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Old 04-09-2012, 07:19   #1
water_daddy
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Suppressed Semi Carbine Platforms

I've researched pistol caliber ARs, HK, Uzi, Highpoints..etc The most promising weapon (IMO) is the fairly new JR Carbine. I'd like the advice and perhaps experience of fellow members before purchasing:

Link: http://www.justrightcarbines.com/JR_..._Products.html

Here's what I've found to be accurate:

1. Nearly compatible with all AR parts (barrel/bolt/handguard not?)
2. Takes Glock mags (now also 1911 model)
3. Easily converts to/from 9mm, 40 S&W, and 45 ACP
4. A threaded barrel version is also being made.
5. Early serial #s had reliability issues....seem to be corrected.
6. Reported to be accurate

Anyone have any caveats or recommendations for other versatile platforms for subsonic suppression and semi-auto fire? Any ideas for a locking bolt mechanism for ultimate sound reduction (does this normally void warranty)? JR carbines seems to listen to the consumer and has been quite responsive in fixing and adding features. Any other desirable features for a suppressed carbine that should be considered?

Thank you!
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Old 04-09-2012, 07:26   #2
MrMurphy
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I'd suggest you do more research.
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Old 04-09-2012, 09:26   #3
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I'd suggest you do more research.
Yup!

There have been some bad reviews on here.
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Old 04-09-2012, 09:49   #4
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What about an AR in .300 blk? The subsonic ammo is really quiet when shot suppressed and you have the option of supersonic ammo if you ever need something with more power (hunting, HD etc).
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Old 04-09-2012, 09:54   #5
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I would question the basic premise of a pistol caliber carbine? What is the point to an AR in a pistol cartridge, when bulk 5.56 is not much more expensive than service pistol ammo?

The entire concept seems like an answer in search of a question.
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Old 04-09-2012, 09:58   #6
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I would question the basic premise of a pistol caliber carbine? What is the point to an AR in a pistol cartridge, when bulk 5.56 is not much more expensive than service pistol ammo?

The entire concept seems like an answer in search of a question.
Wimmins. My wife doesn't like the blast and noise from my AR-15. A 9mm is a good low-recoil, lower noise, but lethal option for her.
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Old 04-09-2012, 10:00   #7
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Wimmins. My wife doesn't like the blast and noise from my AR-15. A 9mm is a good low-recoil, lower noise, but lethal option for her.
Please....

My 70+ year old aunt shot my AR the weekend before last.

Not well, but she shot it!!
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Old 04-09-2012, 10:08   #8
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The pistol caliber carbine has merit for suppressed fire. Pretty easy to get fully auto-like fire rates too. What's not to like?

Mr. Murphy: I'm aware of a jam-o-matic label with the early model, but I think internet rumor has misrepresented the current gun offerings. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but the reliability you are hinting to.....has it not been satisfactorily addressed by the recall? The website lists a serial # range and offers a free upgrade.

Thanks!

Last edited by water_daddy; 04-09-2012 at 10:14..
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Old 04-09-2012, 10:08   #9
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Please....

My 70+ year old aunt shot my AR the weekend before last.

Not well, but she shot it!!
I'm not saying all wimmins, just some wimmins.
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Old 04-09-2012, 10:22   #10
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Originally Posted by M&P15T View Post
Please....

My 70+ year old aunt shot my AR the weekend before last.

Not well, but she shot it!!
There's a huge difference in both blast and volume from a 5.56 or a 9mm AR. If that's the issue, then a 9mm has advantages. A friend of mine recently picked up a Colt 9mm AR, and I was shocked how quiet it was compared to a 16" 5.56 AR.
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Old 04-09-2012, 10:31   #11
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I don't see the point of AR based PCCs. I do see the merit of dedicated ones like the Beretta CX4, which is also a good suppressor platform.

Providing a longer sight radius, a more stable firing platform with optics mounting and magazine/caliber interchange with a sidearm are about the only compelling reasons to use dedicated PCCs.

But the reasons do exist. India just purchased 34,500 MX4 militarized (select fire+30 round magazines) units of the Beretta CX4 9x19mm carbine for their National Police.
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Old 04-09-2012, 10:34   #12
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Originally Posted by M&P15T View Post
I would question the basic premise of a pistol caliber carbine? What is the point to an AR in a pistol cartridge, when bulk 5.56 is not much more expensive than service pistol ammo?

The entire concept seems like an answer in search of a question.
Quieter and less muzzle blast unsuppressed. Much quieter suppressed.

Much cheaper to shoot than .223.(9mm around $200/1000 currently, .223 about $300 or more)

Depending on the gun you can use the same magazines as your handgun.

It can be used at every indoor range. Many indoor ranges don't allow rifle cartridges.

For someone who likes to stockpile ammo, it's easier to deal with fewer calibers.

In fact, it has many advantages over a .223 AR and only two disadvantages, range and power. I'm winning plenty of 3-gun matches out to 200 yards with my 9mm so range isn't an issue to me. Power would only be an issue if I got into a long range firefight which, so far, I've been able to avoid.
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Old 04-09-2012, 10:49   #13
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Originally Posted by Boats View Post
I don't see the point of AR based PCCs. I do see the merit of dedicated ones like the Beretta CX4, which is also a good suppressor platform.

Providing a longer sight radius, a more stable firing platform with optics mounting and magazine/caliber interchange with a sidearm are about the only compelling reasons to use dedicated PCCs.

But the reasons do exist. India just purchased 34,500 MX4 militarized (select fire+30 round magazines) units of the Beretta CX4 9x19mm carbine for their National Police.
I'm already invested in Glock mags, have a multi-cal can to fully use this multi-cal gun, and have trained on M-4/M-16/AR platforms......why is the Beretta better? Has the recall not addressed the bug in the first run of guns?

