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Old 06-20-2012, 02:09   #1
wallacefan
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New brass

Do i have to resize new brass?
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Old 06-20-2012, 03:20   #2
wallacefan
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Ok was going to reload tomorrow but..

reading about using titegroup as a newbie is bad
i have a chargemaster combo loading 9mm 147 speer tmj
on a rcbs single stage with new win brass
should i wait and get new powder?
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Old 06-20-2012, 04:07   #3
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I always do to make sure everything is correct. I have found a few cases misshaped and 2 without primer thru holes ( from primer to charge).
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Old 06-20-2012, 05:32   #4
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As part of your normal case inspection process, you should check your casings before you start reloading. The same as DWARREN123, I to have purchased new casings and found defective ones.

You would think that especially with new casings that you most likely paid decent $'s for, you wouldn't have to worry about that.
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Old 06-20-2012, 06:52   #5
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Originally Posted by wallacefan View Post
Ok was going to reload tomorrow but..

reading about using titegroup as a newbie is bad

4.0 gr of WSF is fun to shoot with a 147 gr Montana Gold CMJ loaded to 1.135".

The spec for the 147 gr TMJ-FN from Speer #14 is 3.6 to 4.1 gr WSF 1.130" OAL.

Titegroup is #14 and WSF is #36 on the burn rate chart:
http://www.hodgdon.com/burn-rate.html

In general, slower powders (farther down the list) are somewhat more forgiving than fast powders and are usually recommended. OTOH, I have used Titegroup (fast) and Bullseye (even faster) for 9mm and 700-X (faster yet) for .45 ACP. So the fast powder thing isn't the boogey man in the closet.

But, having shot the WSF loads last week, I am about convinced. I didn't check the loads on a chronograph but if they make 850 fps or so, they will qualify for minor power factor (125,000) should I decide to compete. In any event, they cycle an XD-9 just fine.

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Last edited by F106 Fan; 06-21-2012 at 07:05..
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Old 06-20-2012, 12:00   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wallacefan View Post
Ok was going to reload tomorrow but..

reading about using titegroup as a newbie is bad
i have a chargemaster combo loading 9mm 147 speer tmj
on a rcbs single stage with new win brass
should i wait and get new powder?
I've only been reloading about 3 months but the first powder I ever used was TG - because I had some known good competition reload recipes for it, and because my gun club carries it. I only used about 3/4 lb but never had a single problem on my 650 because I visually check the powder drop AND have a powder check system.

When talking to a couple of fellow IDPA shooters at my club, I found that some of them used VV N320 for similar results. (Basically, competitors are lookng for accurate loads to 35yds max (Bullseye, 50yds), and light recoil for fast recovery.) I bought 1 lb of N320 to try and loved it. It's not quite as fast burning as TG, it's bulkier and fills a 9mil case more than TG seems to, it's lighter gray in color than TG so easier to see in the case, it's relatively clean, and virtually smokeless and flashless. It has every property you would likely want in a powder - except cost and availability. It's sometimes hard to find, and expensive when you do. The bulk of my loads BTW, are with 147 MG CMJs.

I have a ChargeMaster that I recently bought to work up loads. I can easily make 10 loads at a time with very accurate charges. Someone said that the ChargeMaster is not that accurate. I have developed loads down to 3.5gr with it, and checked the ChargeMaster loads against my Brian Enos high-end digital scale and have found them to match exactly. The scales are both very accurate - or they are both off the exact same amount. And I checked both scales with the 50gm and 100gm weights, too. The consistency (ES & SD) with the ChargeMaster 10-rnd strings over my Chrony was somewhat better than with the 650 powder drops.

I use a lot of new Starline brass and because I have a progressive press, just throw them in the casefeeder and run them through every die. I cannot imagine the real need to resize it however. I have yet to find a new Starline case with any manufacturing defect. I did find the Starline sticking to my expander/powder funnel though, so now give them a quick spray of One Shot before throwing them in the casefeeder. Starlne claims the 'sticking' is unique to the Dillon dies.

Last edited by SARDG; 06-20-2012 at 12:04..
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Old 06-20-2012, 12:16   #7
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Drop powder in case. Seat bullet immediately. It's only bad if you overcharge the case.
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Old 06-20-2012, 12:43   #8
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I have run into a few out of spec pieces of new brass, so have always resized (of course with a Turret or Pregressive it's no big deal). 147 gr 9 mm, I always turn to WSF although I would be happy with Unique, too.
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Old 06-21-2012, 00:02   #9
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still you guys have me worried about TG should i go get some other powder before i load
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Old 06-21-2012, 06:25   #10
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You should be able to find enough 9mm brass on the ground that you never have to buy new brass.

