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Old 09-24-2012, 06:38   #1
RussP
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Debate on concealed weapons at college campuses heats up...

Debate on concealed weapons at college campuses heats up at Georgia Tech

This has been said many times, many places by many people...
Quote:
Concealed weapons holders are significantly less likely to be arrested or convicted of crimes than the remainder of the population. However, the second they step on to the campus the argument is made they become irresponsible -- and can no longer carry their weapons safely.
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Old 09-24-2012, 19:54   #2
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That debate is going to heat up here as well, when the legislature rolls into town in January. We almost got campus carry last year, and every analysis I see says the 2013 Texas legislature willl be noticeably more conservative than 2011, which gives me hope. (Campus carry is already legal as long as you avoid buildings and school-sponsored events.)
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Old 09-24-2012, 20:29   #3
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Same old argument as CCW laws.

"The blood will run in the streets", which doesn't happen.

The schools are bastions for liberals. I know of no group more insecure and frightened of society in general.

Just like politics. Lies are said, and the fact they are lies are ignored.

Remember these same people that don't trust students to carry arms, introduce them at commencement as this countries future leaders.
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Old 09-24-2012, 21:54   #4
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I really wish they would just give it up already. Liberalism on campus is just as dangerous. Maybe in a different way but it does some real damage.

Not to mention, the Liberal's passive way of dealing with violent offenders isn't going to save anyone's life anytime soon. They need to understand that the right of self preservation and self defense are rights given to us by the creator and not by man.

As such, nobody has any right to restrict that right period.
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Old 09-25-2012, 07:37   #5
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The sad thing is libs will not realize their theory of gun control will not work until they have outlawed every gun.....then they will still blame it on someone.

The old saying still applies: "as long as there are libs, there will gun control".

This reminds me of the debate over religion vs no religion. As long as there are humans, this debate will be around, regardless of which way you believe.



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Old 09-26-2012, 19:57   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RussP View Post
Debate on concealed weapons at college campuses heats up at Georgia Tech

This has been said many times, many places by many people...
There are far too many liberals on college campuses
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Old 09-27-2012, 19:06   #7
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I'd feel a lot safer if I could carry on campus.
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Old 09-27-2012, 19:24   #8
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This was a big debate at the University Of Utah a couple years ago and has been laid to rest with the State laws on Concealed Carry over-ruling Campus rules.

I believe that should be the correct course of action at any University. It should follow the laws of the state it is in and not try and be an exception because it is a place of learning.

I've carried several times at the U of U, both before and after the debate. My gun didn't behave any different.
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Old 09-28-2012, 08:18   #9
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Originally Posted by SCmasterblaster View Post
There are far too many liberals on college campuses
You realize the root of "liberal" is the same as the word "liberty", right?
Quote:
Originally Posted by UtahIrishman View Post
This was a big debate at the University Of Utah a couple years ago and has been laid to rest with the State laws on Concealed Carry over-ruling Campus rules.

I believe that should be the correct course of action at any University. It should follow the laws of the state it is in and not try and be an exception because it is a place of learning.

I've carried several times at the U of U, both before and after the debate. My gun didn't behave any different.
I disagree. If individual stores and shops can say they don't want it, then so should universities be able to, unless they're public.
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Old 09-28-2012, 08:26   #10
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Here is a recent op-ed in the USAToday supporting campus carry.




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Old 09-28-2012, 10:46   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redbaron007 View Post
The sad thing is libs will not realize their theory of gun control will not work until they have outlawed every gun.....then they will still blame it on something.

The old saying still applies: "as long as there are libs, there will gun control".

This reminds me of the debate over religion vs no religion. As long as there are humans, this debate will be around, regardless of which way you believe.



red
There, fixed it for ya.
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Old 09-28-2012, 11:04   #12
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There, fixed it for ya.
Gracias!




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Old 09-28-2012, 11:08   #13
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You realize the root of "liberal" is the same as the word "liberty", right?
Who the heck cares? What Liberal means nowadays is the political functions that is constantly scheming for ways to enact gun control legislation.
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Old 09-28-2012, 22:12   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by professorpinki View Post
You realize the root of "liberal" is the same as the word "liberty", right?

I disagree. If individual stores and shops can say they don't want it, then so should universities be able to, unless they're public.
The University of Utah in my example is publicly funded.

I have mixed feelings on individual stores and shops that don't want someone carrying. In general though when it comes to private businesses my policy is concealed is concealed until proven otherwise.

Here in Utah all they can do is ask you to leave the premises. Which is fine with me. Though also here in Utah you will find that the majority of people are in favor of concealed carry.

