How about some new divisions?

pistolcompetitor · 10-02-2012, 08:14

I sent this e-mail to glock.us but I'm wondering if anyone's shot with something other than their strong, two-hand grip. Anyone tried, one hand, weak hand shooting, or even mirror image? Obviously it's not to win the match, but to challenge yourself with your shooting skills.

Would be nice, though for GSSF to create these divisions, so that people can see how they do against others who choose to do it the same way. The only way to do a weak hand division is that the person will have had to have shot a regular division, so that GSSF can know the difference. Everybody wins though-- more fun, more range time, a little more $ for GSSF. More time for the RO's, but I'm always appreciative of that FWIW.

S.Kargoh · 10-02-2012, 08:33

Glock Shoot, One Handed, GSSF WA 2012 - YouTube

Done it one handed with strong hand (vid above ,Bremerton match 21012, master stock score 117.xx )

And two handed with weak hand (portland 2011 comp div).

Don At PC · 10-02-2012, 15:30

I would be totally against your suggestion for GSSF. My reasons are:
1. Too many folks already who do NOT know the basic safe handling of a weapon.
2. Too many folks already who do NOT know how handle or manipulate a weapon.

I worked the recent Conyers Match and I observed/corrected folks who:
1. Just did not want to wear eye protection on the active range.
2. Pulled their weapon out of their range bag well behind the sign-in table and then proceeded to walk up to the line with their weapon in hand like it was a piece of candy being offered to everyone.
3. Folks who didn't know how to lock the slide open, didn't know how to take a mag out, didn't know they couldn't load 15 rounds in the gun and shoot all 15.

Let me also state that these were not KIDS learning to shoot, they were adults ranging from mid 20's to late 60's. Until folks shooting GSSF Matches show more responsibility for Basic SAFE gun handling and the coarse rules which are located almost everywhere we do not need any additional accidents waiting for a place to happen. I love shooting GSSF and work several matches every year but in the last couple years I have seen an increase of too many folks who jjust don't belong in a competition with several hundred other competitors with a deadly weapon in their possession. I know we have a lot of new shooters who have to learn but knowledge of Basic Safety should be First before they compete.

Don

mike g35 · 10-02-2012, 15:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don At PC

I would be totally against your suggestion for GSSF. My reasons are:
1. Too many folks already who do NOT know the basic safe handling of a weapon.
2. Too many folks already who do NOT know how handle or manipulate a weapon.

I worked the recent Conyers Match and I observed/corrected folks who:
1. Just did not want to wear eye protection on the active range.
2. Pulled their weapon out of their range bag well behind the sign-in table and then proceeded to walk up to the line with their weapon in hand like it was a piece of candy being offered to everyone.
3. Folks who didn't know how to lock the slide open, didn't know how to take a mag out, didn't know they couldn't load 15 rounds in the gun and shoot all 15.

Let me also state that these were not KIDS learning to shoot, they were adults ranging from mid 20's to late 60's. Until folks shooting GSSF Matches show more responsibility for Basic SAFE gun handling and the coarse rules which are located almost everywhere we do not need any additional accidents waiting for a place to happen. I love shooting GSSF and work several matches every year but in the last couple years I have seen an increase of too many folks who jjust don't belong in a competition with several hundred other competitors with a deadly weapon in their possession. I know we have a lot of new shooters who have to learn but knowledge of Basic Safety should be First before they compete.

Don

^^^ This. Well said Don.

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unclebob · 10-02-2012, 16:00

To add what Don wrote. We also had one that did not even know in what direction to put the magazine in the gun. No it was not nerves.
Also had one individual even after repeated warnings to watch his direction of point the muzzle. Turned to me and said it wasn’t loaded.

ron59 · 10-02-2012, 16:05

Let's add some other new divisions, I have a few suggestions too:

1. Shooting while balancing a pickle on your head
2. Shooting while drinking a shot of J.D. between strings of fire
3. Standing on one leg while wearing a pink tu tu

Nah, let's just stick with what GSSF has, they make good sense to me.

S.Kargoh · 10-02-2012, 16:08

Safety is paramount. Everyone is responsible for safety-- beginners, other competitors, range officials.

This does not change regardless of number of hands used.

The end.

ede · 10-02-2012, 16:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by ron59

Let's add some other new divisions, I have a few suggestions too:

1. Shooting while balancing a pickle on your head
2. Shooting while drinking a shot of J.D. between strings of fire
3. Standing on one leg while wearing a pink tu tu

Nah, let's just stick with what GSSF has, they make good sense to me.

Ron's it's guys like you that stick to the "that's the way we always did it" line. You need to be a little more progressive thinking.
I'd like to see a division where the shooter needs to run 3 miles and then step up to the line and shoot. I bet that would cut down on entries and wait times to shoot.

ron59 · 10-02-2012, 17:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by ede

Ron's it's guys like you that stick to the "that's the way we always did it" line. You need to be a little more progressive thinking.
I'd like to see a division where the shooter needs to run 3 miles and then step up to the line and shoot. I bet that would cut down on entries and wait times to shoot.

I like your thinking Ed.

kyglockshooter 2.0 · 10-02-2012, 19:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don At PC

I would be totally against your suggestion for GSSF. My reasons are:
1. Too many folks already who do NOT know the basic safe handling of a weapon.
2. Too many folks already who do NOT know how handle or manipulate a weapon.

