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Old 11-12-2012, 14:36   #201
DanaT
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Originally Posted by devildog2067 View Post
When jobs are more plentiful than employees, potential employees can use their scarcity power to negotiate a better deal. When potential employees are more plentiful than jobs, the power balance goes the other way.
And the next thing you will try to get me to believe is that gold costs more than wood because gold is a scarcer commodity than wood.

You silly capitalists.


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Twice a week? 14 times a month?
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2x4=8, not 14.
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Old 11-12-2012, 14:40   #202
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Your right, But they should give them a warning that there job is gone.
Well then.

You should write me a check (with sufficient funds) for $250,000.


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Old 11-12-2012, 15:12   #203
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I'd prefer there not be a law for everything. Sure, my company can fire me for anything but I work for Starwood so under their rules it pretty much takes theft or sexual harassment to be fired on first offense.

At will employment makes things easier on the employer too. Fewer hoops and possible lawsuits, and the ability to clean house as needed without extra steps. I do understand that it may hurt employees but if you want, unions can help fill that void. At least then it's your choice and not forced upon us all (I also happen to live in a right-to-work state)
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Old 11-12-2012, 15:41   #204
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After reading this is it clear why they got rid of you. Drama.

If they tell you to park where all employees are supposed to park. Why make a big deal about it?

So what if you are peeved that some girl wants you to come to her instead of vice versa. You don't agree and escalate it.

You leave out the shopping lifting thing now.

People knocking on door and running. Seems like a silly game.

But these types of episodes would tell me "how much management time (ergo money) on this person. For them it was easy. You were using more management resources than you were worth to them.

Sorry to be so blunt.


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Because we've always parked back there. Pissed off shoplifters can't wait for us outside/see what we drive. Employees don't know when we come or go.
Management has failed to tell us security issues in the past and we often have transients/bums trying to steal cans from the back and then return them for $$.
Thats why I asked.

She wanted my left out of the investigation and my partner to go up. Never happened before and he was off the next day. Since we are a team, I would have liked to be briefed too.

I left out the other incident since that happened back in March and I alread mentioned it. And it was a lie. Shouldn't be held against me.
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Old 11-12-2012, 16:14   #205
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It is difficult to dedicate yourself to a company who doesn't dedicate itself to you. I think there should be some safeguards in place to protect a worker from retaliation for off-the-job/off-the-premises pissing matches that have nothing to do with the worker's job performance. I did a very, very good job for my employer, but got canned by a small man with no ethics and no honor who felt he had to get even with me. The Canadian masters hired him to run that store and this old man's career is nothing to them, as long as the $$$ keep rolling in... except it isn't... this particular store has NEVER shown a profit.

The store hasn't been open quite five years yet between when it was Sportsman's Warehouse and its current incarnation as Wholesale Sports and he has fired six managers now, driven off several more, had a couple of 'em go back to hourly to get out from under his thumb, and one retired. The Hunting department is on its fourth manager, Front End is on its fourth manager, Fishing is on its third, Receiving/Shipping on its third, Camping on its second, Clothing on its second, Gift Bar on its second, and Footwear on its second... in LESS THAN FIVE YEARS!

I don't know how on God's Green Earth this could be true, but the store manager once told me it costs an average of $200,000 to train a manager... and he's fired six of us in less than five years... that would be $1.2 million down the drain, according to his figures. Add in the ones that have voluntarily left, combined with the ones currently in the positions and that figure can be boosted to ~$4.5 million.
I was fired in April, and the last Hunting Manager was just fired on November 6.

The store has never made a profit, and out of 15 stores, our store was tied for last place with the Bismarck store... and WS closed that store almost immediately upon acquisition, leaving the Helena store in last place. Internal corruption is rampant, as per my previous post, and I think there should be some checks in place to protect the workers from the day to day whims of a complete lunatic. Combined with Obama's reelection, I can't really see that store being open a year from now.
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Old 11-12-2012, 16:18   #206
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I think there should be some safeguards in place to protect a worker from retaliation for off-the-job/off-the-premises pissing matches that have nothing to do with the worker's job performance.
There are "safeguards" in place.

If you're a good employee and were terminated unfairly, you can go get another job.

If a company keeps behaving that way, they won't be able to get good employees and eventually will go out of business.

The free market is the safeguard.
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Old 11-12-2012, 16:21   #207
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As someone who was once laid off with a 1hour notice, I TOTALLY support the right of an employer to hire and fire at will.
They also have the right to set the pay and hours.

if the worker doesn't like it, they're free to find another place to work where their "genius" is "appreciated".
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Old 11-12-2012, 17:41   #208
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I have a question for the folks here that might know if this is true.
I work in a "Right to Work State" but signed my employment documents on a Military Base.
Now, not very often but once in a blue moon someone from management will say, "It's a right to work state" I always wondered if because some paperwork and all of the work is conducted on post doesn't Federal Law trump State Law in these cases?
Thanks.
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Old 11-12-2012, 17:47   #209
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Originally Posted by Averageman View Post
I have a question for the folks here that might know if this is true.
I work in a "Right to Work State" but signed my employment documents on a Military Base.
Now, not very often but once in a blue moon someone from management will say, "It's a right to work state" I always wondered if because some paperwork and all of the work is conducted on post doesn't Federal Law trump State Law in these cases?
Thanks.
State employment laws still apply.
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Old 11-12-2012, 17:59   #210
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Originally Posted by Averageman View Post
I have a question for the folks here that might know if this is true.
I work in a "Right to Work State" but signed my employment documents on a Military Base.
Now, not very often but once in a blue moon someone from management will say, "It's a right to work state" I always wondered if because some paperwork and all of the work is conducted on post doesn't Federal Law trump State Law in these cases?
Thanks.
While Federal law would trump, I don't see how it applies in this case. If right to work was against Federal law, there would be no right to work states.
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Old 11-12-2012, 18:08   #211
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'At Will' employment, what are your thoughts?

