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Old 05-04-2012, 19:18   #1
Sheepdog689
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LEOSA liability off the reservation

Mas, I posted this on the Cop thread and I didn't even think of asking you. Here's what I posted, what do you think?

I've been doing some research on the LEOSA and what's required for retired officers (2 years to go until the brass ring...but who's counting?) to carry. I came across something that I hadn't really thought about before and it applies to active duty as well as retired LEOs who carry under the LEOSA outside of their jurisdiction.

If I'm carrying out of state (or after I'm retired) I'm not covered by statute or acting in an official capcity so technically I'm (and that means all of us) just a civilian with a gun. I'm waiting to hear back from my insurance agent to find out if my homeowner's and umbrella liability policies would cover me if I'm carrying while out of state (or retired) and I'm forced to use force in a self defense situation.

If you think about it if you do have to use force, even if it's 110% legal and justified, you're still going to get sued. While your agency will pick up the tab for your attorney if you're on duty, are they going to cover you out of state if you're carrying under the LEOSA? If you're retired then you're on your own. Even winning a suit on your own will break the bank after paying for an attorney to represent you so the idea of an insurance policy seems like a good idea.

I found that the NRA has a liability policy that covers off duty and retired LEOs for liability.

Have you looked into your insurance coverage and if so, any recommendations on policies that are available out there? Any other thoughts or comments about the liability issues? Does the Armed Citizen Legal Defense Network offer anything better than something like the NRA insurance?

What are you seeing in your travels when (if) these questions come up?

Thanks
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Old 05-04-2012, 22:38   #2
Mas Ayoob
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Uncharted territory, really, insofar as currently serving officers. Personally, I don't carry department issue guns or ammo unless I'm working for the department. If I was in a shooting out of state, if the department had provided the "death weapon" and/or the ammunition it MIGHT allow plaintiff's counsel to tie the department, and the "deep pockets" of the tax base of the community it serves, into a lawsuit. I'm not putting that kind of blood in the water, because I've been swimming with that kind of shark before.

From all I have learned and can see, the retired officer is indeed on his or her own. I am on staff with Armed Citizens Legal Defense Network, and obviously recommend them, but because of that any comment I made on any other program would be seen as conflict of interest. Therefore, I have to bounce you back to the police think tank at Cop Talk.

Best,
Mas

Last edited by Mas Ayoob; 05-04-2012 at 22:40..
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Old 05-05-2012, 18:25   #3
Sheepdog689
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Thanks Mas, appreciate the input. You pretty much confirmed what I was concerned with....personal firearm while off duty out of jurisdiction or retired....you're on your own.

Is the Legal Defense Network an insurance plan or is it more of a resource to obtain a lawyer and experts for court?
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Old 05-06-2012, 06:38   #4
Mas Ayoob
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Not insurance per se. Their website, www.armedcitizensnetwork.org, will have more answers there than I have room to give here.

best,
Mas
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Old 05-06-2012, 17:14   #5
Sheepdog689
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Gotcha, thanks!
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