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Old 10-03-2012, 11:49   #101
tsmo1066
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Originally Posted by Gareth68 View Post
So, I assume y'all are on the list then?
"Assume" whatever you choose. My children are none of your business.
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Old 10-03-2012, 11:53   #102
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If you read the article that you linked to you will see that your characterization of "America as a whole" is false -- Republicans (and those leaning Republican) have become more pro-life.

The source of the shift in abortion views is clear in the Gallup Values and Beliefs survey. The percentage of Republicans (including independents who lean Republican) calling themselves "pro-life" rose by 10 points over the past year, from 60% to 70%, while there has been essentially no change in the views of Democrats and Democratic leaners.


-ArtificialGrape
They are simply mentioning the source for the shift. That doesn't change the fact that the majority of ALL Americans are pro-life.

It wasn't a "Republicans Only" or "Democrats Only" poll, but a nationwide opinion poll, and it found that the majority of Americans, to include a majority of all American WOMEN, oppose abortion.
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Old 10-03-2012, 12:15   #103
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It's tough to support the death penalty and be anti-choice.

That seems like a tough conflict.
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Old 10-03-2012, 12:38   #104
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Originally Posted by Restless28 View Post
It's tough to support the death penalty and be anti-choice.

That seems like a tough conflict.
Ridiculous.

The two have nothing to do with each other.
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Old 10-03-2012, 12:54   #105
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Originally Posted by tsmo1066 View Post
Meanwhile, The Democrats insist that girls too young to even get a tattoo legally should be able to have invasive medical procedures done to them without their parent's knowledge or consent.

Don't forget that the Dems seem to claim that they know better than you about every other aspect of your life
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Old 10-03-2012, 13:00   #106
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Don't forget that the Dems seem to claim that they know better than you about every other aspect of your life
I thought that's the Pubs too?

You get one coming and the other one going.

Vote Libertarian!!!
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Old 10-03-2012, 13:22   #107
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Originally Posted by Restless28 View Post
It's tough to support the death penalty and be anti-choice.

That seems like a tough conflict.
How so?

A convicted murderer who is executed has committed grievous atrocities on others in order to earn his/her fate.

What has an unborn child done, except get conceived?
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Old 10-03-2012, 13:45   #108
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Originally Posted by KalashniKEV View Post
Your argument is rather poorly thought out.

So long as cars are on the road, there are going to be accidents.

So long as people have genitals, they are going to have sex.

I'm talking about the remedy for adverse consequences.



You sound like you'd be a proponent of FGM...
And if people try to avoid accidents by driving safe speeds, following the rules of the road (ie taking responsibility for following their own safety) there would be fewer accidents and fewer deaths and injuries from car wrecks. People generally do try to avoid accidents so the number of serious wrecks is very low.

If people who do not want children use birth control, then there will be fewer unwanted pregnancies. Those children that do get conceived could easily be given to adopting families - assuming the biological parents do not want them.

FGM? I don't know what that is.
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Old 10-03-2012, 14:51   #109
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Rape is simple to handle:

Victim carries baby until term and puts baby up for adoption if she chooses. Rapist pays for 100% of the pregnant woman's care. If he doesn't have enough money, his organs are harvested and sold to make up the difference.
So then you would be ok with a law that said is a man or a boy is sexually assualted, then the man/get 20 lbs of silicone implanted near his gut for 9 months, hormone injections that cause body regulations issues, and then right before it is all removed, he had to have an 8 lb watermelon shoved up his rectum?

This happens starting the day after the crime. Maybe the criminal is never even prosecuted, but the boy/man has to put of with this.

Obviously, you dont get that carrying a baby and having a baby is not the most comfortable and pain free process for a woman.

But you are OK with making a woman go through these changes with her body.

