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Old 10-08-2012, 17:03   #51
GLWyandotte
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I wonder how many people fall for that drivel? America has so many Autistic children because there are codes for it that doctors can use to bill insurance companies. Even the literature from support groups credits improved diagnostics for the huge increase in reported cases.
Well, yeah.
100 years ago everyone died of manic exhaustion, consumption or bad air.
We now know these causes of death have a real name, not a lumped in catch all.
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Old 10-08-2012, 17:04   #52
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The title is misleading. I was in the second grade when the U.S. started vaccinating for Polio. A lot of people my age grew up with braces on their legs so they could walk and had corrective to make both of their legs the same length. The afflicted limb was always smaller and weaker than the other one. There were people who spent most of their childhood and all their adult lives in iron lungs. Due to the vaccinations, you don't see that any more. We may have overdone it, but in general, vaccinations are a good thing.

A number of my pre-school friends cought Polio and never returned to the neighborhood.

They did work.
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Old 10-08-2012, 17:07   #53
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http://www.parade.com/health/2012/10...-vaccines.html
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Old 10-08-2012, 17:08   #54
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Originally Posted by series1811 View Post
There are risks in every medical procedure, but I agree that vaccinations are a pretty good bet overall.

I remember polio kids, and getting my sugar cube when I was young, and I am glad I did.
Mine had LSD on it.
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Old 10-08-2012, 18:17   #55
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No one individual is indispensable to mankind. Certainly a handful of people have made great impacts on mankind's history, but who's to say that if they hadn't existed, the world would have stopped? Or that no one else after them would have picked up what they did.
That could all be true but it isnt. What is...is.

I am not nearly as worried about who could have done what as I am your desire to decide which humans are worthy to live and which are not. That is the key topic based on what you put on the table.
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Old 10-08-2012, 18:50   #56
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Vaccinations protect populations and civilizations. Individuals suffer ill effects sometimes. Beats walking around behind a waggon yelling "Bring out your dead".
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Old 10-08-2012, 19:08   #57
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That could all be true but it isnt. What is...is.

I am not nearly as worried about who could have done what as I am your desire to decide which humans are worthy to live and which are not. That is the key topic based on what you put on the table.
Which individual who lives or dies is up to g-d. I'm not saying I have the right to say who should be vaccinated or not. I'm saying that as a population, MDs now-a-days over prescribe medication. Why? Because you can't be sued for prescribing a medication.
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Old 10-08-2012, 19:15   #58
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Which individual who lives or dies is up to g-d. I'm not saying I have the right to say who should be vaccinated or not. I'm saying that as a population, MDs now-a-days over prescribe medication. Why? Because you can't be sued for prescribing a medication.
Focus. Lets hit the key issue here.

You said:

Quote:
Unfortunately, not every child is meant to survive to adulthood. Darwin's theory of Survival of the Fittest should not be interfered with.
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Whenever you get mad as hell about it all, grab your rifle and head outside. If you are the only one there...it's not time yet

I cross my heart and hope not to die. Swallow evil, ride the sky. Lose myself in a crowded room. You fool, you fool, it will be here soon

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Old 10-08-2012, 19:15   #59
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Which individual who lives or dies is up to g-d. I'm not saying I have the right to say who should be vaccinated or not. I'm saying that as a population, MDs now-a-days over prescribe medication. Why? Because you can't be sued for prescribing a medication.
Living and dying is up to who, exactly?
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Old 10-08-2012, 19:21   #60
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Living and dying is up to nature.
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Sounds like he has nothing left but be a monkey's uncle. It's not like he's got a monkey's manhood left.

And thank YOU for being perfect, all the time, every time. Go forth and reproduce. We need more of you.
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Old 10-08-2012, 19:26   #61
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Living and dying is up to nature.
Yes. Just like the biggest momma bear keeps her cubs from getting eaten...so we have developed pharmaceuticals and surgical technology to keep our kids from dying from a number of things. How is that any different from you using a tool for self defense?

