GlockTalk.com
Home Forums Classifieds Blogs Today's Posts Search Social Groups



  
SIGN-UP
Notices

Glock Talk
Welcome To The Glock Talk Forums.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-06-2012, 12:13   #26
certifiedfunds
Platinum Membership
Tewwowist
 
certifiedfunds's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NYC
Posts: 39,716


Quote:
Originally Posted by Hines57 View Post
True, saved a bunch of money. Besides it was a family project. My daughter helped wire it and got her electrical merit badge for Girl Scouts. I let her do the 15 & 20 amp breakers.

The Okie Corral



.
Kids are good for checking to see if wires are hot or not.
certifiedfunds is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 14:31   #27
stevemc
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 464
Just to be sure, you may want to go back with a screw driver and re-tighten all connections. The main neutral in particular is notorious for being loose if not re-torqued. BTW we normally would have a #6 ground also. Maybe I'm not seeing it. Did you ground the meter?
stevemc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 14:35   #28
CitizenOfDreams
Senior Member
 
CitizenOfDreams's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 8,117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hines57 View Post
The Okie Corral
Is it me, or is all your neutral current (the bus on the right) going through a single 12AWG piece of bare wire? And where exactly are the neutral and the ground, are they tied together some place ahead of the panel?

Any professional electricians here on the board?
CitizenOfDreams is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 15:44   #29
stevemc
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 464
I'm a supervising electrician in Chicago and have been in business for 18 years. The neutral caries the difference between the phases. For example if the black has a load of 15 amps. and the red is 10 then the neutral is carrying 5 for that circuit. The wire you are referring to is larger than 12. I haven't seen a setup like this before though, looks like a #8. The manufacturer probably sells a bar that would tie the two busses together, and may be a better way of doing it. The bar on the right may be meant for grounding only. Can't really tell from the picture, but is looks to be isolated from the panel with plastic standoffs. We also don't use the SE type of cable in the picture, which is basically unprotected from the transformer to the main breaker (unless there is a breaker on the meter fitting). Panel should have come with a bonding screw also, but can't really see it. Still waiting to hear where the #6 ground (min. for 200A. panel) is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by certifiedfunds View Post
Kids are good for checking to see if wires are hot or not.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CitizenOfDreams View Post
Is it me, or is all your neutral current (the bus on the right) going through a single 12AWG piece of bare wire? And where exactly are the neutral and the ground, are they tied together some place ahead of the panel?

Any professional electricians here on the board?
stevemc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 16:24   #30
Hines57
Simple Member
 
Hines57's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: On the road
Posts: 7,656
Quote:
Originally Posted by certifiedfunds View Post
Kids are good for checking to see if wires are hot or not.
Little whiner said that is shocks more than the cattle prod. Bet she won't touch that bare wire again.
__________________
Sic Semper Tyrannis
In time, what's deserved always gets served
You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do.
Hines57 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 16:30   #31
Hines57
Simple Member
 
Hines57's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: On the road
Posts: 7,656
I added the 2nd bus on the right, trying to keep it cleaned up inside. The wire connecting the 2 blocks is the same as I used for the ground (far left side, buried behind the other). Don't remember if it was 6 or 8. Neither bus was bonded, ran screws through the each into the cabinet.
__________________
Sic Semper Tyrannis
In time, what's deserved always gets served
You can safely assume that you've created God in your own image when it turns out that God hates all the same people you do.
Hines57 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 16:30   #32
certifiedfunds
Platinum Membership
Tewwowist
 
certifiedfunds's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NYC
Posts: 39,716


Quote:
Originally Posted by Hines57 View Post
Little whiner said that is shocks more than the cattle prod. Bet she won't touch that bare wire again.
She'll thank you when she's older.
certifiedfunds is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 16:38   #33
CitizenOfDreams
Senior Member
 
CitizenOfDreams's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 8,117
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevemc View Post
I'm a supervising electrician in Chicago and have been in business for 18 years. The neutral caries the difference between the phases. For example if the black has a load of 15 amps. and the red is 10 then the neutral is carrying 5 for that circuit. The wire you are referring to is larger than 12. I haven't seen a setup like this before though, looks like a #8.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but common sense tells me that the neutral wire should be rated for the worst case scenario (one phase loaded to maximum current, the other phase completely unloaded). The bare wire in question might be #8, but it's still visibly smaller than the red and black phase wires coming to the panel.

