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Old 12-04-2012, 20:19   #161
eaglefrq
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clarkz71 View Post
I guess your one of those people that have not mastered
keeping your finger out of the trigger guard when handling
a Glock.

One of the basic rules of gun safety, don't touch the
trigger until ready to fire.

The cop in the third video, had his finger in the trigger guard. No doubt, a ND.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyparson View Post
So because he doesn't feel comfortable carrying a Glock you automatically assume he doesn't know how to safely handle a gun.

I know people that carry a 1911 in C3 because they don't feel comfortable carrying C1. They have been carrying like that for years and have never had a AD/ND.
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Old 12-04-2012, 20:22   #162
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So IDK if this is something that somehow happened in the low amount of rounds I put through it, or if it was defect from the factory. But I suggest that everyone with a newer g23 maybe check these two points out before you carry! I feel like an idiot for somehow not figuring this out on my own! :(:(
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Old 12-04-2012, 20:26   #163
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cglaspel View Post
...#1- Firing pin block spring was bent, not straight like it should have been!!!

#2 The "sear" is not engaging the lug on the firing pin assembly properly!!

He says that since both of these issues are there, that It is highly likely that the pistol fired from the "half cocked" position...
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Old 12-04-2012, 20:26   #164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cglaspel View Post
Hey again guys!

OK so due to the amount of questions and responses it is hard for me to respond to them all, so I apologize if I miss some of them! Also I have been at work all day so no way to post until now.

Anyways, SO took it to a SECOND Glock Armorer today, and thank goodness I did, I now have an answer,

#1- Firing pin block spring was bent, not straight like it should have been!!!

#2 The "sear" is not engaging the lug on the firing pin assembly properly!!

He says that since both of these issues are there, that It is highly likely that the pistol fired from the "half cocked" position. Obviously I am now having him ship this to GLOCK to correct this issue immediately. This is pretty ridiculous that a brand new pistol had these MAJOR defects. I am sure Glock will make it right though.

I have fired the pistol before and never had an issue with it, so IDK how this had not fired while in the holster before....I am just extremely thankful it didnt hurt myself or anyone else!!

Very thankful to a fellow poster here that told me to specifically have my armorer look at these parts closely!!
Well, as I said before, two major mechanical failures had to happen simultaneously for it to be the gun. I would have thought that was impossible from a reputable manufacturer. Maybe Glock isn't a reputable manufacturer anymore. I mean tolerance stacking on extractors and slides is one thing, but a gun with improper trigger bar/striker lug engagement AND a damaged striker safety plunger spring getting out the door is NON EXISTENT quality control.

I would sue them for damages, and make a lot of noise about this in the news media. Something has got to be done to get their attention.

So now we have to all get inspection slide cover plates to check the engagement, and fully strip every Glock before we dare load them?
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Old 12-04-2012, 20:33   #165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dhgeyer View Post
Well, as I said before, two major mechanical failures had to happen simultaneously for it to be the gun. I would have thought that was impossible from a reputable manufacturer. Maybe Glock isn't a reputable manufacturer anymore. I mean tolerance stacking on extractors and slides is one thing, but a gun with improper trigger bar/striker lug engagement AND a damaged striker safety plunger spring getting out the door is NON EXISTENT quality control.

I would sue them for damages, and make a lot of noise about this in the news media. Something has got to be done to get their attention.

So now we have to all get inspection slide cover plates to check the engagement, and fully strip every Glock before we dare load them?
I will definitely be talking to them tomorrow morning, this is beyond ridiculous. I have never had an issue remotely close to this, especially from Glock of all manufacturers.

Like I said, I am sure Glock will make it right. I am really hoping this is an isolated incident and isn't some major amount of defect Glock's that went off the line though!!