Until something supernatural happens...EVERYTHING is natural. Smart is just as natural as strong.
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In the world to come, each of us will be called to account for all the good things G-d put on earth which we refused to enjoy. ~ The Babylonian Talmud

Whenever you get mad as hell about it all, grab your rifle and head outside. If you are the only one there...it's not time yet

I cross my heart and hope not to die. Swallow evil, ride the sky. Lose myself in a crowded room. You fool, you fool, it will be here soon

Last edited by Rabbi; 10-08-2012 at 19:28..
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Old 10-08-2012, 19:28   #62
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Living and dying is up to nature.
A minute ago it was god. And then it was Darwin. Now it's nature.

Make up your mind.
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Old 10-08-2012, 19:44   #63
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You're saying, let's use man made science to keep the playing field level.

I'm saying, let's use nature to level the playing field.

Man made science is here to stay. OK, I get that. But the human body doesn't change that quickly. Diseases that you get will kill you, or, if you survive it, makes you stronger (and you pass that on to your children). Yes, this sounds like a line from an Arnold Schwarzengger movie, but it's true.
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And thank YOU for being perfect, all the time, every time. Go forth and reproduce. We need more of you.
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Old 10-08-2012, 19:45   #64
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Originally Posted by Patchman View Post
You're saying, let's use man made science to keep the playing field level.

I'm saying, let's use nature to level the playing field.

Man made science is here to stay. OK, I get that. But the human body doesn't change that quickly. Diseases that you get will kill you, or, if you survive it, makes you stronger (and you pass that on to your children). Yes, this sounds like a line from an Arnold Schwarzengger movie, but it's true.
Well, hard to argue with someone with your extensive medical credentials.
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Old 10-08-2012, 19:48   #65
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A minute ago it was god. And then it was Darwin. Now it's nature.

Make up your mind.
If you do, or don't, believe in god, that your thing.

"Darwin" is a shorthand for saying nature's "survival of the fittest" theory. Whether you want to link nature with god, that's up to you.
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Sounds like he has nothing left but be a monkey's uncle. It's not like he's got a monkey's manhood left.

And thank YOU for being perfect, all the time, every time. Go forth and reproduce. We need more of you.
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Old 10-08-2012, 19:49   #66
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What blind stupidity.

Think about the world today without vaccines against:

Smallpox (really the argument ends right here)
Polio
Tetanus
Diphtheria
Pertussis
Etc.
A lot less people, which wouldn't have been a bad thing.
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Old 10-08-2012, 19:51   #67
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Well, hard to argue with someone with your extensive medical credentials.
I have no medical credentials. I only have life experience.

So what are your credentials that says vaccinations are best for mankind? And that no other opinions need apply?
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Sounds like he has nothing left but be a monkey's uncle. It's not like he's got a monkey's manhood left.

And thank YOU for being perfect, all the time, every time. Go forth and reproduce. We need more of you.
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Old 10-08-2012, 19:51   #68
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Living and dying is up to nature.
It most certainly is not. HH
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Old 10-08-2012, 19:53   #69
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Which individual who lives or dies is up to g-d.
Do you carry a weapon?

Why?

You weren't born with it. Maybe you shouldn't defend yourself with it. Maybe if you can't defend yourself with your fists, you don't deserve to live. Maybe you should leave it up to God.

See how ridiculous that sounds?

We evolved brains and hands and technology to help us survive in the world. Medicine is just another one of those tools.
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Old 10-08-2012, 19:56   #70
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Do you carry a weapon?

Why?

You weren't born with it. Maybe you shouldn't defend yourself with it. Maybe if you can't defend yourself with your fists, you don't deserve to live. Maybe you should leave it up to God.

See how ridiculous that sounds?

We evolved brains and hands and technology to help us survive in the world. Medicine is just another one of those tools.
Don't argue with him, don't you know he has life experience?!








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Old 10-08-2012, 20:04   #71
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Originally Posted by devildog2067 View Post
Do you carry a weapon?