9 mm 147g FMJ 3.3g tighgroup 1.130 OAL will work just fine.
Tightgroup does not have the margin of error that a lot of other powders do. It is easier to mess up with a dense powder like tightgroup than a fluffyer powder. So it tends to be safer for a new reloader to use something more forgiving. In the end it is your choice.
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Old 06-21-2012, 07:26   #11
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still you guys have me worried about TG should i go get some other powder before i load

Posts #5 and #6 about cover it. You can use it if you want but most of the long time reloaders would recommend against it for a new reloader. Many would recommend something like Unique or, perhaps, as I suggested in post #5, WSF.

That you have a Chargemaster and are loading on a single stage press means you have every probability of getting just one charge and a proper one at that.

Sometimes it seems like every new reloader that comes over here is trying to use Titegroup. I think they get the recommendation from their LGS and I think the LGS has no idea whatsoever why they are recommending fast powders. I would be willing to bet that they don't even know that there are fast/slow powders.

My guess is that the recommedation is just based on the name. Who wouldn't want a tight group? Notice that N320 is almost never in stock at an LGS. What kind of impression does "N320" make when compared to "Titegroup"? "Bullseye" carries the same connotation. Even I want to hit the bullseye every once in a while.

My recommendation is that you put the Titegroup on the shelf and get a pound of something slower. There will be time to come back to Titegroup later on. Your choice...

Richard
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Old 06-21-2012, 11:35   #12
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called lgs and the have unique for 28 dollars
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Old 06-21-2012, 11:54   #13
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Speer #14 shows 3.8 to 4.3 gr of Unique for your 147 gr TMJ-FN. I would probably start with 4.0 gr.

If you don't already have it, Speer #14 is worth owning.

That price is outrageous - not that there's much to do about it. Powder Valley 1# of Unique it for $15.20.

There's a $27.50 Hazmat fee on shipping powder and primers so if you bought 2# from Powder Valley for $30.40 versus $56 from your LGS, you could just about break even. You would still have to cover the UPS charge so a 4# cannister would be perfect at $57. Or mix in a few thousand primers.

The problem is that 1# of Unique will load 1750 rounds and that might take a long time to shoot. 4# will load 7000 rounds and you don't even know if you'll like Unique.

Just something to keep in mind for later on. Powder Valley is the place to get primers and powder if you want to buy in bulk. When you are just starting out, you are pretty much stuck with the LGS.

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Last edited by F106 Fan; 06-21-2012 at 16:40..
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Old 06-21-2012, 11:57   #14
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thanx headed there now to get it

i have speer 14
and lyman 49
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Old 06-21-2012, 12:19   #15
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thanx headed there now to get it...
I'd have used TiteGroup...

Last edited by SARDG; 06-21-2012 at 12:20..
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Old 06-21-2012, 16:15   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wallacefan View Post
thanx headed there now to get it

i have speer 14
and lyman 49

Richard right on with the load of Unique. I load 4.2gr. of Unique under a Berry's plated 147gr. RN bullet seated to an overall length of 1.150". It's a very soft and super accurate load in my PM9, haven' tried it in my G26 yet.

Start at 4gr's like Richard said and work up slow if you feel you want a little more.
Good Luck
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Old 06-21-2012, 16:37   #17
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i have speer 14
and lyman 49

Doh! You mentioned that before. Write it off to another 'senior moment'. It's happening a lot lately.

Richard
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Old 06-22-2012, 10:15   #18
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Drop powder in case. Seat bullet immediately. It's only bad if you overcharge the case.
Always good advice. This is one of the reasons I love my turret press so much. Only one case at a time is in process at any given time. Everything else on the bench is either a finished cartridge or a raw, unassembled component. Great for a newbie.

Since you are using a chargemaster and a single stage press, Colorado4Wheel's advice is even more important. It would be tempting to load a block of primed cases and then seat the bullets all at once. A better technique would be to keep your empty, primed cases in one loading block. As soon as you drop a charge into one, immediately transfer it to the press and seat/crimp the bullet. The finished cartridge goes into an ammo box. At this time the only powder present on the bench is in your finished cartridges, in a powder container, or in your chargemaster. No open cases have any powder in them. Any time you step away or are distracted, (like when the phone rings), empty whatever case or scale pan you are handling that has powder in it. When you return, or when the distraction has ceased, any cases or powder trays on the bench should be immediately inspected and confirmed empty before you resume.

Little things like that will quickly become life-long habits. If any of the more seasoned reloaders disagree with the above, or have additional tips, please chime in. I am always trying to get better and safer at this great hobby.
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