Yea this armor had to use a special slide plate to even discover this, the first armorer AFAIK did not do this. So I am glad another member here suggested this and that there is another local shop that has certified Glock armorers!
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Old 12-04-2012, 20:33   #166
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A second opinion? Defects suddenly found? A Glock Armorer having to send a gun back for these simple things? Insufficient trigger bar to firing pin tang engagement AND a firing pin safety block not sprung correctly?

More likely something else that did not actually happen. Or happened because some idjit took the gun apart and messed up reassembly.

If these things were actually wrong with the gun, I don't know any Glock armorers who would not have put a new spring and/or firing pin safety into the slide and a new trigger bar into the frame. It isn't rocket science. That's what armorers are for. To do some armorering. None of this story matches my experience with a real Glock armorer.

So did it go to a second armorer? Is the suddenly revealed damage to cover a finger in the trigger? Or cover some other fubar? Sounds like a road killed fish to me.

Last edited by LampShadeActual; 12-04-2012 at 20:38..
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Old 12-04-2012, 20:35   #167
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cglaspel View Post
Hey again guys!

Anyways, SO took it to a SECOND Glock Armorer today, and thank goodness I did, I now have an answer,

#1- Firing pin block spring was bent, not straight like it should have been!!!

#2 The "sear" is not engaging the lug on the firing pin assembly properly!!

He says that since both of these issues are there, that It is highly likely that the pistol fired from the "half cocked" position.

Very thankful to a fellow poster here that told me to specifically have my armorer look at these parts closely!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by NCHeel View Post
I would check the engagement of the cruciform with the firing pin lug. I don't see how dropping the gun on a table could pull a 5.5 pound trigger. It could cause the lug to disengage and on a new pistol with a stiff firing pin spring have enough force to strike the primer. This would only happen if the firing pin plunger was stuck though.
Don't know if you are referring to me for helping but I hope I did. I hit on this very early as the only plausible explanation I could think of.
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Old 12-04-2012, 20:43   #168
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sgt rock View Post
Expand your mind a little kid , If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck i can call it a damn sear .

OK, I can live with that. But it's a cruciform.

Quote:
Originally Posted by eaglefrq View Post
So because he doesn't feel comfortable carrying a Glock you automatically assume he doesn't know how to safely handle a gun..
I can't tell you how he feels, but no one should handle
a firearm that can't follow the most basic rules there are.

They apply to all firearms/rifles/shotguns/RPG's, Not just Glocks

1. The gun is always loaded
2. Don't touch the trigger until ready to fire
3. Don't point the gun at anything you don't want to shoot.



Quote:
Originally Posted by eaglefrq View Post
I know people that carry a 1911 in C3 because they don't feel comfortable carrying C1. They have been carrying like that for years and have never had a AD/ND.
The 1911 was meant to be carried cocked & locked.

The military wouldn't allow it so older shooters carry in 3
For CCW you may not have time to draw,
rack the slide and fire.

Much quicker to draw and click off the safty as you draw
then fire as you raise to target/BG

If anything I said here is wrong, please correct me, anyone.
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Last edited by clarkz71; 12-07-2012 at 20:18..
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Old 12-04-2012, 20:45   #169
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cglaspel View Post
I will definitely be talking to them tomorrow morning, this is beyond ridiculous. I have never had an issue remotely close to this, especially from Glock of all manufacturers.

Like I said, I am sure Glock will make it right. I am really hoping this is an isolated incident and isn't some major amount of defect Glock's that went off the line though!!

Yea this armor had to use a special slide plate to even discover this, the first armorer AFAIK did not do this. So I am glad another member here suggested this and that there is another local shop that has certified Glock armorers!
Your first guy was probably a gunsmith not a GLOCK armorer. The Orange inspection plate is not "special" it is something every GLOCK Armorer has. If you had brought the pistol to me with your story the first thing I would have done is install the inspection plate and check the amount of contact at the sear. Sounds like an isolated factory QC problem or someone did some smithing on this pistol before or after you received it. It has been my experience that NIB GLOCKs tend to have a lot of sear contact rather than not enough. The extra contact is what gives you the "wall" that takes a little extra pressure to fire the pistol that people refer to.
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Last edited by NCHeel; 12-04-2012 at 20:48..
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Old 12-04-2012, 20:47   #170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LampShadeActual View Post
A second opinion? Defects suddenly found? A Glock Armorer having to send a gun back for these simple things? Insufficient trigger bar to firing pin tang engagement AND a firing pin safety block not sprung correctly?