I have no problem with it. Anything else makes it far too hard to get rid of the slackers and the people that don't perform.

It's not fair to expect those that work hard already to carry the people that don't. (One of the many reasons that I despise unions.)
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Old 11-12-2012, 18:29   #212
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A "Right to Work State" only means that - even if your company has a union - you can not be forced to join the union / pay dues.

There may be a state or two that considers itself right to work - but they can still make you pay dues - or still make you join but don't have to pay dues. I can't recall - which - all I know is unions suck.

At will employment really has little / nothing to do with right to work.

I got a job while in college with a company that had a union.

I was 20 years old - had no real opinion about unions - good or bad.

After my interview as I was leaving - several employees were outside on break. One ask me "how did the interview go" I said pretty good - but you never know.

Then I was told - if you get the job and know what's good for you - you better join the union - if you don't your car will get keyed.

I never liked it when someone told me what I had to do under threat-

I told the guy to F off and he made a move at me - his friends stopped him - good thing I would have beat the everliving snot out of him.

I got the job - never joined the union - my car did get keyed - I eventually did end up beating the everliving snot out of MR Union organizer.

Strange - if they would have just left me alone I may have joined -

So in a way they did me a favor.

Hard for me to understand how any law could be passed that requires you to join an organization and give them part of your paycheck - it is just wrong.

BTW - in case you have not figured it out I am anti-union - in the same way the Pope is anti-abortion.

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Old 11-12-2012, 18:40   #213
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whole lotta timecards in a twist up in here......
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Old 11-12-2012, 18:48   #214
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... One of the many reasons that I despise unions...
Touché. Unions served their initial purpose, re: Upton Sinclair's "The Jungle", et. al. I don't necessarily believe in their dismantling, but the cost and deliberate divisiveness that I've witnessed is contrary to everyone's best interests.
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Old 11-12-2012, 18:50   #215
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Another completely stupid thread, but this is by far the worst site for this kind of BS.

My employees from day 1 are told what they have to do, No Deviation at all, if they have a problem they can come to me and talk, if I feel there is some merit in what they say I would take that into consideration, if not they are Fired.

What employees have to realize is that their job is a privilege, not a right, There are thousands to replace them, especially in this economy.

Oh by the way we have NO communist unions here.

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Old 11-12-2012, 18:57   #216
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Old 11-12-2012, 19:45   #217
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whole lotta timecards in a twist up in here......
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Old 11-12-2012, 19:49   #218
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What employees have to realize is that their job is a privilege, not a right, There are thousands to replace them, especially in this economy.
Amen!

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Old 11-12-2012, 20:30   #219
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My employees from day 1 are told what they have to do, No Deviation at all, if they have a problem they can come to me and talk, if I feel there is some merit in what they say I would take that into consideration, if not they are Fired.
Are you saying that you fire employees for making suggestions you don't agree with?
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Old 11-12-2012, 21:15   #220
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Another completely stupid thread, but this is by far the worst site for this kind of BS.

My employees from day 1 are told what they have to do, No Deviation at all, if they have a problem they can come to me and talk, if I feel there is some merit in what they say I would take that into consideration, if not they are Fired.

What employees have to realize is that their job is a privilege, not a right, There are thousands to replace them, especially in this economy.

Oh by the way we have NO communist unions here.
How is it stupid? I raised a legit issue. I was wronged and looking for opinion.
Yes it is a privilege and not a right. That doesn't mean employers should treat there employees that way. The working class spend more time at work than at home. The economy is also driven by us.

Would you rather have to deal with a union than have give a warning before terminating someone? I would rather have that and do away with unions.
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Old 11-12-2012, 21:16   #221
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You missed your calling... you should be a gods damned diplomat.
Me?..
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Old 11-12-2012, 21:21   #222
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I have no problem with it. Anything else makes it far too hard to get rid of the slackers and the people that don't perform.
How do you get that having to give a warning is the same as having to deal with a union?

People start slacking over time. Catch it when the problem starts and give a warning before it gets to the point where you've had enough.
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Old 11-12-2012, 21:31   #223
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Some HR departments wanna give people 5 and 6 more chances. Sis is manager at a chain store and pretty much fired a girl for being lazy and not working. She called her manager told him what was what and he said ohh call HR. They wanted her to call her back in and unfire her and all this crap.......she told em if they wanted her to work there then they could come in and put up with her crap.

She never did come back.
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Old 11-12-2012, 21:39   #224
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Yes it is a privilege and not a right. That doesn't mean employers should treat there employees that way.
Since when is "should" the same as "let's make a law requiring people to behave a certain way"?

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The working class spend more time at work than at home.
I guarantee that your manager works more hours than you do. The idea of a "working class" is nothing but classist crap.

I worked from 6am Friday to 1am Saturday last week. Yes, I work behind a desk primarily. But I still average 70 hours. I don't even get overtime. When's the last time you worked a 70 hour week?

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The economy is also driven by us.
The economy is driven by both capital and labor. To say it's driven by "us" is stupid. Neither can exist without the other.

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Would you rather have to deal with a union than have give a warning before terminating someone? I would rather have that and do away with unions.
And when you run a business, you can make that choice. You don't get to try and legislate that choice onto others.
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Old 11-12-2012, 22:13   #225
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I guarantee that your manager works more hours than you do. The idea of a "working class" is nothing but classist crap.
Absolutely positively did not!
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