The Fiscal Cliff....

slick64 · 12-08-2012, 09:27

I think the GOP should hold out, and EVERYONE pays. Seems like that'll help bring in some revenue to reduce the deficit.

The tax code needs to be reformed in its entirety, maybe that will be the emphasis to make it so.

I don't hear anyone complaining about raising the debt celiling......when will that end?

***FullClip*** · 12-08-2012, 09:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by slick64

I think the GOP should hold out, and EVERYONE pays.......

The sad part is that EVERYONE won't see a tax increase after the "fiscal cliff". Only thpse paying taxes will see a hike in their taxes.

The majority of the Obumer supporters won't notice a thing...their EBT cards will be still have the same amount of credit every month....

slick64 · 12-08-2012, 09:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by FullClip

The sad part is that EVERYONE won't see a tax increase after the "fiscal cliff". Only thpse paying taxes will see a hike in their taxes.

The majority of the Obumer supporters won't notice a thing...their EBT cards will be still have the same amount of credit every month....

Sad, and most likely you are correct.

sheriff733 · 12-08-2012, 10:02

I hope they hold out and we go over the cliff.

That's one way to deal with the out of control spending. Hate that it has had to come to that, but I think that's what it'll take to come to a sane solution.

snubfan · 12-08-2012, 10:05

We need to scrap the income tax all together and move to a consumption tax........

***FullClip*** · 12-08-2012, 10:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by sheriff733

......That's one way to deal with the out of control spending...........

Obumer's, Reid's and Pelosi's solution to deal with out of control spending is to start out of control taxing. they will blame the "rich" (taxpayers) for the lack of funds for the "poor" (Obama Voters)

sheriff733 · 12-08-2012, 10:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by FullClip

Obumer's, Reid's and Pelosi's solution to deal with out of control spending is to start out of control taxing. they will blame the "rich" (taxpayers) for the lack of funds for the "poor" (Obama Voters)

They will blame the "rich" for anything humanly possible anyways.

Screw it. Take this insanity train on over the cliff.

***FullClip*** · 12-08-2012, 10:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by snubfan

We need to scrap the income tax all together and move to a consumption tax........

Don't worry....the consumption tax, like the European VAT tax will come within the next 4 years. The income tax won't go away...and will be increased as required for the Democrats to buy the votes needed to keep them in power.

After working in Europe for the past 12 years, I can see the way we are headed in the USA.

kswiss · 12-08-2012, 10:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by snubfan

We need to scrap the income tax all together and move to a consumption tax........

care to elaborate what you mean by a "consumption tax"?

Jonesee · 12-08-2012, 10:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by sheriff733

They will blame the "rich" for anything humanly possible anyways.

Screw it. Take this insanity train on over the cliff.

Do you have any idea how much that will increase my, and possibly your taxes?

Almost any settlement is better for me than the cliff.

sheriff733 · 12-08-2012, 10:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonesee

Do you have any idea how much that will increase my taxes?

Almost any settlement is better for me that the cliff.

Do you have any idea how much it'll increase mine?

I'd be willing to pay more taxes on the condition that spending is cut and the deficit is reduced. I love what this country used to stand for and am willing to personally sacrifice to see it get back to that.

Not all see it like me though.

hammerkill · 12-08-2012, 10:40

We are going to collapse, it is inevitable It will be ugly so live it up now.

snubfan · 12-08-2012, 10:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by kswiss

care to elaborate what you mean by a "consumption tax"?

http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServ...owFairTaxWorks

Basically, don't tax me on what I bring in, tax my spending.

.

Jonesee · 12-08-2012, 10:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by kswiss

care to elaborate what you mean by a "consumption tax"?

A consumption tax is any tax that is collected on a good that is produced and sold.

Sales taxes and in Europe, Value Added Taxes (VAT) are consumption taxes.

They are considered regressive because poorer income earners pay a higher percentage of their income on goods (very close to 100%). High earners pay for more goods and thus more taxes, but have a higher percentage of their income that is discretionary and not used for purchase of goods so it remains tax free.

The tax base can be evened up some by assessing excise taxes (another consumption tax) to luxury goods. You end up with a very high tax premium on goods not typically purchased by the middle class and below.

Not taking sides, just answering the question...

sheriff733 · 12-08-2012, 10:49

Personally, I'm a fan of the flat tax.

Everyone pay 20%, for example, with no deductions and no loopholes.

ETA: That's only contingent upon drastically cutting spending/entitlements.

Jonesee · 12-08-2012, 10:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by sheriff733

Do you have any idea how much it'll increase mine?

I'd be willing to pay more taxes on the condition that spending is cut and the deficit is reduced. I love what this country used to stand for and am willing to personally sacrifice to see it get back to that.

Not all see it like me though.

I reworded my post as you posted yours. I admit I don't know what your bite will be.

My wife and I are very blessed. The tax hit on us will be immediate and huge.