ETA: Folks I appreciate the input. For some a pistol caliber carbine may not be a good fit....fine, that's not the point of this thread. Anyone have first hand experience with the JR carbine or have a better recomendation? Thanks!

Last edited by water_daddy; 04-09-2012 at 10:53..
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Old 04-09-2012, 11:08   #14
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I have a suppressed 9mm ar with a 5.5 inch barrel and suppressed using an AAC Tirant that fits inside the rail. Works great, pretty quiet with the right ammo.
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Old 04-09-2012, 11:28   #15
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Originally Posted by water_daddy View Post
I'm already invested in Glock mags, have a multi-cal can to fully use this multi-cal gun, and have trained on M-4/M-16/AR platforms......why is the Beretta better? Has the recall not addressed the bug in the first run of guns?

ETA: Folks I appreciate the input. For some a pistol caliber carbine may not be a good fit....fine, that's not the point of this thread. Anyone have first hand experience with the JR carbine or have a better recomendation? Thanks!
I have a Kel Tec sub 2000 it takes Glock 9mm mags. If you can find one they should sell for $300 to $350.
It's fun to shoot and may be a cheaper option.
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Old 04-09-2012, 11:50   #16
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I have a Kel Tec sub 2000 it takes Glock 9mm mags. If you can find one they should sell for $300 to $350.
It's fun to shoot and may be a cheaper option.
I've handled the Keltec subs and wasn't impressed, but I have not shot one. Around here it seems like they more like $400 and by the time you thread it I doubt you have less than $500 invested. For perhaps $100 more (basic package) it seems like a lot more gun and capability.

I appreciate the suggestions. While I haven't been talked out of the JR, I find it interesting that no one has yet to be approving. It makes one wonder if this is the gun to have or just conceptually interesting. Why hasn't any competitors seized on the rapidly expanding suppressed/multi-caliber carbines? Sales are through the roof for suppressors and for tactical carbines, just doesn't seem like suppressed carbines have much of a following for some reason.
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Old 04-09-2012, 12:08   #17
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I've handled the Keltec subs and wasn't impressed, but I have not shot one. Around here it seems like they more like $400 and by the time you thread it I doubt you have less than $500 invested. For perhaps $100 more (basic package) it seems like a lot more gun and capability.

I appreciate the suggestions. While I haven't been talked out of the JR, I find it interesting that no one has yet to be approving. It makes one wonder if this is the gun to have or just conceptually interesting. Why hasn't any competitors seized on the rapidly expanding suppressed/multi-caliber carbines? Sales are through the roof for suppressors and for tactical carbines, just doesn't seem like suppressed carbines have much of a following for some reason.
They do have a following, just in 5.56, .300 Blackout, and other intermediate rifle calibers. Either one of those will drastically out-perform a pistol caliber from a carbine platform, and .300 Blackout can be suppressed very easily when using 22gr subsonic loads.
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Old 04-09-2012, 12:16   #18
water_daddy
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They do have a following, just in 5.56, .300 Blackout, and other intermediate rifle calibers. Either one of those will drastically out-perform a pistol caliber from a carbine platform, and .300 Blackout can be suppressed very easily when using 22gr subsonic loads.
I concur, the 300 Blackout offers the greatest versatility but I can shoot an awful lot of 9-40-45 for what 300 ammo is costing if you can find it. In time I'll jump on board with it
ETA: Subsonic 250grainers (45 Super) will still have more energy and is within .25" trajectory of the 300 Blackout at 100M and the standard 230gr 45 ACP is very similiar to subsonic 300 Blackout.....I think I want suppressed 45s and a 300.

I've never understood suppressed 5.56, it is very tough on cans (especially in a short barrel), sounds awful super sonic and the subs are expensive and not too much different than the much cheaper Aguilla SSS 60gr 22lr.

Last edited by water_daddy; 04-09-2012 at 12:22..
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Old 04-09-2012, 13:43   #19
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Originally Posted by water_daddy View Post
I've handled the Keltec subs and wasn't impressed, but I have not shot one. Around here it seems like they more like $400 and by the time you thread it I doubt you have less than $500 invested. For perhaps $100 more (basic package) it seems like a lot more gun and capability.

I appreciate the suggestions. While I haven't been talked out of the JR, I find it interesting that no one has yet to be approving. It makes one wonder if this is the gun to have or just conceptually interesting. Why hasn't any competitors seized on the rapidly expanding suppressed/multi-caliber carbines? Sales are through the roof for suppressors and for tactical carbines, just doesn't seem like suppressed carbines have much of a following for some reason.
I understand Sub 2000 are not impressive to look at but they work.
Here is a 9mm carbine that Hickok45 reviews. He also has a chapter 2 on you tube. He has some issues with it and at some point the fireing pin breaks.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...009D66302BA9D7

Chapter 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=vcNajSEwmx8
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Last edited by 4 glocks; 04-09-2012 at 13:47..
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Old 04-09-2012, 15:55   #20
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A suppressed 5.56 is viable out to 200-300m, delivers more power, and sounds like a .22.

Anyone who thinks a 5.56 has a lot of flash and blast simply needs more training. That said, a suppressed 5.56, other than a suppressed .22, is about as quiet and blastless as it gets.

I was neither commenting on the reliability or lack of it on the JR. I am not impressed by the build or premise behind it. If i had to go 9mm, it'd be a Colt (only....) in 9mm with good mags on the AR platform, or the Beretta Storm. Not a fan of 9mm carbines, but the Berettas DO work. They also work suppressed.
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