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Old 11-01-2012, 08:29   #201
tantrix
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bilbo Bagins View Post
Also this 10 month Libertarian champion of guns did WHAT exactly when he was governor of NM to make it easier for New Mexican residents to purchase or own guns
The same thing Romney did for that gun-utopia called MA.

New to the Libertarian party or not, he still has more conservative views than ANY Republican that was running, with the exception of Ron Paul.
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Old 11-01-2012, 09:26   #202
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Gary Johnson just another anti-nuke hippy.

The Okie Corral
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Old 11-01-2012, 09:29   #203
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Gary Johnson just another anti-nuke hippy.
Hey, you do what you gotta do to preserve the status quo...I'm gonna opt-out of that this time.
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Old 11-01-2012, 10:14   #204
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Gary Johnson just another anti-nuke hippy.

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G36 - whatcha got against peace?
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Old 11-01-2012, 10:16   #205
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What is the differance between compromise and appeasement?
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Old 11-01-2012, 10:43   #206
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G36 - whatcha got against peace?
That is a nuclear disarmament symbol.

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Old 11-01-2012, 13:21   #207
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The same thing Romney did for that gun-utopia called MA.

New to the Libertarian party or not, he still has more conservative views than ANY Republican that was running, with the exception of Ron Paul.
That is funny because Ron Paul is pro life, wants to strengthen US borders and not give Amnesty, and does not want same sex marriage, and wants the pot issues to be left up to the states.

If you support Gary Johnson, you support Amnesty for illegals, Federal laws legalizing drugs and prostitution, which will mean anyone in prison for those charges will be released. You would also support abortion and same sex marriage, and will be AGAINST the death penality.

Does that sound conservative to you? Does anyone visit the candidates website or read up on them before casting their vote anymore?
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Old 11-01-2012, 13:24   #208
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That is funny because Ron Paul is pro life, wants to strengthen US borders and not give Amnesty, and does not want same sex marriage, and wants the pot issues to be left up to the states.

If you support Gary Johnson, you support Amnesty for illegals, Federal laws legalizing drugs and prostitution, which will mean anyone in prison for those charges will be released. You would also support abortion and same sex marriage, and will be AGAINST the death penality.

Does that sound conservative to you? Does anyone visit the candidates website or read up on them before casting their vote anymore?

I know all of that. I actually agree with Gary Johnson more than I agree with Ron Paul.
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Old 11-01-2012, 13:40   #209
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I know all of that. I actually agree with Gary Johnson more than I agree with Ron Paul.
Ok, I can respect that.

The Okie Corral

Personally for me I need a candidate that is not an idealogue stuck on the party platform. I need a Libertarian that isn't fixated on legalizing everything and shutting down the Federal Government. I need a Republican that isn't focused on forcing religious value on the people and letting large companies run amok. I guess I need a democrat that is willing give away everything for free, to make people work for there government benefits, to no bow down to fringe groups and unions, and to give business a chance.
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Old 11-01-2012, 13:46   #210
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I need a Libertarian that isn't fixated on legalizing everything and shutting down the Federal Government.
This is pretty much the one I've been voting for since '04.

The Republicans and Democrats are too worried about arguing and pissing on each other's shoes to get anything done, so I'm done with both of them.
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Old 11-01-2012, 20:38   #211
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Commie.

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Old 11-02-2012, 09:40   #212
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G36 - whatcha got against peace?
There is nothing peaceful about a movement that supported communist forces in Vietnam and Latin America.

Che Guevarra was a Stalinist thug, not Ghandi.
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Old 11-02-2012, 09:44   #213
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This is pretty much the one I've been voting for since '04.

The Republicans and Democrats are too worried about arguing and pissing on each other's shoes to get anything done, so I'm done with both of them.
I vote for pro-gun Republicans. If they're pro-gun, then they're usually going to be good on other issues.
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Old 11-02-2012, 11:49   #214
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I vote for pro-gun candidates. If they're pro-gun, then they're usually going to be good on other issues.
If the above-corrected statement doesn't apply to you, then you are 1) a partisan voter and/or 2) not a one-issue voter.

If guns are truly most important to you, then the letter after the name shouldn't matter, exactly like the NRA views it.
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Old 11-02-2012, 13:35   #215
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I know there are democrat voting types aka liberals aka Obama supporters who are pro gun....but to me it is kinda hard to imagine because it goes against pretty much everything that makes a liberal, a liberal. Which to me, no offense to anyone, this is just how I see it, a liberal is by definition, a hypocrite. Of course you won't find that definition on dictionary.com or something like that, it will say "a person with the ideologies that allows the greatest amount of individual liberty", or something along those lines.

Which if you stop and think about it, the hippies back in the 60's were the libs of that time, and they were all about free spiritidness. But liberals of today seem to have gone full circle, from embracing liberty to asserting the need for "a nanny state". Liberals today seem to think the federal government should get involved in literally everything, and that a "ban" can fix any problem.