In the spirit of capitalism, I am only thinking about my own pocket. I don't need social security and government plans. (I believe there will be a means test and anyone who has successfully saved and invested for retirement will not be eligible for SS anyway) That is why I stand behind what I said, any settlement is likely to be better than the cliff.

sheriff733 · 12-08-2012, 10:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonesee

I reworded my post before you posted yours. I admit I don't know what your bite will be.

My wife and I are very blessed. The tax hit on us will be immediate and huge.

In the spirit of capitalism, I am only thinking about my own pocket. I don't need social security and government plans. That is why I stand behind what I said, any settlement is likely to be better than the cliff.

I'm not saying you're wrong, and I'm not saying that I think tax increases are the only option to fix the mess we are in. Your hit will most likely be larger than mine, but as I said, if Washington is serious (and I know, they're not) about fixing this mess, I personally will pay more taxes if their genuine interest is fixing the problem.

slick64 · 12-08-2012, 10:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by sheriff733

Personally, I'm a fan of the flat tax.

Everyone pay 20%, for example, with no deductions and no loopholes.

ETA: That's only contingent upon drastically cutting spending/entitlements.

That'll never happen....it makes too much sense and is fair.

What would the 47% do?

snubfan · 12-08-2012, 10:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonesee

A consumption tax is any tax that is collected on a good that is produced and sold.

Sales taxes and in Europe, Value Added Taxes (VAT) are consumption taxes.

They are considered regressive because poorer income earners pay a higher percentage of their income on goods (very close to 100%). High earners pay for more goods and thus more taxes, but have a higher percentage of their income that is discretionary and not used for purchase of goods so it remains tax free.

The tax base can be evened up some by assessing excise taxes (another consumption tax) to luxury goods. You end up with a very high tax premium on goods not typically purchased by the middle class and below.

Not taking sides, just answering the question...

The FairTax idea proposed in the U.S. is nothing like the European model. It's not an extra tax on top of all the others. All the others go away and the FairTax becomes the only national tax.

.

sheriff733 · 12-08-2012, 10:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by slick64

That'll never happen....it makes too much sense and is fair.

What would the 47% do?

Get a job and make their own liv....

I'm sorry. I couldn't even type that with a straight face.

sheriff733 · 12-08-2012, 10:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by snubfan

The FairTax idea proposed in the U.S. is nothing like the European model. It's not an extra tax on top of all the others. All the others go away and the FairTax becomes the only national tax.

This is what I would like to see and think is an awesome idea.

Fox184 · 12-08-2012, 10:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by sheriff733

I'm not saying you're wrong, and I'm not saying that I think tax increases are the only option to fix the mess we are in. Your hit will most likely be larger than mine, but as I said, if Washington is serious (and I know, they're not) about fixing this mess, I personally will pay more taxes if their genuine interest is fixing the problem.

It won't fix the problem though. They (our elected officials) will just want to spend more and more, while raising taxes.

My thinking is this country needs to financially collapse. We need tough times to get on the right path to go forward. We need to worry about how we will feed our families, not what greatest electronic to buy.

I am fed up with both demorats and republicans. The two party system is a sham and this is what we get.

***FullClip*** · 12-08-2012, 11:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonesee

The tax base can be evened up some by assessing excise taxes (another consumption tax) to luxury goods. You end up with a very high tax premium on goods not typically purchased by the middle class and below.

Not taking sides, just answering the question...

The "Luxury Tax" was tried a while back, and the fat cats said screw it, and bought their yachts abroad, or managed to do without a new one. Put a lot of boat builders out of work in Maine, plus a lot of other people who work to build other high end stuff throughout the country.

The low end, non-luxury stuff can be made in China. no taxes into the US economy from those jobs.

Another thing is 'who" will decide what defines a "luxury good" ?

The Democrat solution will be a "carbon tax". All you folks who drive a pick-up truck, get ready to get 'rear-ended" by Obumer and his supporters.

**janice6** · 12-08-2012, 11:11

I'm for going over the cliff and pushing Boehner over with us, only first. Get rid of the whiner and caputulator. If the liberals want taxes or nothing, give them nothing.

Any increased taxes will be used to increase the income of those that do not work, and to decrease the income of those that do. This is punishment for succeeding.

The intent of this administration is to take away from people that have, and spread it over those that do not. We have a government that wants everyone to have little rather than some to have more. Nothing is clearer.

Jonesee · 12-08-2012, 11:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by FullClip

The "Luxury Tax" was tried a while back, and the fat cats said screw it, and bought their yachts abroad, or managed to do without a new one. Put a lot of boat builders out of work in Maine, plus a lot of other people who work to build other high end stuff throughout the country.

The low end, non-luxury stuff can be made in China. no taxes into the US economy from those jobs.

Another thing is 'who" will decide what defines a "luxury good" ?

The Democrat solution will be a "carbon tax". All you folks who drive a pick-up truck, get ready to get 'rear-ended" by Obumer and his supporters.

read my disclaimer I did't say I supported it.

I think the fairtax has some merit. I don't think a congress that can't reach neutral ground on even the simplest of bills will be able to agree to a massive tax overhaul.