More likely something else that did not actually happen. Or happened because some idjit took the gun apart and messed up reassembly.

If these things were actually wrong with the gun, I don't know any Glock armorers who would not have put a new spring and/or firing pin safety into the slide and a new trigger bar into the frame. It isn't rocket science. That's what armorers are for. To do some armorering. None of this story matches my experience with a real Glock armorer.

So did it go to a second armorer? Is the suddenly revealed damage to cover a finger in the trigger? Or cover some other fubar? Sounds like a road killed fish to me.
Actually I am having it sent to Glock because I want them to see what the issue is...and about how ridiculous this is that it even went through to me! Way to try and speculate and make it sound like I did something wrong though. Obviously a Glock armorer could easily replace these parts, hence GLOCK ARMORER...

TRUST ME if I somehow managed to "Pull the trigger on my own" I most definitely wouldnt waste myself, and everyone elses time with this thread.
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Old 12-04-2012, 20:54   #171
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NCHeel View Post
Don't know if you are referring to me for helping but I hope I did. I hit on this very early as the only plausible explanation I could think of.
Good over the internet diagnoses. Spot on.
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Last edited by clarkz71; 12-04-2012 at 20:54..
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Old 12-04-2012, 20:56   #172
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NCHeel View Post
Your first guy was probably a gunsmith not a GLOCK armorer. The Orange inspection plate is not "special" it is something every GLOCK Armorer has. If you had brought the pistol to me with your story the first thing I would have done is install the inspection plate and check the amount of contact at the sear. Sounds like an isolated factory QC problem or someone did some smithing on this pistol before or after you received it. It has been my experience that NIB GLOCKs tend to have a lot of sear contact rather than not enough. The extra contact is what gives you the "wall" that takes a little extra pressure to fire the pistol that people refer to.
This is the exact reason I had someone else look at it. The armorer originally isn't a glock armorer I am thinking. I have used him before and trusted his opinion, as well as he claimed to be a glock armorer but I have never seen or heard of them being certified, which most certified shops tend to do.

Which is why I took it to a for sure Glock certified armorer this time. Also you were the one I was hinting about, along with one other.

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Old 12-04-2012, 21:07   #173
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Hate to ask a dumb question, but could anyone post some pics to help me understand exactly what/where the suspect parts y'all are referring to are? I am not very familiar with the internal workings of a Glock.

Last edited by Pwhfirefighter; 12-04-2012 at 21:08..
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Old 12-04-2012, 21:13   #174
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OP I sure hope that Glock will let you know what is wrong with your handgun. Please understand that some of the guys on here coming across as accusing you for the AD are probably feeling a little dejavu from previous threads were "the gun went off by itself" was stated.... later to find out that the trigger was pulled by the owner. Even if problem is fixed, do you plan on keeping a firearm that shoots on its own?

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Old 12-04-2012, 21:15   #175
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What I don't understand is why there are people on here who think that there is no possible way a mechanical object can fail. As well as why these same people are immediately saying I pulled the trigger and am "covering things up"....Why the hell would I waste my time?? I mean honestly what do I have to cover up? If I had a ND do you really think I would waste my time with this long post, as well as do you really think I would post about my ND on here for all to flame and crucify me? I don't think so.
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Old 12-04-2012, 21:19   #176
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Originally Posted by carloglock19 View Post
OP I sure hope that Glock will let you know what is wrong with your handgun. Please understand that some of the guys on here coming across as accusing you for the AD are probably feeling a little dejavu from previous threads were "the gun went off by itself" was stated.... later to find out that the trigger was pulled by the owner. Even if problem is fixed, do you plan on keeping a firearm that shoots on its own?