I worked the recent Conyers Match and I observed/corrected folks who:
1. Just did not want to wear eye protection on the active range.
2. Pulled their weapon out of their range bag well behind the sign-in table and then proceeded to walk up to the line with their weapon in hand like it was a piece of candy being offered to everyone.
3. Folks who didn't know how to lock the slide open, didn't know how to take a mag out, didn't know they couldn't load 15 rounds in the gun and shoot all 15.

Let me also state that these were not KIDS learning to shoot, they were adults ranging from mid 20's to late 60's. Until folks shooting GSSF Matches show more responsibility for Basic SAFE gun handling and the coarse rules which are located almost everywhere we do not need any additional accidents waiting for a place to happen. I love shooting GSSF and work several matches every year but in the last couple years I have seen an increase of too many folks who jjust don't belong in a competition with several hundred other competitors with a deadly weapon in their possession. I know we have a lot of new shooters who have to learn but knowledge of Basic Safety should be First before they compete.

Don

I agree with your statement, at a match i was observing a guy with these cool sights and I was asking about them and he pulls the gun out of the holster (in the waiting area right after he got off the line) and handed it to his friend to walk to the truck to show me. I was unsure how to inform them of the massive rules they were breaking since im 20 and the gentlemen were my elders.

Also there was another incident where guys were clearly handling ammunition in the safe weapon zone. which again is a big no no. someone informed them of the no ammunition and they basically ignored him from my understanding. I'm not calling anyone out i let it remain anonymous for a reason, but these rules are there for yours and my safety. While you may not take your safety seriously, I do not take mine lightly if you cant follow the rules please do not attend. If your willing to do what is asked of you please attend.

S.Kargoh · 10-02-2012, 22:18

So these safety concerns don't happen with two handed divisions? Itseema like the stories you've shared have nothing to do with firing grip. Rather general gun handling.

lethal tupperwa · 10-03-2012, 06:49

just a BAD idea.

give it up.

youngann · 10-03-2012, 07:53

Personally, I'd like to see Heavy Metal go to 7 rounds in the gun. They could still keep major Sub as it is, but having the larger heavy guns with 7 rounds would sure save some money on ammo.

unclebob · 10-03-2012, 08:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by youngann

Personally, I'd like to see Heavy Metal go to 7 rounds in the gun. They could still keep major Sub as it is, but having the larger heavy guns with 7 rounds would sure save some money on ammo.

No thanks. That is the reason I don't like and most of the time do not shoot Maj Sub.

S.Kargoh · 10-03-2012, 08:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by lethal tupperwa

just a BAD idea.

give it up.

Let me rephrase the question.

Is unsafe gunhandling ok, as long as the divisions are normal two-handed firing grip?

pistolcompetitor · 10-03-2012, 08:51

Nice video, S. Kargoh. I'm obviously with you on this one.

legacy38 · 10-03-2012, 08:52

I would prefer not to see division dilution.

youngann · 10-03-2012, 09:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by unclebob

No thanks. That is the reason I don't like and most of the time do not shoot Maj Sub.

Yeah, it is scary facing 6 plates when you know you only have 7 rounds in the gun.

lethal tupperwa · 10-03-2012, 09:32

in the "old" days we only had 6

youngann · 10-03-2012, 09:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by lethal tupperwa

in the "old" days we only had 6

Yikes...I'm glad I'm not 'quite' that old.

Noponer · 10-03-2012, 10:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by lethal tupperwa

in the "old" days we only had 6

In the really "old" days (June 27, 1992 - first match), there were only 4 divisions:

Civilian Amateur, Civilian-L (17 longslide), Out-of-Region, & Unlimited. The last 2 allowed civilian & law enforcement shooters. (Total of 160 entries)

Of course, there were no 34's or subcompacts then & no .40 caliber Glocks at all! The .45 GAP was far from being born then.

S.Kargoh · 10-03-2012, 10:58

As far as division dilution goes, I'd make the arguement that competition and master stock are diluted versions of amciv (for a lot of shooters ).

They often are just used as warmups or even referred to as throw aways.

I'd say do away with competition, and master stock, and guardian.

Just have a stock division (any stock glock) open to masters and amateur and guardian, with prize awards to top3 of each of those.

Then the sub compact, heavy metal, unlimited. (eliminate major sub, they suck :D )

4 divisions. Boom.

One handed would make 5 (you can use any hand you want).
At least a one handed division would actually be different. As it is now, many people use just one gun and technique over several divisions. That seems pretty diluted to me.

Bonus points for safe handling.

Justin1911 · 10-03-2012, 13:11

How bout a "major sub weak hand only" division. GSSF would have to pay me $25 to shoot that!

Justin1911 · 10-03-2012, 13:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noponer

In the really "old" days (June 27, 1992 - first match), there were only 4 divisions:

.

Dang you guys are old! I was 12 then

S.Kargoh · 10-03-2012, 13:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by youngann

Yeah, it is scary facing 6 plates when you know you only have 7 rounds in the gun.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justin1911

How bout a "major sub weak hand only" division. GSSF would have to pay me $25 to shoot that!

With plates shaped and sized as barn walls.