Is This a Pro-Life Statement?

Trew2Life · 10-13-2012, 17:40

"In the event the child is determined to be physiologically, genetically or chromosomally abnormal, the decision to abort or not to abort is to be made by the intended parents. In such a case the surrogate agrees to abort, or not to abort, in accordance with the intended parents' decision."

I thought the Romney's were supposed to be pro-life? The language used in this 'Gestational Carrier Agreement' between Tagg Romney and the surrogate mother isn't 'pro-life' language.

This is the last thing the GOP nominee needs with less than a month to the election.

G36's Rule · 10-13-2012, 17:43

What office is Tagg running for?

tsmo1066 · 10-13-2012, 17:48

Yes, that's a pro-life statement. Most people who identify themselves as 'pro-life' DO, in fact, support abortions in limited circumstances, such as immediate risk to the mother's health, serious genetic defect, rape or incest, etc.

Only the absolutists at the radical fringes of the argument believe in either "no abortions-PERIOD", or "unlimited abortion on demand, even partial birth abortions during the eighth month".

Like it or not, most of America, to include most Republicans AND Democrats, are more moderate than those at the ragged fringes.

Jonesee · 10-13-2012, 17:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by G36's Rule

What office is Tagg running for?

Please read the article. Mitt paid for the surrogate contract.

And the language is not pro-life language.

I've said it before. Mitt is not a man of strong guiding principles.

tsmo1066 · 10-13-2012, 17:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonesee

And the language is not pro-life language.

That's your private opinion, but it isn't shared by the majority of those who identify themselves as 'pro-life'.

G36's Rule · 10-13-2012, 17:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonesee

Please read the article. Mitt paid for the surrogate contract.

And the language is not pro-life language.

I've said it before. Mitt is not a man of strong guiding principles.

Who signed the contract?

RustyL · 10-13-2012, 17:55

O can't use this against him if that is what you are worried about. O is good with killing a viable livable child through a botched abortion.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trew2Life

"In the event the child is determined to be physiologically, genetically or chromosomally abnormal, the decision to abort or not to abort is to be made by the intended parents. In such a case the surrogate agrees to abort, or not to abort, in accordance with the intended parents' decision."

I thought the Romney's were supposed to be pro-life? The language used in this 'Gestational Carrier Agreement' between Tagg Romney and the surrogate mother isn't 'pro-life' language.

This is the last thing the GOP nominee needs with less than a month to the election.

Jonesee · 10-13-2012, 17:58

The language is not pro-life. The centrists may accept it but no one that is part of the pro-life movement will accept. Nor would the Catholic Church.

Spin it as you wish. But the language is not pro-life.

The language specifically allows abortions.

Jonesee · 10-13-2012, 18:02

Mitts campaign staff did not deny it. Their stance is it was an oversight.

tsmo1066 · 10-13-2012, 18:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonesee

The language is not pro-life. The centrists may accept it but no one that is part of the pro-life movement will accept. Nor would the Catholic Church.

Spin it as you wish. But the language is not pro-life.

The language specifically allows abortions.

Wrong again. 51% of all Americans identify themselves as "pro-life" (Gallup). That does not mean that 51% of all Americans agree that abortions should NEVER be acceptible, even in cases of rape, incest, serious genetic defect or immediate risk to the mother's life.

You are taking the viewpoint of pro-life ACTIVISTS and trying to extrapolate that to everyone else who opposes 'abortion on demand'. That's like taking PETA's viewpoint on animals and trying to apply it to everyone who identifies themselves as being an animal lover.

Jonesee · 10-13-2012, 18:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by tsmo1066

Wrong again. 51% of all Americans identify themselves as "pro-life" (Gallup). That does not mean that 51% of all Americans agree that abortions should NEVER be acceptible, even in cases of rape, incest, serious genetic defect or immediate risk to the mother's life.

You are taking the viewpoint of pro-life ACTIVISTS and trying to extrapolate that to everyone else who opposes 'abortion on demand'. That's like taking PETA's viewpoint on animals and trying to apply it to everyone who identifies themselves as being an animal lover.

You are so wrong about me.
I am firmly pro-choice. But I work with contracts very day. The contract overrides all else and all other intentions of the parties.

The contract specifically allows abortions. That won't square with the right to lifers and the Catholics and evangelical supporters within the party.

My point is Romney does not have strong unwavering principles on key issues.

Flying-Dutchman · 10-13-2012, 18:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trew2Life

This is the last thing the GOP nominee needs with less than a month to the election.

Thank you for your concern about Romney’s campaign but Obama is an extreme pro-abortion politician.

Mitt Romney is so squeaky clean they have to really dig to find something.

We would be in much better shape if they placed that kind of effort into Obama’s past. We cannot even get someone to leak his Columbia transcripts like Bush’s grades were leaked.

As for Abortion; 55,000,000 abortions since Roe V Wade is a disgrace but it is not a Federal issue and therefore not an issue Romney needs to address. The States should handle health and welfare.

January 1st 2013 is the fiscal cliff. We have big worries especially with do-nothing Obama.

G36's Rule · 10-13-2012, 18:09

And the contract says the family has the right to make the choice. Nothing there says they have to abort.

Cali-Glock · 10-13-2012, 18:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by tsmo1066

Yes, that's a pro-life statement. Most people who identify themselves as 'pro-life' DO, in fact, support abortions in limited circumstances, such as immediate risk to the mother's health, serious genetic defect, rape or incest, etc.

