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Old 12-09-2012, 10:52   #381
stevemc
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This whole thread sounds funny to me. Who would get the store, that apparently lied to you, involved again and give them the firearm. I skimmed through the pages and didn't see the pic of the damaged wall. We will also need to see a pic of the "girlfriend", or it didn't happen.
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Old 12-09-2012, 10:59   #382
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I'm sure it's not the case here ... In almost every situation where a gun magically fires on it's own, the user caused it and won't admit it.
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Old 12-09-2012, 12:24   #383
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I'm sure it's not the case here ... In almost every situation where a gun magically fires on it's own, the user caused it and won't admit it.
Maybe because the girlfriend is pissed he put a hole in the wall, he concocted this story about the holster? Now he and the girlfriend are camping out, reading this thread as he says, "see, it's not my fault!"

Personally, I would have taken pictures of the whole incident including the wall, the pistol/holster, their position, and asked the gun smith and Glock Armorer to take pictures of the internals of the gun in question... Now, both the holster and the gun are gone and all the OP has is their word that their product wasn't the issue (since likely that will be what comes back from Blackhawk and Glock).
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Old 12-09-2012, 12:45   #384
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Interesting thread. My eyes are bleeding, having read all the posts.

Glad the OP is OK. Scary stuff, what happened.

A few good things learned. Way to much chaff, but not usual for INTERNET.

It sounds to me like someone along the way likely messed with the gun. Hard to say at this point if it was a used gun, sold as new, or was the person logging in the gun was bored and played with the gun. Absence of anti seize being a clue.

It's possible the factory forgot the anti seize, AND put in a bad FPS spring, AND a bad trigger bar. NOT very likely though.

As a civilian I have never seen the need for a holster with security features such as the Serpa types. Some retention, of course, to avoid the gun flopping out of the holster. 95% of the time I carry concealed (IWB mostly), and the 5% I carry open I tend to avoid crowds and am at condition yellow. Very aware of any possible "snatch" attempts. I typically don't physically engage B.G.'s or run and climb fences, etc.. I am not an "Operator" nor do I play one on TV.

Good to send the gun to Glock. My guess is they will just fix it and return with little explanation other than it DID NOT leave the factory in that condition. They will say they have no reports of a batch of bad springs or trigger bars, and frankly, if there were, it likely would have been all over GT by now. So I would tend to believe them.

What I would do, once Glock reports back is take the report to the store manager (not Dept. Mgr.), and express your concern, and perhaps relay the information you alluded to that employees have told you. Likely the boss had no clue what was happening, and would welcome the input if presented in a polite fashion. My guess is being polite vs. belligerant may get you some goodies.

Good Luck and stay safe.
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Old 12-09-2012, 14:47   #385
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Originally Posted by Jake Starr View Post
And as to the tactical soundness of C1 vs C3 that has already been dealt with in other threads. So the point is moot. If a BG already has his gun drawn and on you neither C1 nor C3 matters. Action beats reaction.
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I promise if you ever meet up with a bad guy and he has a gun, you can bet money he's carrying with one in the pipe.
Where in this post does it say the BG has his weapon drawn
on you already??

It says on the street the BG will have one in the pipe, you
need to be aware of your surroundings & be prepared to act.

Carrying a CCW in cond 3 is plain stupid. You have seconds
to draw & fire, having to chamber a round can get you killed.
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Old 12-09-2012, 14:56   #386
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Or do you prefer armed citizens not carry C1?

Do you carry C3 while in duty??

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Originally Posted by Jake Starr View Post

I only carry Glocks because my department says so. I like them just fine but I have dropped anything because of them... Seems people who don't shoot much can shoot better scores with Glocks then they could with older Sig models. I personally carry Sigs. I can shoot them better than my Glocks. I have shot with many LEOs. Many can't shoot whether it is a Sig or Glock.
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Old 12-09-2012, 15:30   #387
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Quote:
Originally Posted by [Un]Deadeye View Post
Maybe because the girlfriend is pissed he put a hole in the wall, he concocted this story about the holster? Now he and the girlfriend are camping out, reading this thread as he says, "see, it's not my fault!"