I'll go and read the article now, I just wanted to say what I thought of the phrase "pro gun liberal" before I did. Glad some liberals are pro gun, but I still don't get how they are pro gun but have leftist views on pretty much everything else. But hey I am not criticizing anyone, to each their own, I am more than happy that there are leftists out there who embrace the 2nd Amendment.
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Old 11-02-2012, 14:01   #216
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I know there are democrat voting types aka liberals aka Obama supporters who are pro gun....but to me it is kinda hard to imagine because it goes against pretty much everything that makes a liberal, a liberal. Which to me, no offense to anyone, this is just how I see it, a liberal is by definition, a hypocrite. Of course you won't find that definition on dictionary.com or something like that, it will say "a person with the ideologies that allows the greatest amount of individual liberty", or something along those lines.
The problem is, you're using the political-right's definition of a liberal.

Liberal means that you're in the "live and let live" category. The reason guns come into it is because some see it as a way to not "live and let live" but rather "make you do what I want." I disagree with that view, but it's what a lot see.

Gay rights. Right to choose. These are things that LIBERALS are saying the government should stay out of, while the CONSERVATIVE, small-government types are trying to legislate away. And, yes, liberals do believe in social programs to help those who need help. But the GOAL (granted, it's a failing system right not) isn't to make people dependent on the government, it's to give a safety net until they get back on their feet.

For MOST people - politicians or not, liberal or conservative - guns just ARE NOT that big of an issue. If all else was equal, that might be the deciding vote. Obviously there's not going to be that many that agree with me on this point, since this is a GUN FORUM, but the truth is, it's a pretty fringe issue that doesn't enter into most peoples thoughts when voting.


Anyone wants some political pointers? Here it is:

For those on the RIGHT: Change your platform to support marriage equality and support the legalization (and regulation, like alcohol) of marijuana.

For those on the LEFT: Support programs like drug-screenings for welfare and ID requirements for voting (and make non-drivers' license IDs free).

Those changes to party platforms would generate MASSIVE amounts of cross-over voting.
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Old 11-02-2012, 14:06   #217
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Please, they are not liberals. They prefer to be called progressives. Here I'll use it in a sentence. Obummer and his socialist progressives want to ban all firearms to facilitate their progression to communism. How's that?
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Old 11-03-2012, 13:01   #218
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Great quote! I'm sure a few here will recognize it.
Always nice to find a few similar souls around...i smiled when i saw the quote
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Old 11-03-2012, 19:10   #219
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Please, they are not liberals. They prefer to be called progressives. Here I'll use it in a sentence. Obummer and his socialist progressives want to ban all firearms to facilitate their progression to communism. How's that?

You are 100 per cent right Sir.
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Old 11-03-2012, 19:52   #220
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The people in charge do not want crossover voting. They want blind loyalty as a result of wedge issues. "YOU HAVE TO VOTE FOR ME BECAUSE IF THE OTHER GUY GETS IN HE IS GOING TO BLAH BLAH BLAH." We vote for the guy to protect our issue, then forget about what he is really doing once he gets in. And that is the way they want it.
We are being played. And it isn't going to change.


Quote:
Originally Posted by WarCry View Post
The problem is, you're using the political-right's definition of a liberal.

Liberal means that you're in the "live and let live" category. The reason guns come into it is because some see it as a way to not "live and let live" but rather "make you do what I want." I disagree with that view, but it's what a lot see.

Gay rights. Right to choose. These are things that LIBERALS are saying the government should stay out of, while the CONSERVATIVE, small-government types are trying to legislate away. And, yes, liberals do believe in social programs to help those who need help. But the GOAL (granted, it's a failing system right not) isn't to make people dependent on the government, it's to give a safety net until they get back on their feet.

For MOST people - politicians or not, liberal or conservative - guns just ARE NOT that big of an issue. If all else was equal, that might be the deciding vote. Obviously there's not going to be that many that agree with me on this point, since this is a GUN FORUM, but the truth is, it's a pretty fringe issue that doesn't enter into most peoples thoughts when voting.


Anyone wants some political pointers? Here it is:

For those on the RIGHT: Change your platform to support marriage equality and support the legalization (and regulation, like alcohol) of marijuana.

For those on the LEFT: Support programs like drug-screenings for welfare and ID requirements for voting (and make non-drivers' license IDs free).

Those changes to party platforms would generate MASSIVE amounts of cross-over voting.
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Old 11-10-2012, 23:41   #221
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Please, they are not liberals. They prefer to be called progressives. Here I'll use it in a sentence. Obummer and his socialist progressives want to ban all firearms to facilitate their progression to communism. How's that?
That's a good point. I never really thought of it that way. I guess there is a difference between liberals and progressives. It just seems to me liberals embrace the progressive mindset because they know most progressives in charge will likely give them what they want.

