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Old 09-10-2012, 15:19   #1
porschedog
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Full length guide rods;Yes/No/Maybe?

I've been shooting 1911s for a while but have just recently begun "Accesorizing" or, as my wife puts it "buying presents for my new toy"

I just picked up a Colt Gold Cup and was semi-surprised to note it does not have a full length guide rod. I had added one to a SA Compact a few weeks earlier and it made an accurate gun into an uber accurate hole-punching machine.

The Gold Cup is, as I discovered yesterday, quite impressive at the range. It made one ragged hole out of 15 rounds at 15 yards.


So, while wondering what to add to the latest aqcuisition, I'm looking for feedback on full length guide rods. It's not a carry piece, but rather a range toy. I have a G30 & G36 for social situations.

What say you? Yes? No? Maybe?

And what about S/S barrel bushings? Any benefit beside good looks?

Thanks in advance for your responses and your patience with my questions.
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Old 09-10-2012, 15:27   #2
Glockdude1
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My Springfield Operator works great without the FLGR.

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Old 09-10-2012, 15:39   #3
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I've tried them in the past, no benefit in accuracy. Does add a step
or two to the field strip process. So, IMO, say no to FLGR
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Old 09-10-2012, 16:47   #4
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I do not see any proof that they make a gun shoot any better or any worse.
I prefer a G.I. style over the full length.
If I had to have a full length it would be a two piece over the one piece rod.
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Old 09-10-2012, 16:56   #5
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There's not a shred of evidence that it will make a gun shoot better. Added weight to the front may help to reduce muzzle flip, thus getting back on target faster. But that's doesn't mean it will help to produce tighter group, if shooting from a rest.
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Old 09-10-2012, 17:04   #6
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Well, might as well get an opinion from the other side of the aisle. Just think of this, what modern gun today does NOT come with a full length guide rod?

I personally prefer them. It makes the spring track better. It is very VERY subtle, but can be felt. As for field stripping, get one with a pin hole in it, like the STI, and with just a paper clip, it is actually EASIER to field strip.

Most purists will disagree, but there is a reason they sell so many of them. YMMV.
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Old 09-10-2012, 17:40   #7
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Interesting thread as I am approaching this from the other side currently. My newly acquired TRP Operator (railed) has a FLGR with a pin hole that requires a tool to break down. I would not consider myself a purist but rather more of a pragmatist - I would prefer not to rely on a tool to field strip.

The bull barrel on the TRP will not accommodate a barrel bushing so I don't have the simple option of just swapping out the parts to go to a GI setup.

I am considering this http://www.dawsonprecision.com/Produ...29E-1320694367

I have not been able to find any bad press/experiences so far with this product.

I am going to shoot the gun for a while and then decide. You can buy a lot of paper clips for $70...

Quote:
Originally Posted by BuckyP View Post
Well, might as well get an opinion from the other side of the aisle. Just think of this, what modern gun today does NOT come with a full length guide rod?

I personally prefer them. It makes the spring track better. It is very VERY subtle, but can be felt. As for field stripping, get one with a pin hole in it, like the STI, and with just a paper clip, it is actually EASIER to field strip.

Most purists will disagree, but there is a reason they sell so many of them. YMMV.
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Old 09-10-2012, 18:01   #8
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No paper clip or tool needed to break down the TRP Operator.
Retract slide, remove slide stop, remove slide. Install is reverse of removal.
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Old 09-10-2012, 18:20   #9
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Thanks for the feedback
The FLGR fronWilsons arrived today, but it is still in the bag
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Old 09-10-2012, 18:23   #10
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Maybe.

I have both set-ups for my Springfield. I bought the GI set-up because I HATE the tear-down with the FLGR. It's a serious PITA. I like handling the pistol with the GI set-up much more.

After trying 100+ with the GI set-up, I experience much more stable and consistent slide return with the FLGR, smoother recoil. It's as if I can feel the slide bouncing on the rails a lot more without the FLGR; tighter guns may not have this issue. Felt/perceived muzzle flip is reduced, certainly because of the added weight up front but also I feel because of the (effective) 3rd rail on the gun. The consistency of action in theory, to me, could mean fewer malfunctions and better wear resistance.