Why?

You weren't born with it. Maybe you shouldn't defend yourself with it. Maybe if you can't defend yourself with your fists, you don't deserve to live. Maybe you should leave it up to God.

See how ridiculous that sounds?

We evolved brains and hands and technology to help us survive in the world. Medicine is just another one of those tools.

OK. you have a gun, and your opponent has a gun. Who lives and who dies is dependent on what?
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Sounds like he has nothing left but be a monkey's uncle. It's not like he's got a monkey's manhood left.

And thank YOU for being perfect, all the time, every time. Go forth and reproduce. We need more of you.
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Old 10-08-2012, 20:19   #72
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You're saying, let's use man made science to keep the playing field level.

I'm saying, let's use nature to level the playing field.

Man made science is here to stay. OK, I get that. But the human body doesn't change that quickly. Diseases that you get will kill you, or, if you survive it, makes you stronger (and you pass that on to your children). Yes, this sounds like a line from an Arnold Schwarzengger movie, but it's true.
A monkey will use a stick to get ants out of a tree. Would you argue that this is nature, or would you argue that this "monkey-made technology" is allowing the monkey to get more food than it should naturally have?

The same thing with a bird crafting a nest. The bird knows how to build a sometimes complex structure for the betterment of its offspring.

Next, an ant hill with its maze of tunnels and dedicated egg rooms.

Modern medicine is simply our stick, nest, or ant hill. It is the culmination of our current ability to safeguard our species against danger based on our natural evolution.

You discuss survival of the fittest as if the only thing that matters is strength. Which is more fit to survive, the strong man who only knows how to hold a club or the asthmatic who can't run but knows how to make a musket and can mix black powder?

In the real world, wisdom and cunning will always win over strength or physical constitution. This goes back even to times when humanity was in a very clear "state of nature".

Sun tzu knew this. Atilla knew this. When Napoleon forgot this, he marched into Russia.
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Old 10-08-2012, 20:20   #73
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Originally Posted by Patchman View Post
You're saying, let's use man made science to keep the playing field level.

I'm saying, let's use nature to level the playing field.

Man made science is here to stay. OK, I get that. But the human body doesn't change that quickly. Diseases that you get will kill you, or, if you survive it, makes you stronger (and you pass that on to your children). Yes, this sounds like a line from an Arnold Schwarzengger movie, but it's true.
1) It's not Arnold, it's Nietzsche.

2) Do you eat food made with preservatives? Packaged in plastic? Canned? Refrigerated? Cooked with any of that sciencey fire? Seems to me that if you find some road kill or a mushroom, you should eat it. Then, if you die, that's what god/nature/Darwin intended. Classifying, cooking, and preserving food all smack of artificially avoiding the natural and good process of either dying off because you can't eat poison or passing on your superior, creator-endowed, genetically-capable digestive system to your progeny.
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Old 10-08-2012, 20:21   #74
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OK. you have a gun, and your opponent has a gun. Who lives and who dies is dependent on what?
Since you're giving guns to both people, I'll go ahead and say that we both shoot each other in the gut. One of us goes to a level 2 trauma center and the other to some homeopathic practitioner who spends his days pushing a book against vaccines on his website.

Who lives and who dies? Why do you pick the one you pick?
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Old 10-08-2012, 20:23   #75
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1) It's not Arnold, it's Nietzsche.

2) Do you eat food made with preservatives? Packaged in plastic? Canned? Refrigerated? Cooked with any of that sciencey fire? Seems to me that if you find some road kill or a mushroom, you should eat it. Then, if you die, that's what god/nature/Darwin intended. Classifying, cooking, and preserving food all smack of artificially avoiding the natural and good process of either dying off because you can't eat poison or passing on your superior, creator-endowed, genetically-capable digestive system to your progeny.
Lol... Next he's going to tell us Steven Segal proclaimed God is dead, and that he killed him with a roundhouse kick.
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