You wanna know how I see communists like Barack Obama and others....well I see them as favoring criminals, because if you don't give criminals what they want, they get violent and/or demanding. Law abiding citizens and honest people won't loot or riot if they don't have their way, and the government can just take take take from us and they won't have to deal with any drama. They see people like us who want our rights and the fair share we have earned, as a nuisance, as "halting progress". But how much are we going to let them take is what I want to know. I personally already think the government takes more than enough money out of my check (regardless how anyone sees it, Obama's 2nd term is very likely to include tax increases on EVERYONE. Obamacare will include at least 7 new tax increases on the middle class), so I do not think they need to take more.

And there is no doubt in my mind at this point that the Progressive Democrats aka Communists in Training, want nothing more than to disarm us. Just remember one thing.....the first generation to be disarmed will likely be the last armed generation in this country. I'll be damned if I am looked at in history as one of those who sat back and let that happen.

Last edited by Chris Brines; 11-10-2012 at 23:47..
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Old 11-11-2012, 00:20   #222
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One thing I can not wrap my mind around (because honestly, idk if I'm just on the "fringes" of society, but to me the 2nd Amendment was the biggest issue in this election. Economy is F'd and I don't really trust either party with it. All I know is the future is unpredictable and the last thing I need is my government telling me I can not have means to defend myself if all hell breaks loose when the economy collapses), is how liberals, well, Democrats, who are strongly pro gun, can vote for Obama or any democrat, knowing that he and other Democrats have openly announced their intentions of violating the 2nd Amendment.

I mean Feinstein already said just 2 days ago she fully intends to introduce a bill banning all "assault weapons", pistol grips, and magazines holding more than 10 rounds. Obama has openly announced his support for the UN Arms Trade Treaty just a few days ago. And he has already appointed 2 anti gun SCOTUS justices, who came within 1 vote of stripping us of our right to bear arms completely, and there will be 3 or 4 more seats to fill in the coming years.

Do Democrats still truly believe their candidates are not anti gun? Or do they just not care? I can't figure it out, to be honest with you. All I hear is about Romney's AWB, well Romney is gone, and honestly his AWB paled in comparison to Obama's Illinois Senator voting record, and his intentions for the 2nd Amendment in the not so distant future. Am I misinterpreting this or something? Because I know there are quite a few very pro gun far left democratic liberals, and I just can not understand how they can support someone who favors gun control to such a great extent.
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Old 11-11-2012, 01:11   #223
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Republicans and conservatives, by and large, oppose gun restrictions, but the Republican Party is out of power for the foreseeable future. Fact of life. Our gun rights hinge on what those Liberals do with the reins of power. All is not lost, though, because an astounding number of liberal Democrats such as me have more power to influence politicians than all the fulminating NRA press releases and threats combined. Example: last year a candidate for office was seeking my support and started blathering about recent legislation opening gun ownership, "My God, it's horrible!" And I explained that I was a life member of the NRA and a concealed carry holder and a serious shooter (12,000 rounds per annum) and if she expected my support she had better revise her stand on guns. And it disappeared from her campaign literature.

In short, every politician I know would sell his/her soul for a vote or a buck. They all have adopted "elected official" as a career track and they gotta have support. It's us gun-toting liberals who have the drag to keep their grubby fingers off 2A, and the more of us there are, the safer our guns.

My suggestion is to pick out some liberal guy or gal and invite them to go shoot. You might get a surprise because some of us shoot real good. The target audience, though, is the ones who have never fired a gun before. I've never met man or woman who didn't have a barrel of fun at the range and come away with an adjusted attitude. Education on guns is the key.

Now I have to go slap a new MagPul butt on my AR.
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Old 11-11-2012, 01:41   #224
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Now that I've read the rest of the thread, I think I can safely say I'm a hardcore liberal and hardcore gun owner. Also ancient - back in 1968 I was at a cocktail party in DC and spent most of the evening arguing against Sen. Joe Tydings on gun control. Didn't move him an inch but he lost his seat by sponsoring the firearms registration act. Take my word for it, there are some serious hardcore liberals who are also shooters. We just either join forums and don't talk our politics or visit forums, see that everybody despises us, and never go back. When an elected official gets a call from supporters who express a strong opinion, they listen. The NRA has limited power over Democrats because over the years they have become a Republican organization. Nothing wrong with that but as they say in politics, "you dance with the one what brung you."

And over the next four years I'm going to be watching out for an assault weapons ban. I see that issue as low hanging fruit but its way down the list. One more mass shooting, though, and it will be front burner stuff, and watch out. And I'm going to keep writing checks to Democrats because when they get my call I want them to pick up the phone.
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Old 11-11-2012, 05:25   #225
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Impossible...everybody knows only Republicans can be pro-gun and only Democrats can be pro-choice.

Oh, wait...I'm both, so where does that leave me?
Bi and very confused.........!
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