Only the absolutists at the radical fringes of the argument believe in either "no abortions-PERIOD", or "unlimited abortion on demand, even partial birth abortions during the eighth month".

Like it or not, most of America, to include most Republicans AND Democrats, are more moderate than those at the ragged fringes.

Patently false.

tsmo1066 · 10-13-2012, 18:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonesee

You are so wrong about me.
I am firmly pro-choice. But I work with contracts very day. The contract overrides all else and all other intentions of the parties.

The contract specifically allows abortions. That won't square with the right to lifers and the Catholics and evangelical supporters within the party.

My point is Romney does not have strong unwavering principles on key issues.

The contract allows abortion in the case of serious genetic defect or abnormality.

Most "pro-life" people would agree with that stance, just as most would agree with abortion in the event of a risk to the mother's life, or in cases of rape, etc.

Being 'pro-life' doesn't mean no abortions EVER...unless you're an activist at the radical fringes of the argument. The 51% of Americans who identify as "pro-life" aren't on those radical fringes, just as the vast majority of "pro-choice" Americans do, in fact, oppose many forms of abortion, such as late-term, partial-birth abortions, etc.

tsmo1066 · 10-13-2012, 18:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cali-Glock

Patently false.

So you are saying that 51% of all Americans oppose abortion in ALL cases, with ZERO exceptions?

That's Malarkey (to use Joe Biden's term).

Jonesee · 10-13-2012, 18:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by G36's Rule

And the contract says the family has the right to make the choice. Nothing there says they have to abort.

Correct. Abortion is contractually allowed. See we agree.

So an anti abortion presidential candidate paid to contract for "services" that allowed an abortion.
(as an "oversight")

And he also banned assault weapons in Mass. But really is a 2nd amendment supporter... (I know, another oversight)

And he also created the healthcare plan that Obama used as a pattern for Obamacare. (He didn't mean that either, another oversight)

He may be better than O, but..
He isn't a principled man.

G36's Rule · 10-13-2012, 18:17

This whole thing is asinine. Mitt didn't sign the contract, and the contract merely states a right if certain conditions are present.

Nobody but a loon would try to attach any significance to it or try to tie Mitt to it.

G36's Rule · 10-13-2012, 18:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonesee

Correct. Abortion is contractually allowed. See we agree.

So you agree it is meaningless and not tied to Mitt?

tsmo1066 · 10-13-2012, 18:25

This whole smear attack is like trying to claim that someone isn't a Christian if they believe that killing is acceptible in cases of self-defense because the Ten Commandments say "Thou Shalt Not Kill"

This contract allows for abortion only under very specific circumstances - circumstances that even most people who identify themselves as 'pro-life' would agree with.

Lots of desperation and fear in this attack...but no substance.

Jonesee · 10-13-2012, 18:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by G36's Rule

So you agree it is meaningless and not tied to Mitt?

The article said he paid for it.

The campaign did not deny it. They would have denied it if they could have.

I think dad helped son out, like any good businessman he wanted to make sure he was getting a quality product and put it in the contract.

I would too. Really I would.

I've stirred this GNG topic enough. I will leave it the pros here now.

Flying-Dutchman · 10-13-2012, 18:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonesee

The contract specifically allows abortions. That won't square with the right to lifers and the Catholics and evangelical supporters within the party.

My point is Romney does not have strong unwavering principles on key issues.

And Obama changed his stance on Gay Marriage.

The Rev. Billy Graham just endorsed Romney so he is OK with the Evangelicals.

The Democrats would like to distract you with the old divisive issues like Abortion while the Country crashes and burns.

Social issues are not Romney’s pet projects. He wants to fix the County.

Romney is the hardworking “grownup” who wants to fix the economy; let’s give him a chance for 4 years and see what happens. We know what is happening with Obama.

***Gallium*** · 10-13-2012, 18:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jonesee

The language is not pro-life. The centrists may accept it but no one that is part of the pro-life movement will accept. Nor would the Catholic Church.

Spin it as you wish. But the language is not pro-life.

The language specifically allows abortions.

I know there are a lot of Catholics in the world, but really, in the grand scheme of things, what rational person joins hands with an organization that has

systematically created an environment where YOUNG BOYS are sexually molested for decades, maybe even centuries
Said it is "ok" for GAY PROSTITUTES ONLY to use condoms (current Pope)
For eons (and up to the later part of the 20th century) refused to apologize for putting Galileo on trial (apology issued in 1992), only about 170years after they lifted the ban on Galileo's Dialogue

I am pro-life. I don't believe in taking the lives of other people, but you can bet your bottom nut-dollar if someone is trying to take my life, or rape/kidnap my kid I have no reservations about ending theirs.

Likewise, if my unborn child had (the worst most severe form of) spina bifida, I would have few, if any reservations on terminating that pregnancy.

Fortunately, you don't speak for an entire nation, or for all conservatives, or even for all Christians.

Spiffums · 10-13-2012, 18:48

Most "Pro-Life" people are against abortion as a form of birth control. As a limited medical procedure, it is accessible in our modern age.

And why do you care what Mitt does? Abortion is between you and GOD. The procedure should be available and you make the choice.......and you live with the fall out from that.

frank4570 · 10-13-2012, 18:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by tsmo1066

Like it or not, most of America, to include most Republicans AND Democrats, are more moderate than those at the ragged fringes.

Quoted for truth.