Personally, I would have taken pictures of the whole incident including the wall, the pistol/holster, their position, and asked the gun smith and Glock Armorer to take pictures of the internals of the gun in question... Now, both the holster and the gun are gone and all the OP has is their word that their product wasn't the issue (since likely that will be what comes back from Blackhawk and Glock).
Personally, I would have just patched and painted the wall and not told my girlfriend about it. Just like with the government, what she/it doesn't know, can't hurt you...
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Old 12-09-2012, 15:50   #388
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Originally Posted by clarkz71 View Post
Where in this post does it say the BG has his weapon drawn
on you already??

It says on the street the BG will have one in the pipe, you
need to be aware of your surroundings & be prepared to act.

Carrying a CCW in cond 3 is plain stupid. You have seconds
to draw & fire, having to chamber a round can get you killed.
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Old 12-09-2012, 17:57   #389
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I've been following this thread since it's birth.

1-Finger off the trigger , or

2-New holster , or

3-Rinse all things , gun , mags , holster and trigger finger in "HOLY WATER" , two aspirin and call me in the morning.

Lesson learned: If ever I "AD" , you will never know......!
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Old 12-09-2012, 19:04   #390
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Carrying a CCW in cond 3 is plain stupid. You have seconds
to draw & fire, having to chamber a round can get you killed.
You have not a clue.

It may get you killed. I am glad you know your limitations.

I know plenty who can do it in under two seconds from concealment with shots on 8.5 x 11 paper at 21'. Last week my time was 1.8 secs. I am faster than some and slower than others...so what.

Still not what this thread is about. A gun in C3 is safer than in C1 regardless of user, equipment or firearms failure. If OP had gun in C3 there would be no thread.
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Last edited by Jake Starr; 12-09-2012 at 19:05..
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Old 12-09-2012, 19:12   #391
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Glocks are designed to be carried with a round in the chamber.

And I won't refer to it as condition one, or zero, because those conditions apply to 1911 pistols, not Glocks.
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Old 12-09-2012, 19:29   #392
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The training we go through with the Glock describes the conditions as:

Condition 3: No loaded magazine in the magazine well, no round in the chamber.

Condition 2: Loaded magazine placed in magazine well, no round in the chamber.

Condition 1: A round in the chamber, with or without a loaded magazine in the magazine well.

The Condition relates to the number of actions it takes to fire the gun.
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Old 12-09-2012, 19:33   #393
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Had an extremely dangerous and scary experience today.. I cant even describe how upset I am over this. Do not know how to completely explain how this just happened but here goes.

I came home from my daily errands today. I have my CCW and carry on a daily basis. Well after I walk into the house and put groceries etc down, I take my NEW G23 gen 4 in the holster off of my belt, and set it down on my kitchen table....as I sent it down THE PISTOL FIRES!! Right into my living room wall!!! I truly do not know how it was even able to?! MY finger was no where near the trigger...It was in a Serpa Holster so I was totally unable to pull the trigger even if I wanted too!! I did not throw the $@%$ pistol down hard onto the table or anything....I literally set it down like I always do... Thank God the GF wasnt home, the bullet did not go through the outer wall of my home, and myself nor neighbors were injured or worse....

I am just completely in shock over this..I have never in my life had this happen, I wouldnt think it was remotely possible... especially with a Glock(and I have owned many glocks as well as other pistols over the past 10 years now with no AD/ND or anything ever) I have since put the now unloaded pistol in its case and I am going to be calling Glock tomorrow morning....