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Thats why I want it sent in to Glock so that they can see first hand whats up with it and maybe give me an explanation as to why it's like that. Honestly I do not know whether I will keep this pistol after Glock fixes it. I mean it really was a one in a million chance kinda thing. I will be thinking about it. I do have many other pistols for carry though.
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Old 12-04-2012, 21:19   #177
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cglaspel View Post
Hey again guys!

OK so due to the amount of questions and responses it is hard for me to respond to them all, so I apologize if I miss some of them! Also I have been at work all day so no way to post until now.

Anyways, SO took it to a SECOND Glock Armorer today, and thank goodness I did, I now have an answer,

#1- Firing pin block spring was bent, not straight like it should have been!!!

#2 The "sear" is not engaging the lug on the firing pin assembly properly!!

He says that since both of these issues are there, that It is highly likely that the pistol fired from the "half cocked" position. Obviously I am now having him ship this to GLOCK to correct this issue immediately. This is pretty ridiculous that a brand new pistol had these MAJOR defects. I am sure Glock will make it right though.

I have fired the pistol before and never had an issue with it, so IDK how this had not fired while in the holster before....I am just extremely thankful it didnt hurt myself or anyone else!!

Very thankful to a fellow poster here that told me to specifically have my armorer look at these parts closely!!
Having minimal engagement between the trigger bar and the firing pin lug can result in double fires. Did you ever experience this while shooting this pistol?

Last edited by CCBBKK; 12-04-2012 at 21:26..
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Old 12-04-2012, 21:23   #178
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clarkz71 View Post
I can't tell you how he feels, but no one should handle
a firearm that can't follow the most basic rules there are.

They apply to all firearms/rifles/shotguns/RPG's, Not just Glocks

1. The gun is always loaded
2. Don't touch the trigger until ready to fire
3. Don't point the gun at anything you don't want to shoot.

You made the assumption that he hasn't mastered the art of keeping his finger out of the trigger guard.

The 1911 was meant to be carried cocked & locked.

The military wouldn't allow it so older shooters carry in 3
For CCW you may not have time to draw,
rack the slide and fire.

Much quicker to draw and click off the safty as you draw
then fire as you raise to target/BG

If anything I said here is wrong, please correct me, anyone.

I know how the Navy trained people to carry the 1911. We carried them C4 in home port and C3 when deployed overseas. I don't know how many ND's I heard about on the ship after we would deploy. In home port, the watch standers got in the habit of checking clear, turning over the weapon to their relief who checked clear, dropped the slide and then pulled the trigger.

When we deployed and went to C3, some watch standers would follow the same pattern except they would put the magazine in before they dropped the slide and then pull the trigger. Bang! Luckily, they always had the weapon pointed towards the water, so no one got hurt.

Regardless of how the 1911 is supposed to be carried, some people don't feel comfortable with C1 carry and they prefer C3. The military course of fire was to draw, slingshot the weapon and fire two rounds in 4 seconds. Before we transitioned to the 9mm, I could draw, slingshot and fire two rounds in less than 3 seconds.

My responses in bold.
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Last edited by eaglefrq; 12-04-2012 at 21:25..
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Old 12-04-2012, 21:28   #179
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Please let us know what Glock says when you get some feedback from them. One thing for sure is that I would be counting my lucky stars, blessings etc. The gun could have gone off at any time and could have hurt, maimed or killed. Glad the outcome was favorable and all that will be needed is some spackling and fresh paint!

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Old 12-04-2012, 21:30   #180
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cglaspel View Post
What forum is this? I have not posted about this anywhere else?? So maybe someone else has had this issue?!
Whoops! Turns out it was the same thread, but my last comment was from my phone and for some reason I thought it was on a different forum.
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