyday. Regards,

Nail
__________________
Always remember, the 2nd Amendment has nothing to do with hunting or sports.
NailShooter is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 19:17   #23
dkf
Senior Member
 
dkf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,315
PM9 vs G26

General Glocking
dkf is online now  
Old 12-19-2012, 19:39   #24
rppnj
Senior Member
 
rppnj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 527
I've never had ANY issues with my G19 or G26. Glocks always go 'bang' when you pull the trigger! However, my Kahr PM9 had to be returned to Kahr twice for repair. Kahr had to 1.) replace the barrel (peening issue) and 2.) Smoothe out the action. When I 'racked' the slide, the action was 'sticking'. You could feel metal on metal. Note that this was after the 200 round 'break-in' period. I do have to give credit to Kahr Customer Service. They were very accommodating and repaired the gun quickly at 'no charge'. The gun is like new, the barrel looks good and the action is smooth but I really don't shoot the PM9 anymore.
__________________
'Life is tough...it's even tougher if you're stupid!'
-John Wayne

'Integrity is who you are and what you do when no one is watching.'
-rppnj
rppnj is offline  
Old 12-19-2012, 20:16   #25
Rolo19
Registered User
 
Rolo19's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 4
I do love my PM9 I've had it going on 6 years now. I always carry it on me. But I don't mind carrying my 19 I have a holster that was made for the 26 in the pant and I take it with a lot more now a days. In the time I have owned my Kahr I have never had any issues and I have a few hundred rounds in it. As far as customer issues I believe the cheaper Kahr has had a few problems but just like anything man made can fail. That's why there are warranties.


Sent from my iPhone 5 using Tapatalk
Rolo19 is offline  
Closed Thread

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 22:40.



Homepage
FAQ
Forums
Calendar
Advertise
Gallery
GT Wiki
GT Blogs
Social Groups
Classifieds


Users Currently Online: 1,168
317 Members
851 Guests

Most users ever online: 2,244
Nov 11, 2013 at 11:42