Glock 23 Gen 4 Accidental Discharge??!! - Page 17

PA Wizard · 12-09-2012, 20:42

tagged

Jake Starr · 12-09-2012, 20:59

Quote:

I hope that you have practiced racking a round with one hand.

Every day. It is part of my religion of OMAD.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tnpatriot
BG's love guys like you

Yeah, they are Volunteers for me. Not a problem.

WilliamDahl · 12-09-2012, 22:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by G-19

The training we go through with the Glock describes the conditions as:

Condition 3: No loaded magazine in the magazine well, no round in the chamber.

Condition 2: Loaded magazine placed in magazine well, no round in the chamber.

Condition 1: A round in the chamber, with or without a loaded magazine in the magazine well.

I"m not sure we should be redefining the Conditions for the different firearms. It's entirely possible that a particular firearm might not have a particular Condition or maybe it could even have other Conditions.

In my opinion, your Condition 1 is the same as Condition 0 with the M1911. All it takes with either is to pull the trigger to make the firearm fire. Yeah, there's the trigger safety, but that doesn't really count since if you have your finger in there and pull the trigger, you're going to automatically disable the trigger safety. So, a Glock has a Condition 0, no Condition 1. no Condition 2, a Condition 3, and a Condition 4. Because of the slightly heavier trigger pull, the Glock is a bit safer in Condition 0 than a M1911, but it's not as safe as a heavy trigger pull DAO revolver or semii-auto.

Quote:

Originally Posted by G-19

The Condition relates to the number of actions it takes to fire the gun.

Condition 0 -- All you need to do is pull the trigger to make it fire. That describes the normal carrying condition of the Glock to me.

Condition 1 -- You need to disable a safety and then pull the trigger to make it fire. This just does not exist on a Glock.

Condition 2 -- With the M1911, this consists of cocking the hammer and then pulling the trigger to make it fire, but the grip safety is probably counted as the 3rd operation that you must engage since the thumb safety is not necessarily an option on all M1911s when the firearm is not cocked. There's not really a way to put the Glock in this Condition.

Condition 3 -- I don't really see there being 4 operations with this Condition. With the M1911, this consists of pulling back the slide to load a round and pulling the trigger. If you include the grip safety, maybe you could classify this as 3 operations, but definitely not 4.

Condition 4 -- Put a mag in the gun, pull back slide to load new round (or if slide is locked back, press slide release button), pull trigger... 3 operations, maybe 4 if you include the grip safety, but definitely not 5.

So, I don't think that the Condition number is the exact number of operations that must be performed to result in a round being fired, but it does give a general level of things that must occur for it to happen and the relative safety of it as compared to the other levels.

clarkz71 · 12-10-2012, 03:42

. I just use condition Glock. Draw, fire.

ipscshooter · 12-10-2012, 12:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by clarkz71

I'm glad to see I'm not the only one that
understands that under stress we need every
advantage in reaction time if confronted with
a threat. I know I can draw & fire quicker
then drawing, racking the slide & then firing.

I'm with you one this one, and have to DISAGREE with Jake Starr.

I carry with one in the chamber, whether it's Glock, 1911, or whatever gun I have at the time. "Speed is economy of motion" - J. Michael Plaxco, and adding racking the slide is not economy of motion.

I'm not willing to bet my life on it working out every time like it does in practice. How many times has Jake screwed it up, and only remembers the good times?

What you can do when you are expecting it and prepared is a lot different than when suprised and under stress. I have seen many "pistoleros" at competitions, including national events, try to rack one in the chamber and screw it up for various reasons.

clarkz71 · 12-10-2012, 13:04

PhotoFeller · 12-10-2012, 14:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by clarkz71

Carrying a CCW in cond 3 is plain stupid. You have seconds
to draw & fire, having to chamber a round can get you killed.

This thread isn't about carry condition, but since you're in the mood to use 'stupid' to describe something you disagree with, let me say this: I'll bet you've never been within one mile of a gunfight in progress.

You speak with such great authority about a subject you're only pretending to be expert in. Repeating words you've read here and elsewhere doesn't make you anything but a parrot with a gun.

tonyparson · 12-10-2012, 14:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhotoFeller

This thread isn't about carry condition, but since you're in the mood to use 'stupid' to describe something you disagree with, let me say this: I'll bet you've never been within one mile of a gunfight in progress.

You speak with such great authority about a subject you're only pretending to be expert in. Repeating words you've read here and elsewhere doesn't make you anything but a parrot with a gun.

You don't have to be an expert to know carrying a gun chambered is a lot better then carrying a gun not chambered.

clarkz71 · 12-10-2012, 14:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhotoFeller

This thread isn't about carry condition, but since you're in the mood to use 'stupid' to describe something you disagree with, let me say this: I'll bet you've never been within one mile of a gunfight in progress.

You speak with such great authority about a subject you're only pretending to be expert in. Repeating words you've read here and elsewhere doesn't make you anything but a parrot with a gun.

Well you are entitled to your opinion and as a fellow Republican
I defend your right to express it. .

You're also correct I've never been close enough to any
gunfight to even hear the shots and hope I never will be.

But I do my best to be prepared if I ever have to protect
myself or loved ones if need be.

PhotoFeller · 12-10-2012, 15:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by clarkz71

Well you are entitled to your opinion and as a fellow Republican
I defend your right to express it. .

You're also correct I've never been close enough to any
gunfight to even hear the shots and hope I never will be.

But I do my best to be prepared if I ever have to protect
myself or loved ones if need be.