YMMV; others here with many more years of 1911 shooting may disagree, but I think it's nice to have both set-ups.
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Old 09-10-2012, 18:33   #11
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My "Modern", Les Baer P11 with 1.5" @ 50 yrds. Came with a target that measured 1.300' 10 Shots @ 50 So I'm inclined to say a FLGR Is not needed. Actually has nothing to do with accuracy.
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Old 09-10-2012, 18:34   #12
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that works well until you want to clean the barrel, guide rod and slide properly - then you need a tool...

Quote:
Originally Posted by faawrenchbndr View Post
No paper clip or tool needed to break down the TRP Operator.
Retract slide, remove slide stop, remove slide. Install is reverse of removal.
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Old 09-10-2012, 18:36   #13
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I've seen full length guide rods make 1911's malfunction when they were perfectly reliable with standard USGI parts.

I was at Gunsite a while back taking the API 250 course and there was a woman there who had a 1911 her husband set up for her and one of his improvements was a full length guide rod. It kept jamming. Ted Yost came up from the gunsmithy to fix it. He pulled the full length guide rod and installed a stock guide rod and plunger. The gun ran like a champ all day. Her husband came by at the end of the day (he was in another class) and threw a fit about taking the guide rod off the gun and put it back in. Sure enough the gun chokes on the first magazine. Regardless he wouldn't let her put it back to stock configuration and she had a miserable time with that gun.
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Old 09-10-2012, 18:39   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keryou1960 View Post
My "Modern", Les Baer P11 with 1.5" @ 50 yrds. Came with a target that measured 1.300' 10 Shots @ 50 So I'm inclined to say a FLGR Is not needed. Actually has nothing to do with accuracy.

If folks anything about how a 1911 locks up and goes into battery they would know the guide rod has NOTHING to do with accuracy.
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Old 09-10-2012, 18:48   #15
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Had several from Wilson over the years, was never impressed but the cool factor made me think I did something right. I'm older and wiser now.
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Old 09-10-2012, 18:55   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BuckyP View Post
Well, might as well get an opinion from the other side of the aisle. Just think of this, what modern gun today does NOT come with a full length guide rod?

I personally prefer them. It makes the spring track better. It is very VERY subtle, but can be felt. As for field stripping, get one with a pin hole in it, like the STI, and with just a paper clip, it is actually EASIER to field strip.

Most purists will disagree, but there is a reason they sell so many of them. YMMV.
Well they are still making auto pistols with hooked trigger guards too.



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Old 09-10-2012, 19:07   #17
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I wouldn't bother with a FLGR.
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Old 09-10-2012, 19:08   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by countrygun View Post
Well they are still making auto pistols with hooked trigger guards too.



Not a functional part.

Newer guns typically don't have them. (M&P, Caracal, FNS)

Older design guns don't change them to maintain holster compatibility. Just ask Beretta fans how that worked out with the 90-Two.
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Old 09-10-2012, 20:58   #19
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I hate having to use a tool to break down my TRP so I swapped the FLGR to a GI setup. No go for the guide rods for me
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Old 09-10-2012, 22:39   #20
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I have at least two 1911's built for or by me every year.
I have never included a FLGR in the build specs. It's a solution to a problem that does not exist.
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Old 09-10-2012, 23:01   #21
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One piece rods like on Kimbers are tolerable, since you can still push in the plug to field strip in the normal fashion. However the two piece rods are a pain in the butt. You can't depress the plug without removing the front half of the rod, which requires an hex key. Also they tend to come loose over time as well. GI setup works fine and is easier to field strip.
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Old 09-11-2012, 02:24   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rkrk View Post
that works well until you want to clean the barrel, guide rod and slide properly - then you need a tool...
Nope,........only need a left hand & a right thumb!
Try it, I've done it about a hundred times!
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Old 09-11-2012, 05:00   #23
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The question that begs to be asked:

"What is it for?"

Marketing 101:

"First you must convince the customer that he needs it...for whatever reason...and then sell it to him."

So, all too often the answer to the question seems to be.

"To sell!"

The FLGR aids in extraction and feeding. It extracts money from one pocket feeds it into another.
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Old 09-11-2012, 05:13   #24
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On looks alone I say yay...

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Old 09-11-2012, 05:58   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by faawrenchbndr View Post
I've tried them in the past, no benefit in accuracy. Does add a step
or two to the field strip process. So, IMO, say no to FLGR
This
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