Does anyone know how this is possible?! Or have they had this happen before?! I truly am just shocked and amazed over this. I checked the Glocks function and it seemed normal, the ejected casing had a normal firing pin strike on the primer (obviously since the pistol fired, but I wanted to make sure the round somehow didnt fire of its own accord)

I just truly do not trust this weapon at all now and am just very upset and didnt know where else to put this.
Scary. I am glad it turned out to be just a scare. I CCW a Glock every single day too, literally all day every day. I read the first few posts in this thread but really don't have time to read 16 pages of posts. If anyone has an update on how this happened please PM it to me. I carry a G26 in an Old Faithful leather/kydex holster and I am pretty confident in that holster. And when I get home I take the gun out of the holster and put it directly into my Remora IWB that I used before I got my OF. This is the condition I keep it in next to my bed. I seldom leave the gun unholstered, and if I ever do I remove the magazine, and lock the slide back every time.

Last edited by Chris Brines; 12-09-2012 at 19:40..
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Old 12-09-2012, 19:45   #394
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jake Starr View Post
You have not a clue.

It may get you killed. I am glad you know your limitations.

I know plenty who can do it in under two seconds from concealment with shots on 8.5 x 11 paper at 21'. Last week my time was 1.8 secs. I am faster than some and slower than others...so what.

Still not what this thread is about. A gun in C3 is safer than in C1 regardless of user, equipment or firearms failure. If OP had gun in C3 there would be no thread.
I hope that you have practiced racking a round with one hand. A lot of the people I know who have been in close combat fights have claimed that they have had one of their hands wrapped around a loved one or fighting off a attacker. Back in 2006 I had a golden retriever biting down on my right hand and couldn't reach my duty weapon. Long story short I m glad I didn't shoot her and I now carry BUG on duty in left front pocket.
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Old 12-09-2012, 19:46   #395
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jake Starr View Post
You have not a clue.

It may get you killed. I am glad you know your limitations.

I know plenty who can do it in under two seconds from concealment with shots on 8.5 x 11 paper at 21'. Last week my time was 1.8 secs. I am faster than some and slower than others...so what.

Still not what this thread is about. A gun in C3 is safer than in C1 regardless of user, equipment or firearms failure. If OP had gun in C3 there would be no thread.
BG's love guys like you
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Old 12-09-2012, 20:11   #396
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BG's love guys like you
If I felt compelled to carry in C3 I'd just get a different gun. Glocks are striker fired the only way they can fire is if the trigger is pulled. Whatever caused this seems to have been a possibility with any gun.
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Old 12-09-2012, 20:24   #397
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jake Starr View Post
You have not a clue.

It may get you killed. I am glad you know your limitations.

I know plenty who can do it in under two seconds from concealment with shots on 8.5 x 11 paper at 21'. Last week my time was 1.8 secs. I am faster than some and slower than others...so what.

Still not what this thread is about. A gun in C3 is safer than in C1 regardless of user, equipment or firearms failure. If OP had gun in C3 there would be no thread.
Drawing and shooting at paper is nowhere near the same as drawing and shooting a guy coming at you with a gun in his hand. Paper doesn't shoot back.
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Old 12-09-2012, 20:25   #398
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BG's love guys like you
So does the military.
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Old 12-09-2012, 20:36   #399
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I can't believe it: I went thru all sixteen pages.......
WOW SO many Armorers, I'm impressed but:

There are two levels of GLOCK Armorers. Let the upper tier inspect the pistol and wait for their finding. I'm betting IF the pistol is in like new condition and has had NO modifications it's going to be an operator/holster problem. There is just too much that has to go wrong all at once for this situation to happen.

I might have missed Arc Angels defination of "Stacking". I can't buy that theory. I am confident the engagement is checked as a matter of QA before the pistol is allowed to proceed thru the assembly line.

Glock pumps out thousands of these things a month. Obviously safety is of the utmost concern. Liability and market share is enough for Glock to ensure their product is top notch.
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Old 12-09-2012, 20:49   #400
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I'm glad to see I'm not the only one that
understands that under stress we need every
advantage in reaction time if confronted with
a threat. I know I can draw & fire quicker
then drawing, racking the slide & then firing.

And the chance of only having the use
of one hand is a certain possibility.

That's why practicing gun safty is a constant
daily thing. So an AD doesn't happen.
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