If they find out you are carrying their first response is likely to be "what kind of pistol are you packing" and want to compare notes on how to carry more effectively.
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Old 09-28-2012, 22:43   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCmasterblaster View Post
Who the heck cares? What Liberal means nowadays is the political functions that is constantly scheming for ways to enact gun control legislation.
Apparently, I do. (And so do most actual political scientists.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by UtahIrishman View Post
The University of Utah in my example is publicly funded.

I have mixed feelings on individual stores and shops that don't want someone carrying. In general though when it comes to private businesses my policy is concealed is concealed until proven otherwise.

Here in Utah all they can do is ask you to leave the premises. Which is fine with me. Though also here in Utah you will find that the majority of people are in favor of concealed carry.

If they find out you are carrying their first response is likely to be "what kind of pistol are you packing" and want to compare notes on how to carry more effectively.
Oh I know about U of U being publicly funded and the like. I'm also aware of the dangers of vesting every little decision that universities make with the state's legislature, and removing that necessary gap altogether. However, in your post you weren't specific enough for me to agree wholeheartedly with you... and I think that private institutions of higher learning should be able to enforce their own reasonable standards of behavior, while state schools should be more in accordance with their own state laws and local customs regarding such issues as firearms.

I also tend to think that state school dorm rooms should come with a safe that's designed to be reprogram-able.
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Old 09-28-2012, 23:08   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by professorpinki View Post
....

....
I also tend to think that state school dorm rooms should come with a safe that's designed to be reprogram-able.
I don't see the necessity for this. To me the responsibility for the safety of any weapon lies with the owner of that weapon. If the owner of the weapon feels a safe is necessary then he or she should buy their own safe.

Besides, who will be paying for said safe? If it's a public institution ultimately the tax-payer.
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Old 09-29-2012, 09:08   #17
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While you can talk about liberals, etc. - don't forget the powerful influence of liability. Schools are told that if they allow carry and:

1. a carrier goes nuts
2. a carrier nails an innocent in a critical incident

they have massive exposure. It is more financially than paying off after a rampage as they are not responsible for the actions of the shooter (unless you can find that they explicitly ignored warnings).

That's behind lots of the opposition as well as the above mentioned ideology.

Some schools will offer first aid courses to be ready for emergencies. Some won't because if the person who took the school's course puts the tourniquet around your neck - you (maybe) or your relatives will sue the school. Better for you to bleed out.

Never forget to look for the money besides ideology.

That's why a campus carry law MUST state that no liability can laid on the school for the action of a legal gun carrier during a critical incident.
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Old 09-29-2012, 10:03   #18
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Originally Posted by UtahIrishman View Post
I don't see the necessity for this. To me the responsibility for the safety of any weapon lies with the owner of that weapon. If the owner of the weapon feels a safe is necessary then he or she should buy their own safe.

Besides, who will be paying for said safe? If it's a public institution ultimately the tax-payer.
I wasn't speaking about the weapon per se but the general need given how many crimes I heard about at the campus next door. (Our campus was pretty safe). Also, at my (state-funded) school only about 20%-30% of the money that the school received was from the state. The majority was from alumni donations.

Safes, though, would pretty much be a one-time expense, and they're actually kinda cheap when one thinks of them in that regard, versus the numerous computer labs and the T-3 internet (or better) that always crashes when you need to wikiped- I mean, research - something for a late night project.

Besides, if nothing else, kids could lock up their cell phones and credit cards before they drink so they don't wind up going and buying mail order brides from the Ukraine on a drunken binge.


Quote:
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That's why a campus carry law MUST state that no liability can laid on the school for the action of a legal gun carrier during a critical incident.
Very good point.


The wikipedia snippet was a joke.
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Old 09-30-2012, 07:02   #19
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There was a shooting on the campus I work at last night.

Will at least the faculty be given a choice to defend themselves? Probably not.

I just leave in the daylight hours in the mean time.
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Old 09-30-2012, 10:34   #20
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If you know this area - note that all the plans are for:

1. How the local law responds
2. How to warn those not directly under fire
3. How to handle the aftermath - counseling, keeping the joint running, minimizing liability

There is very little planning for how to deal with the attacker if you are faced with him or her.

Videos suggest fleeing, hiding and fighting.

Fleeing - always a good idea but be aware of being set up for an ambush or bomb on predictable flight paths.

Hiding - might work, has worked for some. Note that some shooters have pushed past barricades and search for folks.

Fighting - usually the charge of the stapler and laptop brigade that might work at close distances or entry ambushes. Not that useful in large room with a skilled and planned shooter with high capacity weapons. There are fantasies of everyone getting organized under fire and becoming the 300 and then charging across an open space for the guy. Sure, but it probably won't happen. Pick the right large theatre or lecture hall and it would be extremely difficult to get to the shooter.

NO mention of using firearms to defend yourself.
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