I will tell you what. I believe you have the some right to tell a woman what happens after she is raped the day I see you post a video of you putting an 8lb watermelon in your rectum or passing a lemon from your bladder through your urethra. Then you might have an idea what they go through. Of course, it would probably help if you got to experience a man raping you so you know exactly how the woman feels.
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Old 10-03-2012, 16:28   #110
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I'm pro choice. But I would be perfectly ok with setting a time limit beyond which abortions are not permitted. And I'll bet MOST americans would find that pretty reasonable and acceptable. Only the extremists on the left and the right would have a problem with it. But neither of them will stop banging that drum, so it stays in the spotlight with everybody all worked up, and both sides using it as a wedge issue in elections.
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Old 10-03-2012, 16:50   #111
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I honestly don't care much about the whole thing. I could understand getting rid of the late term stuff. On the other hand if my wife or daughter was at risk I'd save the ones I already know and love over the new one, who wouldn't?
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Old 10-03-2012, 17:06   #112
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It ceases to be "their bodies" as soon as another life form starts multiplying cells inside.
Save The Tapeworms! HH
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Old 10-03-2012, 17:24   #113
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I honestly don't care much about the whole thing. I could understand getting rid of the late term stuff. On the other hand if my wife or daughter was at risk I'd save the ones I already know and love over the new one, who wouldn't?
My grandmother didn't and my uncle is around because of it. She was fine as well. There are very few where the baby threatens the mother these days.
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Old 10-03-2012, 17:25   #114
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I am fairly certain the "rape kit" in the ER includes RU486 equivalent to end any possible pregnancy.

Regardless, once the fetus is past 6 month it is viable and a life. To abort it is to kill the baby for what its father did.
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Old 10-03-2012, 17:53   #115
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Originally Posted by DanaT View Post
So then you would be ok with a law that said is a man or a boy is sexually assualted, then the man/get 20 lbs of silicone implanted near his gut for 9 months, hormone injections that cause body regulations issues, and then right before it is all removed, he had to have an 8 lb watermelon shoved up his rectum?

This happens starting the day after the crime. Maybe the criminal is never even prosecuted, but the boy/man has to put of with this.

Obviously, you dont get that carrying a baby and having a baby is not the most comfortable and pain free process for a woman.

But you are OK with making a woman go through these changes with her body.

I will tell you what. I believe you have the some right to tell a woman what happens after she is raped the day I see you post a video of you putting an 8lb watermelon in your rectum or passing a lemon from your bladder through your urethra. Then you might have an idea what they go through. Of course, it would probably help if you got to experience a man raping you so you know exactly how the woman feels.
congrats on what is probably the stupidest analogy I have ever seen posted on GT......and that's saying something.

ETA: SC Tiger's suggestion was retarded, but I think that went without saying.

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Old 10-03-2012, 18:07   #116
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Originally Posted by HollowHead View Post
Save The Tapeworms! HH
Do you honestly equate an unborn human child, even a fetus, to be nothing more than the equivalent of a tapeworm?

I'm assuming that was sarcasm at work, right?
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Old 10-04-2012, 11:26   #117
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... Obviously, you dont get that carrying a baby and having a baby is not the most comfortable and pain free process for a woman...
Eve's fault.
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Old 10-04-2012, 11:40   #118
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congrats on what is probably the stupidest analogy I have ever seen posted on GT......and that's saying something.

ETA: SC Tiger's suggestion was retarded, but I think that went without saying.
Really?

You think is a man was told, by a woman, that he was going to experience what a woman does during pregnancy and childbirth after a crime was committed against him, he would agree that forcing him, because of the woman's religious views, to go through that is acceptable.

How would you feel if my religious views dictated that you get a grapefruit shoved up your rectum? That is about the size of a baby's head?
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Old 10-04-2012, 11:42   #119
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Eve's fault.
That is stupid to even say. How do you then place blame that all female mammals go through this? Is that Eve's fault too?
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Old 10-04-2012, 12:09   #120
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My grandmother didn't and my uncle is around because of it. She was fine as well. There are very few where the baby threatens the mother these days.
The very few is kind of the point, a blanket ban leaves no room for the rare case.