Last edited by CitizenOfDreams; 10-06-2012 at 16:40..
CitizenOfDreams is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2012, 18:31   #34
Bren
NRA Life Member
 
Bren's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 33,434
Quote:
Originally Posted by devildog2067 View Post
You understand the wisdom of that statement the first time you work on something that someone else wired up who never learned those rules.
It reminded me of seeing band in New Orleans, in a shady venue where the guy doing the wiring knew it didn't matter which side of the outlet you connected the white or black to. He didn't choose the same side on the outlet for the bass amp and the outlet for the PA. They took the bass player away in an ambulance - end of show. Surprisingly, not that uncommon.
__________________
Open carry activists are to gun rights what the Westboro Baptist Church is to free speech.

Last edited by Bren; 10-06-2012 at 18:31..
Bren is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2012, 05:44   #35
stevemc
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 464
Quote:
Originally Posted by CitizenOfDreams View Post
Correct me if I'm wrong, but common sense tells me that the neutral wire should be rated for the worst case scenario (one phase loaded to maximum current, the other phase completely unloaded). The bare wire in question might be #8, but it's still visibly smaller than the red and black phase wires coming to the panel.
I agree with you. Downsizing the neutral is not a good idea and there is really no reason to do it. That just brings up a whole other discussion. We all believe that working on our own house is our right, but when I see a homemade solution like this it bothers me. What other cost saving actions were taken? I don't believe there is a #6 ground (there I said it). Proper bonding is REQUIRED. Is the meter and drop adequate for 200 amps? Are future owners of this house in harms way without knowing it? Would you be comfortable knowing a girl scout wired the circuits in your house for a patch? Without trying to sound crass, this is a good example of why there are electrical inspectors and laws regarding service upgrades. I see this more and more and it scares the **** out of me.
stevemc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-09-2012, 15:25   #36
larry_minn
Silver Membership
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 17,805
Quote:
Originally Posted by stevemc View Post
I agree with you. Downsizing the neutral is not a good idea and there is really no reason to do it. That just brings up a whole other discussion. We all believe that working on our own house is our right, but when I see a homemade solution like this it bothers me. What other cost saving actions were taken? I don't believe there is a #6 ground (there I said it). Proper bonding is REQUIRED. Is the meter and drop adequate for 200 amps? Are future owners of this house in harms way without knowing it? Would you be comfortable knowing a girl scout wired the circuits in your house for a patch? Without trying to sound crass, this is a good example of why there are electrical inspectors and laws regarding service upgrades. I see this more and more and it scares the **** out of me.

Its a good idea to have a basic knowledge, pick up a "wireing simplified" type book... Its not rocket science. Inspectors are a nice "thought" They stick tester in GFI outlets, other outlets they can easily see, sign off. (On initial I did mention I was moving water heater as too close, some other changes so he did have idea I had SOME clue as to code. I tend to over build stuff. I don't use 14 guage. 12 and 10 for circuts (110-120)
Important thing to know. Electricity is composed of billions of little things that race thru wires. They are just LOOKING for chance to jump off and bite a person, and or build up heat and start a fire. So you contain them well and don't give them a chance to escape. They don't merge will either. If you run them 6 lanes wide going in and only 4 lanes going back there will be traffic accidents, some will try short cuts. :0////
larry_minn is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump




All times are GMT -6. The time now is 17:39.



Homepage
FAQ
Forums
Calendar
Advertise
Gallery
GT Wiki
GT Blogs
Social Groups
Classifieds


Users Currently Online: 1,294
381 Members
913 Guests

Most users ever online: 2,244
Nov 11, 2013 at 11:42