You are entitled to CC any way you like, and I have no quarrel with your choice of carry condition, your weapon choice or any aspect of your self defense methods. Be prepared as you see fit. It's even constructive when you defend your decisions and opinions here with facts you believe to be compelling.

I appreciate the tenor of your reply. I hope to swap ideas with you again.

tnpatriot · 12-10-2012, 16:35

Barney Fife carried one bullet in his pocket. That's only slighly slower than condition 3, but it's the same idea. Don't be a Barney

Chigurh · 12-10-2012, 17:17

This thread is the best and worst of the internet, and forums: some useful information, and a lot of idiots lashing out from their lairs of ignorance.
Let's just wait to hear what the OP learns from Glock, such as it may be.
Sorry.

PhotoFeller · 12-10-2012, 17:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by tnpatriot

Barney Fife carried one bullet in his pocket. That's only slighly slower than condition 3, but it's the same idea. Don't be a Barney

I'd rather be Barney than Goofy! Grow up, lad, and go do your homework.

hunter 111 · 12-10-2012, 17:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by cglaspel

Yep I got my glock from Fin Feather Fur in Ashland Ohio.

Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine

I bought a pistol from that store drove 2 hours home found it was way out of time , if fact refused to lock on one cylinder ---
took it back , told them to take it back -- they said no , I told them throw it in their dumpster it was a CC purchase and I was disputing the charge . They took it and put it back on the display case for sale again .. never again will I go there . Place is a shadow of what it used to be in the old store .

Chigurh · 12-10-2012, 18:23

"lairs of ignorance" was a misspeak. Meant to say "lairs of anger"
As Dennis Miller said " if only the internet had more angry people who thought other people cared about what they had to say".
It would be great if every angry jacked up post one makes to another, put them in the same room, with that other.

PhotoFeller · 12-10-2012, 19:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chigurh

This thread is the best and worst of the internet, and forums: some useful information, and a lot of idiots lashing out from their lairs of ignorance.
Let's just wait to hear what the OP learns from Glock, such as it may be.
Sorry.

Well said, and spot on.

1canvas · 12-10-2012, 19:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chigurh

This thread is the best and worst of the internet, and forums: some useful information, and a lot of idiots lashing out from their lairs of ignorance.
Let's just wait to hear what the OP learns from Glock, such as it may be.
Sorry.

I wonder how many calls Glock gets in a year with people saying the gun just went bang all by itself

.

00Glazz · 12-10-2012, 21:20

Hunter 111 WOW, that sucks. At least you got your money back!

I am still waiting on Glock, I am not surprised it is taking so long with the holidays and all though. Really hoping they get to it before Christmas etc.... Anybody ever have crazy wait times with them before??
Also thanks again to all the people who are having an honest discussion about this. Not just giving me flak etc. I really appreciate it! I am thinking I should probably edit my first post in this thread with the findings, so we don't have people still coming in and thinking its the serpa, or I somehow fubar'd something. Lol.

00Glazz · 12-10-2012, 21:22

On a good sidenote though, I just got a for real NEW Glock 26 for a great deal

So now I have another glock to carry. I also went and bought 2 nice Galco holsters for it as well as some pearce extensions!

WilliamDahl · 12-10-2012, 21:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhotoFeller

This thread isn't about carry condition, but since you're in the mood to use 'stupid' to describe something you disagree with, let me say this: I'll bet you've never been within one mile of a gunfight in progress.

I would hazard to guess that if this thread was restricted to those of us who have either been shot or have shot someone else, it would be a lot less active thread. Some of us gained that experience in the military, some of us gained that experience in private life, and some of us are unlucky enough to have gained that experience in both places. As they say, "life sucks, but the alternative is not all that great either"...

We should learn from the mistakes in life of others and not insist on making those mistakes for ourselves.

Rick305 · 12-10-2012, 22:03

I still call bs on a glock firing with no trigger pull maybe I'm nieave

PhotoFeller · 12-10-2012, 22:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by WilliamDahl

We should learn from the mistakes in life of others and not insist on making those mistakes for ourselves.

This thread is about a weapon firing mysteriously, and we should learn something valuable no matter what the final answer is. Why don't we stay on topic and see what happens?

Glockrunner · 12-11-2012, 04:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by WilliamDahl

I would hazard to guess that if this thread was restricted to those of us who have either been shot or have shot someone else, it would be a lot less active thread. Some of us gained that experience in the military, some of us gained that experience in private life, and some of us are unlucky enough to have gained that experience in both places. As they say, "life sucks, but the alternative is not all that great either"...

We should learn from the mistakes in life of others and not insist on making those mistakes for ourselves.

And I would hazard to guess your experience getting shot has no relationship with the discussion at hand as the OP placed it. Unless you got shot by a firearm that was holstered and removed, I don't see the relevance.

Jake Starr · 12-11-2012, 05:39

Quote:

You don't have to be an expert to know carrying a gun chambered is a lot better then carrying a gun not chambered.

Now I guess that is a matter of opinion. Fact is more people are shot or killed by way of an AD/ND from C1 than C3. I've seen plenty of "experts" make mistakes.

dango · 12-11-2012, 06:38

May I ask ? What is the lesson learned here other than the most basic of safety when around fire arms ?

Direction of muzzle is moot when OC or CC , fact is if that pistol fires with a round in the chamber , odds are your getting shot somewhere.

Life style dictates how I carry and when. Out here in the boonies
none in the chamber. In the rat race , one in the chamber.

What is the prognosis , why did this pistol fire ? I can't say and all I get from this is awareness.

Glad for the OP it was only a wall and no doubt , he learned the most whatever the reason.