There was a recent case where a 12 yr old was taken to the er for stomach pain, turned out that it was from a pregnancy after being molested by mom's boyfriend. In that case the unborn may be an innocent child but so was the "mother" I can't see a child having to go through with that birth.

It's a complicated issue.
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Old 10-04-2012, 12:18   #121
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Originally Posted by DanaT View Post
So then you would be ok with a law that said is a man or a boy is sexually assualted, then the man/get 20 lbs of silicone implanted near his gut for 9 months, hormone injections that cause body regulations issues, and then right before it is all removed, he had to have an 8 lb watermelon shoved up his rectum?

This happens starting the day after the crime. Maybe the criminal is never even prosecuted, but the boy/man has to put of with this.

Obviously, you dont get that carrying a baby and having a baby is not the most comfortable and pain free process for a woman.

But you are OK with making a woman go through these changes with her body.

I will tell you what. I believe you have the some right to tell a woman what happens after she is raped the day I see you post a video of you putting an 8lb watermelon in your rectum or passing a lemon from your bladder through your urethra. Then you might have an idea what they go through. Of course, it would probably help if you got to experience a man raping you so you know exactly how the woman feels.
Ok, I admit that was a sort of off-the-cuff idea (and thankfully I'm not the one that would have to come up with the solution) and not the best (even "retarted" as was stated above). There are already other solutions out there (that "plan b" pill that Kalashnikev was talking about, for one) much better than what I suggested.

I would like to keep the idea of gutting the rapist and selling his organs, with the money going to the rape victim though, if I may.

But even leaving abortion in as an option for rape victims and medical necessity (which I stated in another post I would not be opposed to), what gets me is when women get pregnant due to their own actions (ie not rape) and think of an abortion just because the child is not "convenient." It may be one of those areas where principles have to give way a little to common sense.

Edit to Add - I stated this right below the section you quoted - fifth paragraph (counting the single sentences). It starts with the statement "In reality".

All that said, your analogy is at least as stupid as my idea.

In any case - nothing will change so not really worth talking about. In the past 32 years there have been 20 years of Republican presidents (the side that would typically be in favor of a ban) and nothing has happened, and it won't.
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Old 10-04-2012, 12:25   #122
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But even leaving abortion in as an option for rape victims and medical necessity (which I stated in another post I would not be opposed to), what gets me is when women get pregnant due to their own actions (ie not rape) and think of an abortion just because the child is not "convenient." It may be one of those areas where principles have to give way a little to common sense.
I dont believe in abortion as birth control.

That said, I also believe that in some cases (i.e. rape and medical necessity) it is not immoral.

But what you must realize is that for many (especially men) there is no middle ground. It is black and white. But I promise if men had to go through what women do with a pregnancy, I highly suspect they may view it differently.
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Old 10-04-2012, 12:31   #123
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Either way, the president cant ban abortion.
Geez, would you quit with the logic.

So a prez. that favors partial birth abortion and saddles the next generation with a massive amount of debt IS for women's rights? Uh huh.......

You know if Clinton ran again, I think the e card slogan would apply much better. He likes lady parts.
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Old 10-04-2012, 12:37   #124
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I dont believe in abortion as birth control.
Sadly, the majority that get abortions don't think like that.

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That said, I also believe that in some cases (i.e. rape and medical necessity) it is not immoral.
That is a pretty small percentage actually. Even though I'm a Christian conservative, I'll go along with you in theory.

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But what you must realize is that for many (especially men) there is no middle ground. It is black and white. But I promise if men had to go through what women do with a pregnancy, I highly suspect they may view it differently.
Well many men pass kidney stones so let us call it even. I know it sounds simplistic but if women don't wanna get pregnant, they could keep their legs closed or pay for contraceptives.
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Old 10-04-2012, 12:42   #125
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I dont believe in abortion as birth control.

That said, I also believe that in some cases (i.e. rape and medical necessity) it is not immoral.
I agree on these stances.

Unfortunately, dbcooper brings up a case where an abortion might be the only real answer. I would imagine a 12-year-old would be terrified to tell her parents what happened. Holy God that is just terrible.
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